Put a dressage rider in the hunter ring, put a classical rider in the modern ring=? - Page 3 - The Horse Forum
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post #21 of 137 Old 08-24-2010, 08:01 AM
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Let's get rid of the false premise, that hunters and dressage are judged on the same objective standard and hunters somehow fail to measure up, once and for all. A dressage rider in the hunter ring will not kick butt, and a hunter rider in the dressage ring will fight against their forward seat training and struggle to adapt. A dressage rider, in a full seat, riding a dressage quality gait, is going to look pretty silly in the hunter ring and is going to do the opposite of well. The goals of the two disciplines are *different*; it's comparing apples and oranges.
You put it great, maura! What about western riders than? We can go ahead and compare say cutters or reiners vs jumpers. Why not?
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post #22 of 137 Old 08-24-2010, 10:05 AM
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Criticizing hunters and hunter riders by comparing them to dressage horses and riders is like criticizing a human track and field athlete running the 440 hurdles for not sticking their landings like gymnasts. It only requires that you ignore the goal of the individual discipline before making the comparison.
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post #23 of 137 Old 08-24-2010, 10:09 AM
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Outside of Equitation the horse is being judged in the hunter ring. So if you take out the rider factor a dressage horse CAN and does do well, even wins in the hunter ring.
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post #24 of 137 Old 08-24-2010, 10:20 AM
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Yes, that's true. In a Hunter under saddle class, a dressage horse can and does do very well IF it's shown in a training level frame or allowed to move in huntery frame. And yes, it would be easier to show a dressage horse in a hunter under saddle class and pin well that it would be to take a hunter and show training level dressage and do well - you'd have to ask the hunter to carry more frame and move through its back; though I think there are some horses who could make the switch quite well.

It's still true, though, that at a rated show and a rated division, the under saddle portion is 25% of the division (used to be 1/3, back in the day, but it was decided to lessen the emphasis on the flat and increase the importance of over fences.) The dressage horse would require some signifigant schooling to compete in the over fences portion.

None of which changes the fact that the original post in this thread starts with a faulty premise, an apples to oranges comparison, and an offensive, discipline-centric, chauvinistic point of view.
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post #25 of 137 Old 08-24-2010, 10:28 AM
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Originally Posted by maura View Post

It's still true, though, that at a rated show and a rated division, the under saddle portion is 25% of the division (used to be 1/3, back in the day, but it was decided to lessen the emphasis on the flat and increase the importance of over fences.) The dressage horse would require some signifigant schooling to compete in the over fences portion.

.

It is interesting that my boy's sire competed and won at the Tournmant of Champions in dressage (rated) and in the hunter ring (rated) in under saddle and over fences. He was a natural for both, and my boy has also done the exact same thing.

Like father like son I guess.
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post #26 of 137 Old 08-24-2010, 10:30 AM
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Cool! Who was your horse's sire?

BTW, still doesn't make the OP's original point valid. I'd just like to know about the horse.
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post #27 of 137 Old 08-24-2010, 10:45 AM
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^^^I am not entirely sure there was a clear point in the OP other than to say that dressage riders are better than hunter riders. And then later to say that classical dressage riders are better than modern dressage riders. When in actual fact there is bad riding and bad form in all diciplines.

Any rider that has a true desire to enhance their skills will seek out knowledge and training that will enable them to excell in WHATEVER they are doing. Perhaps it would be more accurate to say that many diciplines would benefit from a greater understanding of classical dressage as it is one of the oldest and most refined Equestrian activities? Not to say that any other dicipline is less refined as such, just that the principles of classical dressage have been established for centuries and are widely applicable for some of the newer diciplines.

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Last edited by sarahver; 08-24-2010 at 10:47 AM.
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post #28 of 137 Old 08-24-2010, 04:13 PM Thread Starter
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This thread starts off with a false premise: and then veers accidently onto a correct premise worthy of discussion re: classical vs. modern dressge.
That is the point of this thread, I put a bad title on. I just wanted something to compare it to which was hunter vs. dressage.

To all the hunter riders who have replied to this thread. I never said hunters was really easy, I said it was different. What I mean by putting a dressage rider in the hunter ring is that the change is easier from dressage to hunter than from hunter to dressage. To jump a horse properly, you have to be a good rider and really, it can be dressage with jumps if it is done properly: to get the horse balanced before, over, and after the jump. To get impulsion, rhythm and suppleness.
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post #29 of 137 Old 08-24-2010, 04:54 PM
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The goals of modern vs. classical dressage are the same; though the methods differ; both the goals and methods of hunter seat equitation and dressage riding are very, very different. Still a bad and inaccurate comparision.

"Dressage with jumps" accurately describes showjumping, and sadly, some xc event courses these days; but does not accurately describe hunter seat riding.
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post #30 of 137 Old 08-24-2010, 05:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Spyder View Post
It is interesting that my boy's sire competed and won at the Tournmant of Champions in dressage (rated) and in the hunter ring (rated) in under saddle and over fences. He was a natural for both, and my boy has also done the exact same thing.

Like father like son I guess.
I assume they were trained for both dressage and over fences..?

To be honest, I didn't quite get the original post. Does OP mean you take dressage horse with zero training in jumping and throw it in jumping ring? I highly doubt ANY horse would do well in anything without extensive training put in.
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