controlling the hind end without giving the canter aid - Page 2 - The Horse Forum

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post #11 of 42 Old 12-23-2010, 07:05 PM
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Originally Posted by VelvetsAB View Post
Isn't it interesting how things are taught so many different ways, even in a close location?
Well the stable I was in before was a few-horse teaching-in-the-backyard kind of thing, the stable I'm in now is a 60+ sport stable, number one in the country, they have the best horses, riders and facilities. They can't really afford making a mistake or tell you something just because to them it seems ok. My former trainer wasn't even a trainer, which I found out only here because as I learned he's a famous BSer (I met a few people here who moved out of his stable too). Actually I've never even seen him riding a horse (and neither did others that I asked). I spent many years without horses believing my years with them are over so when I got an oportunity to start riding again and found his stable I was so overwhelmed to be around horses again that I failed to see all the stuff going on around. I fell in love with one of his mistreated horses and decided to buy him no matter what, he was a little underweight brown-orange friesian with tangled tail and mane and rotten hooves, you can see his before/after pictures in my profile. Anyway, to prevent this from being another novel of mine, I'm very happy we're gone. I wouldn't belive him even if he came to me telling me a simple "hello". He was the kinda guy that would yell at you "PULL HIM TO THE INSIDE!!" and right after you did that he would be chasing you with "WHY THE .... ARE YOU PULLING HIM TO THE INSIDE!!"

I'm sorry for the rant, I'm still trying to put up with me being so stupid and ever considering him a good trainer. I now have to drive for one hour to get to my horse (while the "little funny stable" is 10 minutes away from here) but I know both me and my horse get the best we can possibly get.
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post #12 of 42 Old 12-23-2010, 07:08 PM
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But it's true that on the internet you can find so many websites talking about the "outside leg behind the girth" canter cue over and over again. That's something I truely don't understand...
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post #13 of 42 Old 12-23-2010, 10:06 PM
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Originally Posted by mumiinek View Post
But it's true that on the internet you can find so many websites talking about the "outside leg behind the girth" canter cue over and over again. That's something I truely don't understand...
The thinking behind this is that the outside hind leg is the starting leg for the canter so you use your outside leg to START the canter.

The flaw in this is that you are taught to start the canter from a grounded leg. This cannot be done as a grounded leg cannot be influenced...

The rider influences the thrust distance and power of any leg that is about to land in the action it will provide AFTER it strikes the ground. They can influence any leg by shortening and lengthening the stride. So in effect any leg used by the rider to initiate the canter is in fact shortening or lengthening it to create the desired gait.
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post #14 of 42 Old 12-23-2010, 10:17 PM
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When I taught my gelding the cue for canter, in addition to my outside leg he HAD to wait for me to kiss to go into the canter, outside leg back only meant canter when I kissed as well.
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post #15 of 42 Old 12-23-2010, 10:37 PM
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Originally Posted by Icyred View Post
When I taught my gelding the cue for canter, in addition to my outside leg he HAD to wait for me to kiss to go into the canter, outside leg back only meant canter when I kissed as well.
The point? You've taught him to canter with your voice aid not your leg aid. Should you want to ride a dressage test, you'll have big problems - use of voice = penalties/disqualification!
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post #16 of 42 Old 12-23-2010, 10:45 PM
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And this is why I love Molly!

The leg behind the girth, for her, is the cue for a half-pass. Canter is either a kiss or a gentle squeeze with both legs, never both or she canters too fast.

I would go back to basic aid training and reteach to her that a leg AT the girth means canter, and behind the girth means "move the back end".
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post #17 of 42 Old 12-23-2010, 10:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Kayty View Post
The point? You've taught him to canter with your voice aid not your leg aid. Should you want to ride a dressage test, you'll have big problems - use of voice = penalties/disqualification!

I was just giving an example of what I do...No need to get snappy.
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post #18 of 42 Old 12-23-2010, 10:58 PM
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I'm having the same problem. I was thinking of using a firm press with the outside leg for canter and a tap, tap with the outside for the side pass. But I have no idea how well that would work in reality. My girl is sensitive to aids, so the moment I put the outside leg on she's cantering, she won't give me time to tap if I want to do a side pass.

I may have to see about re-training her to use the inside leg as a canter cue instead.
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post #19 of 42 Old 12-23-2010, 11:03 PM
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Originally Posted by Icyred View Post
When I taught my gelding the cue for canter, in addition to my outside leg he HAD to wait for me to kiss to go into the canter, outside leg back only meant canter when I kissed as well.
I am not a fan of having a horse associate a noise (click/cluck/kiss/smooch etc) as it makes the person rely on that noise. I ride with a bunch of kids who smooch before even giving the proper cue for walk/trot/canter. They carry crops for decoration. They sound like chickens. Cluck cluck smooch cluck cluck cluck.

Saying woah is fine... That doesnt bother me.

But this is my point of view on it.

It is impossible for a man to learn what he thinks he already knows. --Epictetus
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post #20 of 42 Old 12-23-2010, 11:21 PM
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Idk, when I give my voice aids they are very quiet, and people don't usually here them as they are only just enough so the horse can pick up them. I don't like clucking chickens either, I give the small sound and that is it, I don't repeat it over and over, my legs, seat and hand help reinforce and maintain the cue.
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