Breeding: Gaited to Non-Gaited - Page 4 - The Horse Forum
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post #31 of 63 Old 06-25-2012, 05:31 PM
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My sister in law had a great gaited TWH/Morgan gelding that she bought.

I know someone else who has a TWH cross that doesn't gait--and this was something he bred specifically trying to get the gait.

I don't see the point of it unless you know you will get exactly what you want, or will be happy no matter what.

If you can't be brave, then be determined, and you'll end up at the same place.
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post #32 of 63 Old 06-27-2012, 12:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Cat View Post
Actually a lot of the US gaited breeds that have non-gaited horses listed in their history stem because a gaited horse would occasionally pop up in the "non-gaited" breeds and so they used these horses to create a new gaited breed and/or expand the genetic diversity of an established breed. MFT is a perfect example of this as they used to allow any horse that exhibited the fox trot to be included in the breed. So there are a lot of non-gaited horse breeds listed in the history of the breed, but majority of the horses actually used in the MFT did naturally gait - they were atypical for their own breeds but were perfect for the new breed.

You also have to consider that when these earlier breeds were created - like the TWH - there was a huge niche that needed to be filled for plantations and easy riding horses that could go a long distance because horses were the main mode of transportation. They were in demand unlike today where horses are more recreation and a luxury than a necessity. So back then they could take risks to create a specific type of horse because someone could use the culls - even if it was hooking it to a plow or cart because it was otherwise too rough to ride - unlike in today's world where we have way too many horses for the homes available.

I see you mention old gaited breeds used to build the gaited breeds of today that have been replaced. Like who? TWHs used pacers mixed with trotters, not already naturally gaited breeds.

Different times require a different look at breeding practices. Thankfully we already have several gaited breeds of different builds, sizes, etc that most tastes should be met so why breed a gaited cross and take that risk.

Actually they already had filled that niche with the "American Horse" back in the early 1800's (which was the product of TB blood being added to NP bloodlines to get a larger horse). It was a hugely popular breed in it's day and the larger US gaited breeds (e.g. TWH and ASB) can be traced back to it. Same with the Morgan, which had breeds that are known for not being gaited (by gaited I refer to anything beyond the walk, trot, canter and gallop that all horses have), like the Frisian, being crossed with gaited animals.
The US has the very active history of creating new horse breeds, because we do cross animals to eventually get a desired result. I've seen new breeds become common in my lifetime. I've seen breeds created to revive traits that use to be more common. Breeds like the AH and NP no long exist, because they were used in creating better breeds that replaced them. 150 years from now some of the breeds we see today may be uncommon or no longer exist, because they might be replaced by a better breed. I've never had any compulsioon to not mix different breeds. Some of the best animals I've ever had were crosses. However I was never out to start a new breed, so it was only for me. If I had been out to start a new breed what I'd have ended up with would have been something akin to a gaited QH. The product of non gaited QH mares and a gaited TW stallion. They didn't all turn out gaited....1/3 didn't. Not that it would have become a "breed" since I don't think there was/is much of a market for gaited QH, but I enjoyed what we had and would have had more if my father hadn't gelded the stallion after a few years.
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post #33 of 63 Old 06-28-2012, 01:08 AM
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I've kind of stayed out of this thread at first because the general consensus on this forum seems to be that breeding grade horses is bad. And I always seem to get emotional when things hit close to home.

But I bought a MFT mare that happened to be pregnant when I bought her. I don't know WHY the people that had her (and several other MFT mares) choose to breed them to a QH stud. But I was told they were trying to build a string of dude horses. That's why they were keeping all the geldings. So they must have thought it a good cross for trail horses.

But anyway, I now have a 2 yr old QH/Missouri Fox Trotter cross. He isn't under saddle yet and I haven't seen him gait since he was about a month old. So I doubt he is gaited. He is really handsome (in my eyes) and is larger and better looking than both his parents. His dad was a homely but sturdy built QH and his mom a registered Fox Trotter. He is way taller than both of them, and he is not even quite 2 years old. He is 15.1-15.2 hands and 1100 lbs. He has his mom's pretty face and high-set neck and he got a better butt from his dad. It isn't a purebred QH butt, but is is more attractive than his mom's gaited-horse butt. So I really think he got the both of best worlds.

Well, a gait would have been nice too, but I can live without it.

First photo is the crossbred colt.

Second photo is his sire.

Third is his dam.
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post #34 of 63 Old 06-28-2012, 07:22 AM
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That IS a nice colt.
His parents defintely out produced themselves.
I have no problem crossing 2 different breeds.
I think that if you are crossing a nongaited to gaited horse and don't get the gait the foal will be cast aside.
If however, your breeding to get a foal like the 2 yo and gaits really don't matter. More power to you. Shalom
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post #35 of 63 Old 07-02-2012, 01:49 PM
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Why would one want to x-breed? if you want a gaited, buy a gaited... Simple.
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post #36 of 63 Old 07-02-2012, 04:34 PM
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Originally Posted by Deej View Post
Why would one want to x-breed? if you want a gaited, buy a gaited... Simple.

Why reinvent the wheel?

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post #37 of 63 Old 07-02-2012, 05:39 PM
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Breeding a ASB to an Arab is a wonderful cross.
I have seen a gaited TWH and Arab cross that was stunning.
I do no like gaited horses. I want to feel the different gaits.
Though I did enjoy riding a Paso Fino I liked all that brio.
However I could see wanting to refine a TWH and yet retain the gaits. Shalom
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post #38 of 63 Old 07-02-2012, 06:04 PM
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ASBs to Arabs is a fine cross, but keep in mind not all ASBs are gaited.

To me, the gaited breeds have been bred specifically to be one thing... and adding in non-gaited genes just dilutes that unique quality.
Breeding of any kind is a crap shoot, almost moreso when gaits come into play. Since we don't know what causes it, we can't predict how it will manifest itself. That will lead to lots of unwanted, unregisterable horses with questionable conformation. There's way too many of those already.

Breed gaited to gaited, and trotting to trotting, and even then with CAUTION and RESPONSIBILITY.

edit: I am by no means bashing anyone's grade horses. They have as much right to life and happiness as a pedigreed animal, and they are by no means second-rate. Just wanted to put that out there!

We drink to our youth, to the days come and gone; for the age of oppression is now nearly done.

Last edited by arrowsaway; 07-02-2012 at 06:08 PM.
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post #39 of 63 Old 07-02-2012, 06:36 PM
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I have a saddlbred/Qh cross and while he may not be gaited he has some HUGE smooth movements. He's built more like the qh sire but he's got the headset and the long legs of his mom.

001-1.mp4 video by ImaPaintedMombo - Photobucket

He also placed fourth in an open yearling furturity not too long ago, beating some performance bred foals.

I truely wanted a baby to start from scratch and to make a good horse to train and my father wouldnt let me buy one... so i won a free breeding locally. But the more i work with my boy the more i think he will be a great horse to use to teach people to ride and handle horses on, as well as a great kids horse when i get married and have children.
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post #40 of 63 Old 07-02-2012, 06:36 PM
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I don't ever take out my horses registration papers and look at them. She would ride just as well without them.

Carpe Diem!
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