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post #41 of 48 Old 10-28-2010, 11:12 AM
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Originally Posted by Appyt View Post
A breastcollar worn for pretty isn't affecting the horses movement or ability to perform.
Neither is a loose, running martingale.

Nobody's arguing the fact that a too tight martingale causes problems. It's saying that martingales are eeevvviiiillll or that your horse obviously isn't trained correctly if you use one, that has people a little miffed.

They're no more evil than any other piece of tack or correctional device when used properly so that they don't interfere with the movement and performance of the animal.

Just as a Western rider wouldn't dream of going into the ring without their hat, chaps and bling, neither would a hunter rider go in without a martingale.
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post #42 of 48 Old 10-28-2010, 06:15 PM
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Originally Posted by Alwaysbehind View Post
But it is not in most cases. You must have missed that part of my post. At least not in the hunter ring. Most people purchase and adjust them so the only time they would do anything is if there was a total meltdown.

Yes, I guess in theory it is like a western tie down. But again, not adjusted tight so it is not holding the head down. So in mechanics, similar, but not used that way.

I agree with Indy, in the hunter ring most riders use a standing martingale in the same way most western riders use a breastcollar.
I think you are confusing things. A breast collar attaches to the Western saddle much the same as a breast plate does to an English saddle. A Standing Martingale and a Tie down are the same thing, one English one Western. They can be adjusted the same, tight or loose or in between. Both are used to stop the horse from lifting(or throwing) his head too high or to allow him to brace on(as in barrel racing and roping, ie western).

Anyway, I've stated my thoughts and do not see any harm in discussing it here as this is what the forums are for. Discussion....

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post #43 of 48 Old 10-28-2010, 06:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Speed Racer View Post
Neither is a loose, running martingale.

Nobody's arguing the fact that a too tight martingale causes problems. It's saying that martingales are eeevvviiiillll or that your horse obviously isn't trained correctly if you use one, that has people a little miffed.

They're no more evil than any other piece of tack or correctional device when used properly so that they don't interfere with the movement and performance of the animal.

Just as a Western rider wouldn't dream of going into the ring without their hat, chaps and bling, neither would a hunter rider go in without a martingale.
A running martingale is not a breastcollar.. I am not saying a running martingale is evil, nor am I saying that Tie downs or standing martingales are(same thing). Just saying I want to be able to let my horse have his head if he needs it, I(personally) don't want to constrict the head in a way I cannot unconstrict with my reins.. Does that make sense?? I'm not trying to argue, btw.. Not sure if my first post came across that way, it wasn't meant to..

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post #44 of 48 Old 10-28-2010, 10:27 PM
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Originally Posted by Appyt View Post
It's a forum Indyhorse.. I don't see any harm in discussing it. A breastcollar worn for pretty isn't affecting the horses movement or ability to perform.

Here is a video of John French and Rumba's winning round in the Hunter Derby finals last year. The horse jumps like a quintessential hunter: smooth, round, with his knees to his eyeballs. It's fit so Rumba can't fling his nose straight up and loose enough that it doesn't affect his head. I don't see it affecting his movement or ability to perform. The course is lovely.

Rumba & John French – 100K USHJA International Hunter Derby Lexington, KY : Hunter Jumper News
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post #45 of 48 Old 10-28-2010, 11:39 PM
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Why would any one want to put a tie down on a horse who doesn't need it, even as loose as that? It's just a mystery to me. :)

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post #46 of 48 Old 10-28-2010, 11:43 PM
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Originally Posted by upnover View Post
No, the actual function of the martingale had nothing to do with what he was talking about. When you look at the horse from the side, the strap that lays across the shoulder makes a more attractive picture because its breaks the horse up. Whereas no martingale would make it more noticeable if your horse didn't have an attractively shaped neck. This is something I've actually heard from several trainers who are pro-martingale-on-everything.
Oh, okay, so it has more to do with the neck strap than the 'tie down' strap...gotcha...It just didn't make sense to me, is all...cause I'm like "how is a horse's head being tied down attractive?"

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post #47 of 48 Old 10-29-2010, 07:36 AM
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Originally Posted by Appyt View Post
I think you are confusing things. A breast collar attaches to the Western saddle much the same as a breast plate does to an English saddle. A Standing Martingale and a Tie down are the same thing, one English one Western. They can be adjusted the same, tight or loose or in between. Both are used to stop the horse from lifting(or throwing) his head too high or to allow him to brace on(as in barrel racing and roping, ie western).

Anyway, I've stated my thoughts and do not see any harm in discussing it here as this is what the forums are for. Discussion....
Quote:
Originally Posted by Appyt View Post
Why would any one want to put a tie down on a horse who doesn't need it, even as loose as that? It's just a mystery to me. :)
Appy, I strongly suggest you go back and actually read the posts in the thread.

I agree with Indy on the point that most hunter riders use a martingale as a part of the uniform, not as a piece of equipment, the same way western riders use a breast plate as part of the uniform and not a piece of equipment.

And I explained already why people use a 'tie down' (standing martingale in the case of a hunter rider) who do not need it. It is part of the uniform.
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post #48 of 48 Old 10-29-2010, 09:24 AM
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Wrote a long post but don't see any need to post since it's repetitive.. I guess you are comparing breast collars to standing martingales as parts of uniforms and I saw the comparison as what the item is "used" for. Thus my statement that they are not the same. I don't see them as used the same, but I don't show either. ;)

;) Oh, and western riders don't use breast plates, they use breast collars. LOL

Time for me to step out of the english folder. My bad.

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