From article "Rath Controls Ring" - The Horse Forum

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post #1 of 22 Old 07-16-2011, 02:36 PM Thread Starter
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From article "Rath Controls Ring"

http://www.eurodressage.com/equestri...11-cdio-aachen

The two images that caught my eye were, first... Rath and Totilas and second... Peters and Ravel.

Take a close look at them......Rath is hard on the snaffle and the curb, while Peters rein contact is less. However, their heads are nearly in the same place......

Rein connections affect upon lightness; seems to me that the tighter the rein connection the less lightness of forehand the horse will have. This does have a direct and proximate affect upon the rest of the horse and the presentation. So why are the world GP dressage riders presenting dressage with the excessive braking being applied to the horse?

In the images from the link we have two different applications of rein pressure achieving the same result. This clearly shows that in actuality the rider is over braking the horse....ala your foot on the brake pedal [the snaffle bit] while your hand gradually is appling the emergency brake [the curb bit] of your vehicle.

Why are the judges not addressing this situation? Article 401 states the the horse should appear to be doing it own its own. How can such an appearance be present when the rider has the horse in braking mode all the time?

E. Allan Buck
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post #2 of 22 Old 07-16-2011, 02:49 PM
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When you click on the link it says that the page can't be found.

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post #3 of 22 Old 07-16-2011, 03:21 PM Thread Starter
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Rath Controls the Ring in the CDIO Grand Prix at the 2011 CDIO Aachen | eurodressage

This is the complete link, it works

E. Allan Buck
"Ask and allow, do not demand and force"
www.hartetoharte.org
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post #4 of 22 Old 07-16-2011, 10:14 PM
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It is impossible to judge what they are doing from one picture that is a millisecond in time. It is also very easy to judge others from behind a computer screen, while never attaining their level ourselves.

Mods, grant me the serenity to see the opinions I cannot change, courage to change the ones that should change, and the wisdom to spot the trolls.
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post #5 of 22 Old 07-17-2011, 12:06 AM
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Here we go again:roll:. If you have such a problem with how those judges handled that particular situation or how those horses were judged, then why don't you take it up with the association and/or judges personally instead of throwing a hissy fit and sniveling to a bunch of anonymous people on the internet about how the system is broken and, apparently, you are the only one that knows how to fix it?

If you want it fixed, then work toward fixing it, but posting links here and screaming and raving about "OMG, look at this, it's soooo wrong" does nothing to accomplish anything other than making you look foolish and arrogant.

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post #6 of 22 Old 07-17-2011, 12:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smrobs View Post
Here we go again:roll:. If you have such a problem with how those judges handled that particular situation or how those horses were judged, then why don't you take it up with the association and/or judges personally instead of throwing a hissy fit and sniveling to a bunch of anonymous people on the internet about how the system is broken and, apparently, you are the only one that knows how to fix it?

If you want it fixed, then work toward fixing it, but posting links here and screaming and raving about "OMG, look at this, it's soooo wrong" does nothing to accomplish anything other than making you look foolish and arrogant.


You know Spirithorse, for being SO knowledgeable and SO above these FEI riders.. why don't you show us how it really should be done? Not some link to a website that's barely readable but an actual video of you riding your own horse performing these upper level movements. Oh, and I expect your horse will be extremely happy and farting rainbows while he does it.
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post #7 of 22 Old 07-17-2011, 12:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smrobs View Post
Here we go again:roll:. If you have such a problem with how those judges handled that particular situation or how those horses were judged, then why don't you take it up with the association and/or judges personally instead of throwing a hissy fit and sniveling to a bunch of anonymous people on the internet about how the system is broken and, apparently, you are the only one that knows how to fix it?

If you want it fixed, then work toward fixing it, but posting links here and screaming and raving about "OMG, look at this, it's soooo wrong" does nothing to accomplish anything other than making you look foolish and arrogant.

Agree 100% and already have told him but it falls on deaf ears.

As soon as I saw the thread starter I just knew what it would be saying.:roll:
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post #8 of 22 Old 07-17-2011, 06:33 AM
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I don't think a person needs to be riding grand prix to voice an opinion. HOWEVER, I agree that one millisecond in time is not a way to judge a person's ability. Also, different horses can need a dramatically different ride. If Peters got on Totilas, he might need more contact to package that horse up too.

Every horse I ride takes a slightly different approach. You simply cannot ride horses, especially at this level, like they were produced in a cookie cutter.
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post #9 of 22 Old 07-17-2011, 10:53 AM
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He's a one trick pony and it's not even a good trick!
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post #10 of 22 Old 07-17-2011, 04:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spirithorse8 View Post

Why are the judges not addressing this situation? Article 401 states the the horse should appear to be doing it own its own. How can such an appearance be present when the rider has the horse in braking mode all the time?
I agree with this. I also agree that you can't tell actual pressure by looking at a photograph. On the other other hand, I do know that many Warmbloods can be heavy, they are ridden differently from Arabs, and TB. What used to seem "heavy hands" when I was growing up is now consdered okay, partly, I believe, because it is the norm for certain types of horses. The "look" of the horse acting on its own, or in perfect unity with his rider, now appears to be too automatic, or tricky, perhaps. Judges want to see contact. I know the older type of dressage hasn't near the power and, shall we say excitement, as the modern competitive horse. So the "appearing to do it on its own" has changed somewhat.

As for bringing this topic up over and over again: yes, it is an ongoing concern. I am always surprised when I meet someone who simply HATES dressage, wants to have nothing to do with it, the only part they like in a test is when the horse gets to stretch his neck out and leave the arena. These are usually people who care a lot about horses, who know nothing about gymnastic schooling, but are appalled by the "look" of it. I think there IS something wrong when the first look at a sport evokes disgust. Not that discussion will help much, especially if you've been successful in your approach.
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