Bits for training!
   

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Bits for training!

This is a discussion on Bits for training! within the English Riding forums, part of the Riding Horses category
  • dr bristol egg butt snaffle
  • English bit to keep a horse from running through the bit

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  • 1 Post By mildot
  • 2 Post By tinyliny

 
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    04-16-2012, 05:04 PM
  #1
Foal
Wink Bits for training!

Last summer we leased a 15 hand arab(he was huge for arab standards) he had so much energy and strength that he would run right through a slow twist dee ring snaffle. He was a top ten arab and had qualified for nationals before his owner stopped riding him. His owner wouldn't let us put anything stronger in his mouth other then that dee ring. I would habe liked to put a phelam bit which is slightly more assertive in his mouth. Do you think putting a slightly stronger bit in his mouth for a little while to make him "respect" the bit would have helped him? We have had to do it with several other horses before him and by no means do I think riding in a strong bit is good. I hate seeing people ride in kimberwicks/ other correction bits at shows I would much rather see loose ring snaffles or an egg butt bit in the horses mouth but do you think that switching bits for training and getting the respect of the horse is a good thing?
     
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    04-16-2012, 05:24 PM
  #2
Green Broke
If he doesn't respect the twisted bit, he needs more training to give to the bit and not a harsher bit.

If a horse is getting heavy on a regular snaffle, going to a little harsher bit for a short time is not bad. It is bad when you have to rely on a harsher bit to get them to respond.
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    04-16-2012, 05:52 PM
  #3
Foal
We did put him in a tom thumb in a western headstall for one ride and he did noticeably better. He did compete at a showing stable which I thinik the reason he didn't respect the bit was the fact they probably rode him in a double bridle or stronger bit because he would give but he had so much power when he decided he wanted to go he went.
This is him and my sister the first ride on him.
     
    04-17-2012, 07:03 AM
  #4
Showing
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mary Liz    
We did put him in a tom thumb in a western headstall for one ride and he did noticeably better
Hmm not sure if I see a relaxed happy horse in that still. I agree with usandpets. More training. He cannot respect the unknown.. and he wouldn't have been happy in a harsher bit as nothing was being communicated to him.

Personally I would go backwards and use a milder bit so he can learn to respect it without additional pain. A lot of horses get bad because they think that anything you ask = intense pain in mouth. So they start to expect it.. and then you find all sorts of problems.

But I'd start with a refresher, and get the horse understanding what you are communicating. The bit isn't the major communicator though.. the body is. You seat and leg aids, where your weight is, how loose you are, when you engage your lower back or abs.

So you see how a minor bit issue turns into a training issue.
     
    04-17-2012, 07:20 AM
  #5
Started
Have you tried a double jointed snaffle? My Arab gelding gets heavy in a regular snaffle, but add another joint to the mix and he is happy and not heavy.
     
    04-17-2012, 09:55 PM
  #6
Foal
His Dee ring was jointed in the middle does the double joint work better then that even? He has had a lot of training and is a great horse responds well doesn't brace on the bit. He will however take the notion to go fast and at his size is a huge problem. He builds endurance with lunging so you can't lunge his craziness out of him. I have another arab that we switched for a VERY short time to a regular phelam and when we brought him back down to his eggbut he stopped doing all the stuff he was doing before like deciding what he would do without any thought for us. Like I said previously he has obviously been ridden prior to us in a much stronger bit in shows. I would never be happy with moving a harsher bit into a horse that doesn't need it and trust me my other boy laddy that was bumped up to the phelam (for that short period of time years ago) still knows I'm a softy about his bit which is why nobody would ever get on him that would pull or even think of snatching his mouth even with a loose ring snaffle.
     
    04-18-2012, 02:03 PM
  #7
Banned
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mary Liz    
His Dee ring was jointed in the middle does the double joint work better then that even?
The double jointed (aka French link) snaffle is milder than the single jointed snaffle because it lacks the nutcracker action on the tongue.

Be careful when shopping for double jointed snaffles, the French link and the Dr Bristol bits look very, very similar but their severities are polar opposites.

The center link in a French link lies flat against the tongue. The link on the Dr Bristol is set at an angle to the tongue and presses down on it with a very fine edge. Not mild at all.
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    04-18-2012, 02:18 PM
  #8
Super Moderator
I think a Pelham is a good bit to use for a short time. YOu can also use other methods to get his mind back to you. Him running through the bit is because he is thinking out there, not back to his rider.

You can do a lot of small circles, disengagements when he starts to brace and barge ahead. You do things that break him out of that mental frame of mind. And anything you use equal pressure on the reins, you give him the set up for bracing. The more you offset the pressure, the more insistent it is that he leave his mental steamrolling state and listen to the one rein that is the loudest. And you make it "loud" enough that if he doesn't listen, he gets pulled right into a disengagement. Your job is to get his ear and eye focussed back on you, and reward with a release when that happens.
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    04-18-2012, 04:52 PM
  #9
Foal
Quote:
Originally Posted by tinyliny    
I think a Pelham is a good bit to use for a short time. YOu can also use other methods to get his mind back to you. Him running through the bit is because he is thinking out there, not back to his rider.

You can do a lot of small circles, disengagements when he starts to brace and barge ahead. You do things that break him out of that mental frame of mind. And anything you use equal pressure on the reins, you give him the set up for bracing. The more you offset the pressure, the more insistent it is that he leave his mental steamrolling state and listen to the one rein that is the loudest. And you make it "loud" enough that if he doesn't listen, he gets pulled right into a disengagement. Your job is to get his ear and eye focussed back on you, and reward with a release when that happens.
Yes very true seems like Arabs (other horses also I'm just very familiar with this breed) are always finding new things to spook at while your riding them so its a constant struggle to gain and keep their attention. I doubt it will ever happen that he gets a stronger bit or us be allowed to get his attention like that though because the owner wouldn't let us bump him up to a curb and thought we should let him go on a loose reign with the Dee ring which he would not work out at all. Now there going to try to put little kids on him in the future which will not be good since he's so powerful and his will is so strong. Its a shame though because he is gorgeous and I would love to ride him he is just unsafe because he can't be controlled by the standards we had to ride him under.
     

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