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Foxtrot or Running Walk?

12K views 63 replies 20 participants last post by  planta 
#1 ·
Is this Foxtrotter actually doing a fox trot or a running walk/flat walk?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JXtbbBfQVS8

Unfortunately he sold right before I called. This is what I'm seeing when I try out Foxtrotters: they have a smooth fast walk, but any faster and they're trotting. I suppose technically they're doing a fox trot, but because of the show ring it's now as bouncy as a trot, so it seems like sellers are calling the flat walk a fox trot.

Hope that made sense! :D
 
#2 ·
In my humble opinion, the horse is doing a running walk. My youtube automatically played another video of the same horse, and in that video the horse was flat walking which was close if not full fledged stepping pace. I know everyone has an opinion about gait and, like politics, some are very adamant about their positions. But that's just what I see in the horse. I just got back from a horse sale with better than 100 head of gaited horses, and the horse in the video had a gait as good or better than 90% of the horses there. Anyway, that's my opinion.
 
#5 ·
And getting harder and harder to find. All I see are flat walks that move up into a pace or trot. But people are calling the running walk a fox trot and I was starting to get confused.

I'm not surprised this horse went so fast. :) That's only the second time I've ever seen a gaited horse gait. The other was a TWH with a perfect running walk, but too big for me.
 
#4 · (Edited)
Sorry post cut off:
It may help to look at videos of an actual foxtrot to help compare.

MFTs have many gaits aside from the foxtrot, and I find they are less set in gait than other breeds, though I'm sure that is partially training. Mine will do pretty much any gait heard of and many unheard of (for good reason :P).

If you want a Foxtrotter that foxtrots I wouldn't eliminate the horse because it shows another gait as well. I might if the owners had no clue though :P
 
#6 ·
Yikes.

I think that's exactly the problem!! People have NO clue!!

I really don't know much about gaited horses despite owning 2 and they are not common in the area. BUT I know when they are gaiting or not and know the various gaits! I also have done a lot of research to help me understand as much as possible. Apparently I know far more than the average gaited horse owner who has a lot more experience than me!

It can't be that hard... :/.

Every time the horse gaits I would just say "does it look like it's trotting"? (Diagonal).

Honestly I bet a lot of the horses you've seen would foxtrot with a more knowledgeable rider. Are you looking for a horse already well trained in that? Why that gait particularly?

My horse foxtrots just fine and I'm sure could be trained to have it as his "primary" very easily (I have not done this as I don't want that). But I could easily go for a ride and have him not do it at all.

Interesting O/T (if you care lol) this is my horse with Cushings/IR (laminitis) and I have noticed that he is far more pacey whereas before all this he was more trotty. I feel like he's trying to protect his feet from habit.
 
#7 · (Edited)
I'm looking at anything gaited except Peruvian Pasos (DSLD issues) and Paso Finos (to hot to be trail horses, I've tried a few). Trying to stay between 8-12 years old (I know, it's the most expensive price range).

The problem with Fox Trotters is that they're breeding out the smooth gait for the show ring, so I think people are assuming the running walk is a fox trot because it's smooth.

I really don't like pacing so I'm trying to avoid that.

Just called and left a message about this one. She seems to gait nicely, but there's issues with the canter. Could just be lack of training or another issue (would have the vet check that in the vet check). if you watch carefully the horse is breathing pretty hard. It's *possible* she's quiet in the video because she's too tired to do anything.

http://www.horseclicks.com/gentle-desensitized-mare/horses/860387
 
#9 ·
The problem with Fox Trotters is that they're breeding out the smooth gait for the show ring, so I think people are assuming the running walk is a fox trot because it's smooth.
The show world does screw up breeds all in the name to reach what some perceive as perception, it's the main reason I'm not a fan of participating in any shows whether it be horse, dog, rabbit, whatever. Saw an interesting post the other day comparing award winning dogs from 100 years ago to today, huge difference between the two. Look at how much dogs have been changed:

Comparing the Looks of Dog Breeds in 1915 and 2015

Now here's something to think about with smoothness, what's smooth to one person can be rough or uncomfortable to sit to another. My point? If you are riding for pleasure and not show then who cares what the horse is doing so long as it's comfortable to you. Don't let yourself get caught up to much in what's a "proper gait" for the breed. Let your behind decide if the gait is smooth, let your eyes decide if there is any sign of lameness, bad behavior, etc..
 
#8 ·
Ahh got it. The Foxtrotter will pace but has always been trotty and is happy to trot, just something more than before at liberty. I don't encourage pacing under saddle, I hate it too! The Icelandic does not pace.

Don't get a show horse! lol.

I'll just send you mine. He's a bit of a PITA but very smooth :P

Don't know CA much but I am surprised there are not more options in your area.
 
#12 ·
That first horse is doing what I would call a "flat walk."

My Foxtrotter mare does that too and it's awesome! But that's not a fox trot. The easiest way to feel a fox trot (when you are riding it) is the back end starts to bounce. The front end walks, the back end bounces (or jiggles). The front end will still feel like it is walking.

When you are watching it, the front end is still taking low walking strides and the back end has a bounce. The Foxtrot is actually a trot with broken timing, but it looks like the horse is still walking in the front.

Fox trotters that fox trot are still out there.......me and my neighbors have a few. But yes, it seems almost as common for them to step-pace as fox trot.

But I never saw the horse in the first post get out of a walk. It's wild how fast they can walk. :D And the flat walk is the best trail gait, imo.
 
#14 ·
That's pretty much what I was thinking. The video you posted is a horse I definitely wouldn't buy, I can see the rider bouncing. Too close to trotting. Beautiful horse otherwise. Fox trotters tend to have nice, solid conformation.

Found this video of old vs new fox trot.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wygk126aIc4

Oh well, going to try out three more horses tomorrow then two on Friday. Maybe I'll find something!
 
#16 ·
I see how the horse is breathing like it had been worked hard before the video. I also noticed that there was a running martingale being used in the first part but not later on.

That said, I would love to have that trail course, dang they put a lot of thought into it.

I like the mare, maybe you should go see her in person?
 
#17 ·
Good eye!

Yes it's hard for me to not like the video and have it translate into not liking the horse. She would probably be much happier in a different home and seemed like a good sport!

I missed the part where the rider backs her, ouch. Maybe try her in your own bit?

If you want a horse with a nicer canter as well as a "non moving" gait why don't you stick with Icelandics? Or did we already cover this, sorry.
 
#19 ·
I'm not going to say where I went, but today I checked out four gaited horses. Two could only pace, the third trotted, and the fourth was lame. They (the sellers) kept insisting one of the pacers had never paced before, and the lame one wasn't actually lame, it was just a hop in his walk. Poor horse needs to see a vet. There were a lot of other issues.

I'm staying firm that whatever I buy must gait (I don't care what gait, just not pacing or trotting). Unfortunately, nearly everything here paces. This is what I usually find (it's not one of the horses I looked at today, but it's in California):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RzhvmL2JYp0&feature=youtu.be

Off to try two more tomorrow!

Thanks for everyone's comments! Always good to have a second pair of eyes. :)
 
#20 ·
Forgot the mention the horses had good ground manners and otherwise looked healthy and cared for. All had their feet done and tack was in good condition. If anything else came up I'd go back again. You never know where you'll find your next horse!
 
#56 ·
I'm sorry to hijack the thread, but how do you train the gait? I recently rescued a MFT mare from a kill pen. I'm pretty sure she Foxtrots (I am new to riding gaited horses but it feels like she is), and she's usually pretty good about doing it naturally, but sometimes she will break into an awful hard trot and I stop her and ask again but sometimes its a fight to get her to stop hard trotting. Also, that video of the sorrel MFT that was pacing- would that be considered an acceptable trot for showing outside of gaited shows (like Dressage)? It looks more like a trot than a walk, but I do see the difference between that a Foxtrot.
 
#24 ·
@SwissMiss I agree, that playground looks like fun! However, I don't take it too seriously. Just because a horse can navigate it doesn't mean that out on the trail he'll go through water, not spook when birds fly out of the bush, or go into a bucking frenzy when you try to canter with your friends.

@Yogiwick Unfortunately neither I nor anyone else I know in So. CA has the skills to teach a pacey horse to gait. I've been to the "gaited horse trainers" here and all their horses were pacing/trotting.

I've been looking for 2 years now and it is frustrating. I wish I could give more examples of what I've seen but non-disclosure agreements are in the riding liability release forms out here. Didn't used to see them. Oh well. I'll keep trying.
 
#26 ·
Malda, correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems that SoCa has a lot of Peruvians (which you don't want) and not much else in terms of gaited horses...

Maybe you should plan a horse-search-vacation to the Southeast. A much bigger pool to choose from and with the asking price being generally lower, you may end up spending similar $, including hauling...
 
#28 ·
For some reason I'm seeing a lot of Fox Trotters for sale this time around. Used to see more TWH's. Peruvian Pasos have always been pretty rare.

I'd love to visit the South, checking out horses would be a plus. I don't know if they'd actually be cheaper when they realize I'm from the West, I'm sure they'd bump up the price. Out here people put non-disclosure requirements and "seller can not be held to advertised price and may change the price at any time..." stuff in the liability forms. It seems to be a new thing, but I assume they're also doing that in the South? So I could look at a horse advertised at 2K, but when I offer to buy the buyer can change the price to 6K, or whatever they want.

I really hate these new non-disclosure agreements. It means I can't ask a trainer for advice or go to to a message board. I'm not talking about bad mouthing a place, just advice if X horse would be good for me.
 
#27 ·
Hi, Malda. I agree with SwissMiss re searching for a gaited horse in areas where they are more common. I live in Canada and travelled to southern Kentucky to purchase my TWH mare. It would have been difficult to find a good gaited horse up here, and the price, even with shipping was better than anything around here. My mare has a nice relaxed gait. Good luck with your search. It will be worth it in the end!
 
#30 ·
Me either.

I wonder if those non disclosure agreements really legally binding, probably not but who wants to face the possibility of a lawsuit to find out?

What I would do is cross out and initial the section on non disclosure before signing any agreement. If the seller disagrees, walk. That's a red flag I just wont put up with.
 
#32 ·
Have you thought about a Standardbred? The foundation to many gaited breeds, and finding a nicely gaiting STB off the track is easy on the pocket, and go check out some OTSTB adoption facilities or trainers. I LOVE my OTSTB and he has the smoothest singlefoot you could ever ask for, on full cheek 3 piece lozenge snaffle, barefoot with only light contact. Pacers and trotters both gait, and you don't need a huge bit obviously to get these gaits.

I'm not sure if it is training or breeding, but the pace is becoming the dominate gait in many gaited breeds. Good luck and keep us posted!
 
#39 ·
My OTSTB does an incredible and very smooth saddle rack/singlefoot and if you are looking for smooth, can't beat a good racking horse. You will cover ground smoothly, with a nice style, and the gait just eats up the miles

To push Standardbreds a bit more, most STBs do a beautiful and natural saddle rack and I got STB people in CA who can help you find a horse already going in the rack and usually for a good price.
 
#40 ·
Wow, that sounds awesome! I would love to own a racking horse someday. This is my favorite gaited horse on You-tube:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s-G1gkBnHIU

I don't know if he's a Walker or a STB or??? but he is soooooo smooth racking and he also does a nice little run-walk at 2:47 of the video. Gosh, I love that horse! Does anyone know what breed he is? I get a big smile on my face every time I watch this video (or the 9 minute version of him in another video).
 
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