Horse falls in on inside leg. - Page 2

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Horse falls in on inside leg.

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    03-24-2013, 05:27 AM
I have never stated that anyone should drop the outside contact, I think you read into my post incorrectly.
You need to maintain the contact on the outside rein, BUT bring it off the horses neck. Having ridden and trained multiple young, green, badly educated and up to FEI horses, I have a basic idea of what I am talking about on the topic of contact and developing a reaction to the leg.

I would not tap the shoulder rather than behind the riders leg unless it was for a more 'interesting' problem then a basic horse not moving away from the riders leg. The problem is that the horse is not respecting pressure of the riders leg. By moving into the leg it is making that very obvious. I would always back up the riders leg (not the horse's leg, not sure where that came from?) with the whip, right behind where the initial aid came from. The point is to make the horse move away from the leg, and the inside hind is the first place to start. The shoulders will come later, but those hind legs are the vital ingredient in initially teaching the horse to move away from the leg.
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    03-24-2013, 06:19 AM
Good suggestions here.

I want to add to the OP that you should really think about your seat bones. When you are turning you need to stay balanced and don't sit off-center on your horse. Weighting the seat bone on the inside is a somewhat subtle shift and not something that puts you off center in the saddle.

Don't ignore the outside leg either. It is important that your inside leg is for your horse to bend around and not to push your horse away to the outside. All of your aids should be on the horse. Inside rein, outside rein, inside leg, outside leg.
    03-24-2013, 06:19 PM
Green Broke
Thank you guys so, so, so much for the advice.

This is my first greenie that I've actually had to school rather than just put miles on or correct vices, so it's a work in progress! I feel like we are doing very well with the exception of this one hiccup (and a big hiccup, I feel) so I really appreciate the advice.

I will definitely start working with a dressage whip and see how she responds. Just bought a new dressage saddle (yay!) and am waiting on my girth to arrive, so I'm anxious to start working on this issue.

Thanks again!
    03-25-2013, 12:19 PM
THE easiest way to teach the horse to move off the leg is simply to work it in hand (even in a halter). Start to flex the horse to the inside, and touch right behind where the girth would be (you can use your finger, or a whip). Ask for bend, touch, bend, touch (a kind of large turn on the forehand). The horse starts to understand what an aid is.

The easiest way to teach leg yield (LY) ridden is head to the wall. Flex the horse into the wall, PULSE with the inside leg (the one closest to the wall).

As you teach the horse to move off the inside leg you must NOT try to steer it too the wall with the outside hand (this is what I usually see as the CAUSE of the counter flexion or bend which creates the horse falling in in the first place). If you ride a large circle try to spiral to the open side (ie start at A and spiral gradually to C through asking en/large on the OPEN side (the C side of the circle). This does two things: it puts the horse into the outside rein, but it also allows the horse to move side ways WITH bend (vs plain ly or head to the wall ly both are much straighter). Remember EVERY corner is three bended strides, three chances to have reaction to inside leg. Perhaps you need a little opening INSIDE rein before the corner to keep the contact (and perhaps noting to yourself that the outside rein is closed to the withers).

This has nothing to do with moods, but how you set her up.

For SURE, lifting the inside rein WILL help is sustaining inside flexion and preventing counter flexion, do that and THEN touch with the (inside) leg (but likely you are using an opening outside rein whether you realize it or not).
    03-25-2013, 12:32 PM
Green Broke
Thanks for the comment!

Though I will say, it does have to do with how she's feeling on certain days when it comes to counter flexing. If she is focused we have much cleaner turns with a decent amount of bend. But when she thinks we are done working it gets ugly really quickly and that's where the counter flexing starts. I'm not saying it doesn't have to do with me because it does, obviously. That's why I am here asking for help.
Her falling in on my leg is a constant thing, no matter how she feels.

And she does disengage from the ground. She can turn on the forehand and side pass both on the ground and under saddle. It's putting it into forward motion where we have the issues.

Again, thanks for the comment!
    03-25-2013, 06:57 PM
So my one mare likes to fall in to the right and here's how I correct we are warming up (at the walk) I ride 20 meter circles and as I "open" my inside rein (over the knee NOT back) at the same time I use my inside thigh to push her shoulder into the outside rein.

Of course since horses are stronger than we are you can't hold it - so open rein/use thigh, close rein (back to normal position) stop pushing with thigh. Do NOT "hold" - horse will win! You WILL have to repeat often in the beginning - perhaps every other stride. I also do it in both directions - not as often in the direction she is best (for her it's to the left), but once she starts getting the hang of things it takes little time to get her to start bending correctly.

I generally don't trot until the walk is correct because that works best for her (she loves to go "fast" so I "punish" her by making her walk until it is correct as it's easier for her to get out of doing it correctly at the trot and/or canter.
    03-25-2013, 10:12 PM
Green Broke
Thank you!

I rode today and she was wonderful at the walk. It was great. The trot wasn't as nice. She was good on 20M circles but stilll, the corners are just ugly. I just don't know what to do when she starts to flail out on her inside shoulder and counter flexes when she won't move away from my leg. It's frustrating, to say the least. But you guys are really helping and I appreciate it!

We'll get there!

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