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Stick with a bit or switch to a hackamore??

11K views 10 replies 7 participants last post by  beau159 
#1 ·
I know this question has already been asked, but I wanted to ask about them again :)

I've always ridden my 6 year old mare ( Quarter horse) in an 'O'- ring snaffle. We run barrel patterns and it works okay, but she fights sometimes and has started 'pulling' on the bit when we're warming up. Last summer a friend suggested that I try a hackamore instead. Unfortunately I don't recall what else he mentioned about it but he said Andie ( my girl :wink:) would most likely do better in one. The only hackamore I've tried with her was an old mechanical hackamore I had hanging in my room- just to try it out.

We just walked the barrel pattern but she became annoyed with it after about 20 minutes. Personally I'm not sure about running her in a hackamore and would prefer a different bit but my mom is pushing for a hackamore.

With a bit, She's okay on turns, al little rough sometimes ( we're still working things out on some of the patterns).Speed and Action is tough because sometimes she doesn't slow down when I ask her to and we don't stop in time. Her turn on that pattern is wonderful though and I sometimes think it's me messing up the pattern. Is there a hackamore that's firm enough to keep her in check with out being to hard or some other bit that might help?? I've tried looking it up on my own many times..but I have no clue what I'm looking for and it's a little discouraging :-(. Any suggestions are greatly appreciated!!
 
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#4 ·
my gut feeling whenever someone asks about switching from bit to hackamore because of a bit problem is to recommend people look for the source of the bit problem, particularly if the bit is something like a snaffle bit. This is mainly because if there is an issue with what you are doing with the bit, and simply stuff the horse's head into a hackamore without a reassessment of what you are doing with the reins to begin with you are likely to end up in the same position again, or worse.

As far as what sort of hackamore?, I have never used a mechanical one, I don't know how to use one or why anyone would use one, know nothing about them; so my recommendation would be a traditional hackamore with something like a fairly stiff 3/4 inch RAWHIDE bosal with a RAWHIDE core fitted with a fiadore and mecate of 3/4 inch mane hair. I wouldn't go smaller than a 5/8 inch bosal and 5/8 inch mecate.

Just what to do with it? that's probably too complex to try to describe here, but there are quite a few resources about that you should be able to use and get the hang of it if you have a good foundation to build on (all assuming you don't already know that is, if you do, awesome) if you don't have a lot of experience with riding in general maybe not going the hackamore route would be better.

I had a combination of someone to learn from who was a good hackamore man. and I went out and got the Ed Connell books to work from, and I was already riding day in day out and training quite a few horses when I came to it so already knew how to belt out a reasonably good horse in a snaffle bit, and even then I made plenty of mistakes. The thing I found was that mistakes that I made in a snaffle showed up a lot clearer in a hackamore. I found it a lot easier to make a horse heavy and unresponsive in a hackamore than a snaffle, and I messed the first couple up (took a lot of work but I managed to turn them around and fix a lot of the problems, but they were never as good as they should have been).

Having said that though, with the help of my friend, and practice, the horses I produced once I sorted it out were out of sight compared to the snaffle horses I made before them, so in my opinion, if you are willing to put in the time and effort to learn to do it right it is more than worth it, and will probably make you over all a better horsewoman/man. The Ed Connell books are great, there's a guy called Martin Black kicking around now who has a few DVDs out about it, been wanting to get them for ages and check them out but too I'm too skint, they might be worth a look for you (I have a couple of bosals from him though and they are good) but as always a good person to learn from directly is really the way to go.

The over all process, properly speaking, will require you to have a whole collection of hackamores, I have managed to collect what's probably the bare minimum to produce a bridle horse, about 5 different hackamores, but then I'm an impoverished student and when I did have the money and was doing it every day there was no such thing as an internet store to buy stuff on and the average saddler shop in Australia back then had no idea what a hackamore was so they were tough to find. You don't have to go to those lengths, one or two good quality ones will probably do it if you are just doing general riding.

As far as running barrels in them? No idea, but I have had horses work cattle under some pretty fast conditions and they do fine, don't see why barrels would be much different, though some of the barrel racers on the forum would be able to tell you about that better than I could hope to.
 
#5 ·
You can't run barrels in a bosal. You need shanks/ reins independent of one another. The hackamore the OP mentioned least what I'm thinking it is, the old style long shanked hack where the shanks only go back. Not to the side like the newer mechanical hackamores. Hackamores aren't the best for training, they cause horses to become stiff. Perfect for a horse that already knows the pattern. My horse runs in a little a hack, but if he's ignoring my cues in it I pull out my snaffle to give him a refresher. He's mostly leg trained but I found after not being rode for 5 months he needed the bit back to be reminded to listen to me. I want to see a video because I suspect a training issue with holes to fill.
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#6 ·
Agree that there are probably some holes in the training. But if your going to look for hackamores to run barrels in look at the little S which has been mentioned previously or a Stivers hackamore. Both of those hackamores are for lifting and each side works independently of the other. Regardless of what bit/hackamore you use you need to make sure you know how it works and why your using it, if their are holes in the training no bit, hackamore or tie down will solve the problem.
 
#7 ·
My first question: When has this mare last had her TEETH examined?

Second question: When has she been checked by a chiro?

You always want to make sure that she isn't fighting the bit because of pain. If you can rule out pain, then you can work on correcting the issue.

I would like to see a video as well. There is a difference between a horse not respecting the bit (fighting you) and a horse that has a personal preference of not liking an O-ring. Horses are like people; they can have preferences too.

My guess (without seeing a video) is that she's fighting the bit and not giving. You need to correct that. If you simply switch bits or switch to a hackamore without fixing the true underlying issue, the head throwing and bit evasion will continue.

As far as hackamores themselves. I am not a fan of mechanical hackamores. However, Brittany Pozzi has something similar in her line of bits. It works for some horses. I know she will run Duke in this hackamore often.



I myself will sometimes ride in a Little S hackamore. I particularly like using it in the winter and don't have to deal with putting a cold bit into a horse's mouth. But there are some horses that run well in a Little S. A hackamore will tend to "stiffen" a horse, so it can be useful sometimes on a horse that is overly bendy in the pattern.

 
#8 ·
My first question: When has this mare last had her TEETH examined?

Second question: When has she been checked by a chiro?
The last time she was checked on both areas was a little over three years ago when we were looking at buying her. Before purchasing her, my mom had our vet come out and examine her - he said everything was fine. Our vet was out just last summer(sometime before July)to give her some vaccinations for show season and just as a check up as aell. I did ask him to check her teeth because I thought they may have been bugging her but he said they were still good. Should I look into having him come out again?

As for having her checked by an actual chiro, we've never had one come out to see her. I know of one, but her prices have raised .She's a nice lady and does good work on my friend's horses, but we can't afford it.:-|

Unfortunately I have no videos to show you guys ( and girls). Would pictures of her bit do any good to determine if it might be the problem?
 
#9 ·
I thought my horse needed to see a chiro a few months back, she was having a hard time bending to the left, picking up the wrong lead going to the left etc. Had one look at her and he couldn't find a single thing wrong other then she was stiff. He said just do some more bending and flexing with her. My trainer is big on Clinton Anderson, so we started incorporating a lot of ground work into our routine, plus when I get on the first thing I do is make her bend both directions about fifty times, first at the walk, then we go on with a trot. Its done a ton of good for her. I usually run in a jr cowhorse with a double joint. When working at home I do a lot of training with a full check snaffle with a French link.
I agree that you may want to have the horse checked by a chiropractor. Then look into doing a lot of bending/stretching exercises. Not just a few times but every day.
 
#11 ·
I would highly advise you to get a second opinion on her teeth. My horses get floated at least once per year. My guys haven't needed it yet, but some horses need it done every 6 months.

How much does your chiropractor cost? I don't mean to be negative, but if you can't even afford a chiro check, what will you do if your horse gets injured and needs emergency vet treatment? How do you pay for barrel racing entry fees, and gas/diesel to get there?

I can always tell when my horse Red needs a chiro adjustment. He'll start avoiding picking up his right lead. He gets adjusted, and then he picks it up always the first time I ask.

If your horse is hurting, it will do you no good to change headgear. Because you won't be fixing the problem (if pain is there).
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