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News From the FEI Round Table Conference on Rollkur

This is a discussion on News From the FEI Round Table Conference on Rollkur within the Dressage forums, part of the English Riding category

     
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        02-11-2010, 03:20 PM
      #21
    Weanling
    I use LDR as a way to bring the horse's attention back to me, to assess soundness and the physical being of the horse, as a stretch in my practice of in-hand and under-saddle flexion, and to help with bringing together different points in my training. The position is acheived with softness, for short periods of time. My horses are asked, and if they put up a fight or give me tension, either I'm doing something wrong or they are hurting/not ready to stretch in the way that I'm asking (so, if I'm asking for a stretch under saddle at the walk, but my horse isn't understanding, etcetera, I'll go back to the beginning and try it in-hand and see if they understand.)
    But, I don't think of it as teaching "connection" in the sense of the hind end connection, because the postion still tightens the lumbar spine (but doesn't lock it completely, as with hyperflexed horses), making it impossible for the horse to move completely underneath themself. In a sense, though, it can be used to "connect the dots" of some points in the training, whether we ask for it directly, or indirectly (for example, I'm teaching Freddy the meaning of how to stretch into the contact. Right now, he understands how to go forward and down, but he's still too unsure about stretching outward. So he appears to be in LDR position when I ask for "forward-down-out", and it will just take time for him to realize that I'm asking him to stretch into the contact, and that it's okay).

    I hope that made sense.
         
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        02-11-2010, 07:50 PM
      #22
    Yearling
    My 'LDR' is more akin to the stretching trot asked for in the training level tests. I don't really know the names of the 'techniques' I do, I usually discover them on my own or my trainer teaches me them by telling me what to do (or I read about them and forget the names). I apologize if I am confusing anybody, I know that I am confusing myself with all these terms!
    It looks somewhat like this, and I find it to be a nice stretch:

         
        02-12-2010, 04:31 PM
      #23
    Banned
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by roro    
    My 'LDR' is more akin to the stretching trot asked for in the training level tests. I don't really know the names of the 'techniques' I do, I usually discover them on my own or my trainer teaches me them by telling me what to do (or I read about them and forget the names). I apologize if I am confusing anybody, I know that I am confusing myself with all these terms!
    It looks somewhat like this, and I find it to be a nice stretch:

    I'm not confused in the least. This picture is nothing like what ~*~anebel~*~ posted as an example of LDR, except we still have a hunched over rider. Doesn't anybody sit up on a horse anymore?
         
        02-12-2010, 04:43 PM
      #24
    Green Broke
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Mercedes    
    I'm not confused in the least. This picture is nothing like what ~*~anebel~*~ posted as an example of LDR, except we still have a hunched over rider. Doesn't anybody sit up on a horse anymore?
    I think that rider is just in two point... and like evrything else in riding... there are so many different ways of doing it
         
        02-13-2010, 11:34 AM
      #25
    Banned
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by ridergirl23    
    i think that rider is just in two point... and like evrything else in riding... there are so many different ways of doing it
    Uh, huh and the horse reflects the rider's poor posture every single time.
         
        02-13-2010, 11:57 AM
      #26
    Green Broke
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Mercedes    
    Uh, huh and the horse reflects the rider's poor posture every single time.
    im sorry but I do not think two point as a poor posture at all. And if you do then... think outside the box a bit.
    It is like everyone else, are you going to bash shoulder ins because people sometimes get poor postures in those to? Or any other thing in dressage?
         
        02-15-2010, 11:57 AM
      #27
    Banned
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by ridergirl23    
    im sorry but I do not think two point as a poor posture at all. And if you do then... think outside the box a bit.
    When you show a proper two-point position, then we'll talk. Dropping the hands below the wither and simply leaning forward is not two-point. That's called collapsing the core and putting the horse on its forehand. If that's what you call thinking outside of the box, it's really best for all involved to stay within the box because 'outside' does the horse no favors.

    Quote:
    it is like everyone else, are you going to bash shoulder ins because people sometimes get poor postures in those to? Or any other thing in dressage?
    Don't be ridiculous. I've not bashed LDR in the least because of rider posture. I've not even bashed the poor posture, I've simply stated it for what it is...poor posture.

    I'm just sitting here waiting for someone to show a picture of this LDR technique that is suppose to encourage the horse to push from behind, go into the bridle, and improve connection.

    It seems that 'we' can't even agree on what LDR does, let alone what LDR looks like. Therefore, it's no wonder the FEI has left loopholes big enough for an elephant to jump through.
         
        02-15-2010, 01:08 PM
      #28
    Weanling
    I'd like to see a picture or video of that too. I'm admitting to collapsing my core when I work in long and low or stretch into LDR. I've been working on it, and it's difficult! It's so tempting to look down and lean over the horse's head, and I don't even know why. I know that if they decided to stop or spook or throw a fit, you'd be off like a sunshine-butt hunter.
    As I said, I use LDR as a stretch, for assessment, and for connecting the things I've taught or am trying to teach. Other riders may have different uses for LDR, but not all of them are harmless to the horse's mind or body. The FEI needs to define what they mean by "LDR" and "aggressive".

    There isn't one specific way to train a horse or use a method of training, and I think it's good to see variation in methods. But when a method becomes a real threat to the horse's physical or mental wellbeing, it is better saved as a last resort.
         

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