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Guns, laws, etc

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    04-06-2012, 04:13 PM
  #81
Trained
Yes, our countries and cultures differ. I liked my visit to Australia (1986, Darwin), but have no desire to move there - to the relief of many Australians, I'm sure.

Quote:
Originally Posted by blue eyed pony    
...God gave us our hands and teeth to defend ourselves with, PEOPLE gave us guns and knives.
Or as the old saying goes, "God didn't create all men equal. Col Colt did!"



A year ago, my neighbor (60 year old woman with a bum leg) thought she heard someone trying to force a window. She called the cops. They arrived in just 35 minutes. I told her if it happened again, to give me a call. I'm pushing 54 real hard, a bit chubby & wear bifocals, but I'd cross the street to check on a neighbor.

And if there are 3-4 guys there, then my 44 will help even the odds. Maybe. Or maybe they will shoot me. But it is a safe bet that my odds would be better than if I cross the street with my "hands and teeth to defend [myself and others] with"...
     
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    04-06-2012, 04:34 PM
  #82
Green Broke
Quote:
Originally Posted by MorabMom    
I'm not quite sure what my horse would do if I had to fire it, but I believe I'd be better off taking the chance.

This reminds me of a story I heard awhile back. Seems a fellow wanted to rent a horse to hunt elk off of.

He asked the horses owner if he could shoot off the horse and the owner replied "sure"!

Well, the fellow came back all black and blue and confronted the horse owner with " I though you said I could shoot off this horse"?

The owner looked at him and said "Sure, I said you could shoot off the horse, but I never said what the horse would do"!!!
     
    04-06-2012, 05:00 PM
  #83
Trained
In the USA we have a constitutional right to arm ourselves. This is for two reasons.

The first reason is to protect ourselves from would be attackers.

The second and most important reason is to protect ourselves from would be dictators. We are always having government rules and regulations trying to limit our civil rights; however, if they try to totally destroy our freedom, we can band together to form a militia and protect ourselves. Our forefathers wanted to prevent us from being taken over by the Adolf Hitler types. Our government is far from perfect, but it beats most of the other things out there.

As far as self protection, in my neighborhood, even the ancient little old ladies keep a gun by their bed, and if somebody breaks in when they are home alone, the little old ladies are going to shoot the devil out of them. There will be no charges filed. The little old lady might even get an award.
Missy May likes this.
     
    04-06-2012, 06:58 PM
  #84
Weanling
Quote:
Originally Posted by blue eyed pony    
it's illegal to sell a knife to any person under the age of 18 in Australia - even a butter knife - if it's made of metal).

Oddly enough, we have less gun crime here in Aus than in the US. Perhaps because fewer people have guns. Perhaps because we're taught from the very beginning to be scared of them and not use them.
Assuming this is true (per captial? Total gun crime? What counts as a gun crime, etc.) I would say that having less gun crimes is probably linked to having less guns. That's a logical argument.

However, your laws also seem to imply there is a much higher incidence of butter knife violence in Aus than in the US. :)

The point is that people will commit violent acts with or without access to guns. You can outlaw butter knives, and they will resort to rocks, or a chair, or a car.

A big difference, and one that applies to the original topic, is that firearms represent an equalizing force when used in self defense.

A typical 250lb violent adult male vs a 100lb young girl (or out of shape middle aged guy): both have rocks, both have sticks, both have knives... the outcome will typically favor the 250lb violent attacker.

Give both a gun and they are essentially equals in the confrontation. A typical attacker will only attack when the odds favor him. You don't usually read about professional football players getting mugged - it is usually some old lady. Attackers look for weakness. A young girl riding her horse alone in the woods is an attractive target. Put a gun on her hip and she is no longer a target. That's simple fact.

Quote:
Guns terrify me.
As they do many people. As the risk of sounding like a conspiracy theorist, that fear has been taught to you and drilled in by the government and media.

A gun in the hand of an unbalanced and unsafe person terrifies me. I was in a sporting good store last week buying a rifle and the halfwit down the counter kept sweeping me with a shotgun. Sure it was unloaded, but that is unsafe practice and makes the hair on my neck stand up.

On the other hand, I am at the range often and attend many firearm events. There are many VERY responsible people I am around who constantly carry loaded firearms. Knowing these people as I do, I feel more safe than ever knowing there is a loaded firearm nearby being handled by a person who "has my back."

Not getting political here, but Pres. Obama made an interesting quip a while back. He is considered an anti-gun person, but he told the press that he has no worries about his daughters dating because they are accompanied by armed agents. It was a joke, but it highlights the hypocrisy. Many "anti-gun" celebrities in the US either have armed guards with them or have full carry permits themselves. They encourage the fear of guns in you (us) but make sure they have ready access to these same guns.

It is all about power and a belief that these politicians and celebrities are above everyone else and don't have to follow the same rules. They want the ability to stop you from defending yourself without allowing you the same.

It's not the gun you should be scared of. It is the person. If they want to harm you, they don't need a gun. Heck, it's easier to run you down with a car (and get away with it).


One more minor point:

Quote:
Originally Posted by celeste
In the USA we have a constitutional right to arm ourselves.
Minor semantic quibble. The Declaration of Independence states: "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness."

The Constitution has ten rights enumerated in the Bill of Rights. These rights are not "constitutional rights" as they are not granted by the constitution. The bill of rights simply recognizes these rights as so fundamental it specifically prohibits the government from restricting them.
     
    04-06-2012, 07:29 PM
  #85
Trained
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tazmanian Devil    

One more minor point:


Minor semantic quibble. The Declaration of Independence states: "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness."

The Constitution has ten rights enumerated in the Bill of Rights. These rights are not "constitutional rights" as they are not granted by the constitution. The bill of rights simply recognizes these rights as so fundamental it specifically prohibits the government from restricting them.
I'm glad this is not a test.
I never did too well in history class........
     
    04-06-2012, 07:47 PM
  #86
Weanling
Quote:
Originally Posted by Celeste    
I'm glad this is not a test.
I never did too well in history class........
:) At least I'm agreeing with you.

It just sticks with me because when you consider it a right granted by the constitution you are effectively saying the government "grants" you that right - free speech, freedom of religion, right to privacy, right to bear arms. Any right the government can grant you, they can just as easily take away.

Can you imagine how "revolutionary" that concept was at the time it was written? We basically came from a system where "God" selected from a special class of people (aristocracy) to have one granted the divine right and power to rule over the "lesser" classes. Our system of government stood that all on its ear.

"All men created equal," right to free speech and to redress the government. Right to bear arms in the event the government got out of control (disclaimer - I am not suggesting revolution, just pointing out what the framers intended). That's all controversial enough now. Imagine it in the context of the 1700s. These guys had come juevos.
     
    04-07-2012, 07:23 AM
  #87
Started
Quote:
Originally Posted by mildot    
It used to be $20, it's now $100. Mine's up for renewal in July and I saw the fee increase in the current form: http://www.nh.gov/safety/divisions/n...ts/dssp260.pdf



I don't think we're close at all. It would be nice though for both state and federal governments to follow the full faith and credit clause all the time, not just when it suits them.

That's non resident permits. I believe resident permits are still $10. There would have been a giant uproar here if they raised the resident fees too much. In the north country every other car has got a gun in it. The resident licenses come out of the local police dept or the selectmans office if they have no PD.

Section 159:6 License to Carry.
     
    04-07-2012, 11:57 AM
  #88
Yearling
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tazmanian Devil    
One more minor point:



Minor semantic quibble. The Declaration of Independence states: "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness."

The Constitution has ten rights enumerated in the Bill of Rights. These rights are not "constitutional rights" as they are not granted by the constitution. The bill of rights simply recognizes these rights as so fundamental it specifically prohibits the government from restricting them.
Actually the "Bill of Rights" are ammendments to the Constitutions. They just happen to have been the first 10, all ratified together and called the "Bill of Rights". Some have been suspended for periods of time even as resently as the past 10 years the. Like all ammendments to the US Constitution they can be removed by means of an ammendment (all changes are ammendments. Even the act of repealing an ammendment).
     
    04-07-2012, 01:10 PM
  #89
Trained
Blue eyed. The vast majority of murders/attacks (by a per capita measure) do not occur in the agricultural areas in the US, either. They are in the cities. And, automatic weapons and sawed off shotguns are not legal in the US, either - without special permits that are not handed out like candy...and actually are rarely approved. This is why there is semi-auto.

The US does not have loose gun laws, they are getting stricter every year. This is a bad thing. People in congress believe that if something is illegal, no one will do it - they like to use narcotics as their shining example of how true this is.

Unless and until illegal drug trade is completely eliminated in the US, one should not need a permit to carry any legal weapon, concealed or not. What could that measure possibly prevent? A nut from committing a mass random shooting? Nothing is going to prevent that. Criminals do not care about the law, including and especially "gun laws".

If criminals attacked only those that believe in strict gun control, we would all be safe....they are both dangerous.
     
    04-07-2012, 02:19 PM
  #90
Foal
Criminals For Gun Control

kevinshorses and SueNH like this.
     

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