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Gay Rights

This is a discussion on Gay Rights within the General Off Topic Discussion forums, part of the Life Beyond Horses category

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        07-03-2012, 02:37 PM
      #151
    Trained
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by dbarabians    
    Minorities including homosexuals are not asking for special rights.
    They are asking for equal rights and protection under the law.
    Until the Federal Government passes the ENDA that will protect Gays from being fired soley because they are Gay. They lack this protection.
    I cannot fire an employee for being an ethnic or religous mionority.
    Not only is it immoral it is illegal under Federal Law.
    If we continue to call unions cerified by the states marriage then we need to call all unions marriage.
    Same sex couples are denied the rights by State and Federal governments that stratight married couples are due.
    Same sex couples must navigate legal avenues to be afforded the same rights. That is the essence of discrimination. By doing so the state is saying certain relationships are Valid while others are not.
    Even then those legal matters may be challenged in court.
    I know of several Couples where one died of AIDS with a will awarding their partner the entire estate. Familiy members of the deceased then went to court and had that will thrown out.
    Lesbians have been denied visitation in emergency rooms as their partners lay dieing.
    If that happened to one straight couple the laws would be changed overnight.
    By the way if , I fully believe that Faceman and others would not allow anyone to be harrassed or threatened in their presence.
    Shalom
    Db, honestly, w/o citing court rulings one can say a ruling was made as a result of "anything". Wills are quite difficult to overturn, so I kind of doubt one was thrown out on the basis of sexual preference.

    Well, gasp, so have "boyfriends" and "girlfriends" of "straight couples" been denied visitation in emergency rooms. But not spouses or "civil union" partners.

    And, I have never heard of anyone that was fired b/c they were gay. How would the employer know? I don't make a habit of wearing my heterosexual-ness out on my sleeve, t-shirt, etc.,. If a man made a pass at me in the work place, it wouldn't sit well w me...triple ditto for a woman. So, WHAT rights do they need "in addition" to those the rest of us "less equal" folks enjoy????
         
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        07-03-2012, 03:27 PM
      #152
    Banned
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by kitten_Val    
    Not to open a can of worms, but what do you mean by "protected groups"? I know if you are a minority (by race or gender) you can have some privileges, but I've never heard the sexual orientation is also the "minority" thing now.
    I stand corrected - my mistake. Sexual preference/orientation is NOT one of the protected groups. Having worked for the federal government, I should have those groups committed to memory, but inadvertantly included sexual orientation. Probably the reason I did is while I was with SBA, a homosexual activist, Fred Hochberg, was appointed Deputy Administrator of SBA. He instituted some initiatives at the agency to target homosexuals to try to increase the amount of SBA assistance that was being provided. As the SBA Public Affairs Officer for Arkansas, I had to shuttle him around for his interviews and photo ops whenever he came to Little Rock. For a couple of years I was pretty caught up in trying to serve the homosexual community as best I could, so I tend to think of them as a priviledged group when it comes to federal government assistance, but after reviewing the various CFR regs, as I said, I stand corrected...
         
        07-03-2012, 03:42 PM
      #153
    Banned
    [QUOTE=dbarabians;1576367]May I remind all that there is a young 14 YO girl participating in this thread.

    But I bet that you would not care about her being young if she believed what you believed and didnt voice her opinion. Life experiances don't always chance a religion or believes so please do not think she does not know what she is talking about because she is young.
    Personally I think this thread is based on everyones personal beliefs and we all have diffrent ones.We all should respect everyones opinions and agree to disagree.
         
        07-03-2012, 03:52 PM
      #154
    Banned
    Quote:
    May I remind all that there is a young 14 YO girl participating in this thread.
    But, I bet that if she believed what you believed you would not point that out to make her sound like she does not know what she is talking about.Indeed maybe she does. She has the same opinion as many others and you should not make it out to be like what she says is less important than you and everyone else. Being older does not always change believes.It also make your opinion more important than hers. Personally I think this thread is more pointed toward a very iffy topic. Over all lets agree to disagree and respect everyone while doing so.
         
        07-03-2012, 03:57 PM
      #155
    Showing
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by dbarabians    
    Minorities including homosexuals are not asking for special rights.
    They are asking for equal rights and protection under the law.
    dba, I have to disagree with you (and I'm talking about minorities based on gender and race now, NOT orientation (because I don't know about the latter)). Almost any company asks about your gender and race, and when there is a hiring process going on the minorities get "extra points". Same happens when you apply to the college. Moreover the "minority-owned" companies have privileges as well when it comes to contracts etc. And personally I don't think it's fair (and I'm speaking as a (strong) minority by gender in my field of education): I don't think selection should be made based on gender or race, but rather on how you fit in and some other parameters.
    Missy May likes this.
         
        07-03-2012, 04:11 PM
      #156
    Trained
    Barrel runner It was not the discussion I had a problem with.
    It was the tone of the discussion and the way the debate was turning into a name calling session of put downs.
    My point was that as adults we will set the example for her.
    We did not need to personalize it.
    A few people did address her directly rather pointedly I might add.
    As a therapist I can control a debate and from experience know when to steer it into a more positive direction.
    As I posted it will not be what we say that she will remember as much as how we say it.
    Adults do still have the responsibility of leading by example.
    Shalom
         
        07-03-2012, 04:21 PM
      #157
    Trained
    Missy May I know of what I speak.
    Several judges have plainly stated that the wills were overturned due to homosexual unions being immoral and not legal. Therefore ruling for the family.
    If you do no live in a state or city that does recognize same sex unions or marriages then visitation at hospitals is not allowed due to next of kin.
    That is a fact.
    Those 2 examples are of how gays and lesbians are discriminated against by states not recognizing civil unions and marraiges peformed elsewhere.
    Don't believe me use your computer and Google some cases.
    Once again if you do not live in a city or state that prohibits employment discrimination due to Sexual orientation then Gays and lesbians are not protected.
    Anyone who does not believe that any minority can still face discrimination you need to open your eyes. Shalom
    Ray MacDonald likes this.
         
        07-03-2012, 04:41 PM
      #158
    Trained
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by dbarabians    
    Missy May I know of what I speak.
    Several judges have plainly stated that the wills were overturned due to homosexual unions being immoral and not legal. Therefore ruling for the family.
    If you do no live in a state or city that does recognize same sex unions or marriages then visitation at hospitals is not allowed due to next of kin.
    That is a fact.
    Those 2 examples are of how gays and lesbians are discriminated against by states not recognizing civil unions and marraiges peformed elsewhere.
    Don't believe me use your computer and Google some cases.
    Once again if you do not live in a city or state that prohibits employment discrimination due to Sexual orientation then Gays and lesbians are not protected.
    Anyone who does not believe that any minority can still face discrimination you need to open your eyes. Shalom
    Db, although our justice system is all but gone, judges do not have the authority to make up laws from the bench. Immoral lifestyles of the deceased is not included in laws that govern wills. Now, there are such things as happy little settlement courts where almost anything goes, your rights are not considered...and which were pushed heavily by "progressives". Settlement agreements are NOT the same as an actual court ruling.

    If a judge makes a ruling for which there is no known law, it can be appealed. It is not just gay people that might be the victom of an incompetent judge, in fact statistically they would be far less likely to be a victom. So, again, they are asking for "more equal" rights....i.e., to be protected from incompetent judges, whereas the rest of us will just have to suffer.
         
        07-03-2012, 10:09 PM
      #159
    Trained
    Missy May the problem with overturning a gay couples will is that a judge can then overturn yours or mine.
    Our courts are run and presided over by Judges that are elected or appointed to the bench for political reasons.
    Judges interpret the law and pass judgement based on their own opinions.
    If you have a judge that favors same sex marriage then your chances of winning a case about same sex marriage is good.
    Look at California. A gay judge overturned their law. It is now headed to the Supreme Court. Where it stands a good chance of being defeated.
    Remember in 2003 Kennedy voted to overturn anti sodomy laws in all 50 states. The Defense of Marriage Act may become history.
    The Supreme Court has the power to do just that. Shalom
         
        07-03-2012, 10:59 PM
      #160
    Foal
    Please don't get rude, as I said in my first post.
    I am perfectly fine with hearing peoples opinions, but you don't have to be a jerk about it. I am just trying to share my opinion and something I thought had a lot of truth in it.
         

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