Working with Trainers - Page 2 - The Horse Forum

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post #11 of 17 Old 03-07-2013, 09:25 PM
Weanling
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Nebraska
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I have used bungees for training but as side reins when lunging. I don't ride in them. I like them in the fact that if they are loose enough, they seem more forgiving than actual side reins for teaching a green horse how to balance and build up a topline.

Have you simply tried to talk to her yet before you hit the pavement and find another horse? She could be trying to get a quick fix in order for you to feel like you are riding a "dressage horse" that is perfectly in frame. I would explain to her that you aren't really comfortable in riding with the bungees and can you try it without. Use yourself as an excuse like "it feels funny" or "you want to learn how to get him going without the bungess". If she says no then you move on. This is an opportunity for you to teach her. If she is open or not is up to her.
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post #12 of 17 Old 03-07-2013, 09:33 PM
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If you are going to try to talk to anyone, you need to talk to the owner of the horse as they are the only ones that can make a decision regarding his training. Just straight up tell her that you don't feel right riding the horse in the bungee and you are really questioning the things you are being taught.

Do you think there is any chance that the owner might decide to let you work the horse with the other, better trainer?

If all that is a no-go, then you'd best start looking elsewhere because you aren't learning how to ride properly where you are. Trust me, it takes a lot longer to un-learn bad habits and re-learn properly than it does to take a break to find the right trainer and learn the correct way the first time.

Always remember that feeling of looking at a big, open country over the ears of a good horse, seeing a new trail unwind ahead of you, and that ever-spectacular view from the top of the ridge!!! Follow my training blog: http://robertsontraining.blogspot.com/
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post #13 of 17 Old 03-07-2013, 10:02 PM
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It sounds like the owner is completely unaware of the trainer's lack of proper training of Dressage..... and it may be a touchy subject to discuss.

Maybe talk with the owner and tell her straight up your horse should not be in bungees. This is not training the horse to move properly, nevermind in Dressage.

Maybe you should seek out an actual Dressage trainer or someone with dressage riding skills to speak with the owner so she can see a difference in the training methods?

"Strength is the ability to use a muscle without tension"
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post #14 of 17 Old 03-08-2013, 01:43 AM
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Perhaps a demonstration of how a bungee cord snaps under pressure is in order. Anyone who has seen the speed and force that those things snap back at wouldn't out a bungee anywhere near their horse let alone riding with one. They can very easily take out eyes, if these people are dead set on you riding with some kind of dilly head setting gadget, at least try to convince them to switch to a market harborough or similar that will help keep the head in position without being dangerous (never mind putting the horse into a forced frame).
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post #15 of 17 Old 03-08-2013, 03:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kayty View Post
Perhaps a demonstration of how a bungee cord snaps under pressure is in order. Anyone who has seen the speed and force that those things snap back at wouldn't out a bungee anywhere near their horse let alone riding with one. They can very easily take out eyes, if these people are dead set on you riding with some kind of dilly head setting gadget, at least try to convince them to switch to a market harborough or similar that will help keep the head in position without being dangerous (never mind putting the horse into a forced frame).
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Completely agree. I witnessed a bungee cord snapping when a friend was lunging, completely freaked out both horse and lunger. Lucky no one was hurt, but the horse did have a nice line of missing hair along her face afterwards... However, I've witnessed leather market harboroughs snap, and that's just an inconvenience, not a danger. I have to admit, these things do have their uses in re-training situations with difficult horses, but I would always prefer to lunge in side reins to build muscle over the back and ride without gadgets at all...
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post #16 of 17 Old 03-08-2013, 07:02 PM
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Absolutely minstrel, though I'd never use a bungee no matte what the retraining situation.
I've put market harboroughs and draw reins on ottbs for a few rides, when they've been particularly worried about lowering their head to a comfortable level. A couple of rides has always been enough for me to give them more confidence and understanding that they can relax their jaw, poll and neck. Once they understand that, it's simple to work on the 'engine' again.
But for every day riding purely to create a head set, no no no.
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post #17 of 17 Old 03-09-2013, 02:31 AM
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Originally Posted by Kayty View Post
Absolutely minstrel, though I'd never use a bungee no matte what the retraining situation.
I've put market harboroughs and draw reins on ottbs for a few rides, when they've been particularly worried about lowering their head to a comfortable level. A couple of rides has always been enough for me to give them more confidence and understanding that they can relax their jaw, poll and neck. Once they understand that, it's simple to work on the 'engine' again.
But for every day riding purely to create a head set, no no no.
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By 'these things' I meant the harborough, draw reins etc, I agree about the bungee. I have used chambons, de gogues, draw reins, market harborughs and running and standing martingales depending on the situation, they can be useful in getting a horse over head lowering issues. However they shouldn't be used to teach a horse 'frame', just to start the process of working long and low and stretching the back muscles so the horse learns they can do it themselves.

Take my ottb for example. He is terrible at leaning on the bit and falling on the forehand. However, a few weeks' lunging with side reins, and making a point of riding 'back up, bum under' and just straight up not letting him lean on the hand, he is slowly getting there. It is achievable!! I have had people tell me that, at 17hh I'm not 'strong enough' to hold his front end up, and that I need draw reins, but I'm not daft - I was him moving forward and using his back and hindquarters before I start worrying about where his head is!!
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