PEACEFUL debate/response, anyone? Homosexual parents, heterosexual parents - Page 3 - The Horse Forum
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post #21 of 54 Old 02-20-2013, 11:17 PM
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That is no scientific study. To claim to be it would take thousands of people and many years to complete.
A child deserves a loving home with parents that love care and are INVOLVED in their day to day lives.
Most studies have shown that children raised in same sex households do as well as those of traditional families.
A child doesnt care who you have sex with just that you care for and love them. That fund raising attempt masquerading as a scientific study is useless. Not one bit of factual evidence to support its claim. Shalom
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post #22 of 54 Old 02-21-2013, 08:33 AM
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If anyone is interested in seeing counter arguments, take a look at this site.

Home - NLLFS - National Lesbian Longitudinal Family Study
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post #23 of 54 Old 02-21-2013, 08:58 AM
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Considering that there are many examples of children from what we consider to be 'normal' households that are abused, neglected, unloved, even sexually abused by a father/adopted father that surely the emphasis has to be on a loving stable relationship that puts the needs and the rights of the children first and I believe that loving homosexual couples can do that just as well as anyone else.
Might be wise to remember that its actually in our recent history that homosexuality even became legal and many men and women of that 'orientation' opted into 'normal' marriages so that they could be fathers and mothers and look respectable and I'd say that most of them made as good a job of it as anyone else.
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post #24 of 54 Old 02-21-2013, 09:27 AM
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Originally Posted by TerciopeladoCaballo View Post
I didn't know you wanted it. It's nice not to use sarcasm or be haughty, please :)

I'm guessing you either have been snapped at too many times and have a bitter outlook/defense, Speed, or you are seeking to put people down rather than debate? I hope not, that isn't productive. Something prevents you from offering your own opinion with a calm attitude. I expect a snarky reply, then; prove that expectation wrong, if you will.
Nice psychobabble there, Tercio. Exactly what I expected. If you don't have a good answer, insult the the questioner.

I asked you to provide your opinions first, since you started the topic. How does that make me bitter, haughty, sarcastic, or put you down?

I believe if someone starts a controversial topic, they're honor bound to give their opinions first. That way it really is a debate, and not just the OP sitting back watching other people give their opinions. I'm not bitter, I'm merely jaded at people who believe they're so much more intelligent than the rabble at whom they're pontificating.

I read the article. It wasn't anything more than hate-mongering by 'good' Christians, and their 'facts' and 'statistics' were so badly skewed as to be total nonsense. It also insulted a good many individuals, not just homosexual couples. Single mothers got quite a hit, too. Funny, I've known more than a few people raised by single mothers who turned out to be fantastic human beings and decent, hardworking, contributing members of society. I imagine children raised by same sex parents in a committed, loving relationship have the chance to turn out the same way.

Groups who use 'statistics' to promote their hate filled agendas aren't new, but I can't believe any rational, intelligent adult who can think for themselves would give any credence to this ridiculous 'study'.

You want the truth? You can't HANDLE the truth!

Last edited by Speed Racer; 02-21-2013 at 09:37 AM.
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post #25 of 54 Old 02-21-2013, 09:43 AM
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I'm so proud to be a part of this community!!
As I began reading through this thread, I got progressively more frustrated and angry to the point that I was going to have to post a response. But as I came to the posts where the community started sharing their opinions, I found that you all have said everything I felt the need to say and more. You guys rock!
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post #26 of 54 Old 02-21-2013, 09:58 AM
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Most of us are rather open minded and dare I say, somewhat liberal in our thinking, enh.

There's a reason that although I consider myself Christian, I refuse to adhere to any one particular denomination or religious group. Christ had wonderful ideas and a loving doctrine, but unfortunately His followers have twisted them to fit their hateful, abhorrent ideas of what's supposed to be normal and good.

I imagine the majority of intelligent people are organized religion's worst nightmare; free thinking!

You want the truth? You can't HANDLE the truth!

Last edited by Speed Racer; 02-21-2013 at 10:01 AM.
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post #27 of 54 Old 02-21-2013, 10:01 AM
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Hmmmmmm......where is the OP now that we are not 'biting'?
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post #28 of 54 Old 02-21-2013, 05:03 PM
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Originally Posted by SouthernTrailsGA View Post
I guess I am strange too
That's always been a given, ST.

You want the truth? You can't HANDLE the truth!

Last edited by Speed Racer; 02-21-2013 at 05:06 PM.
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post #29 of 54 Old 02-21-2013, 06:18 PM
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This "study" is BS.

It's posted by a church group, on a RELIGIOUS website with NO viable sources to back up their ridiculous claims. A slight hint of bias anyone?

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post #30 of 54 Old 02-21-2013, 07:39 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Allison Finch View Post
Hmmmmmm......where is the OP now that we are not 'biting'?

Here I am.

Can't expect me to be online every day, that would be derogatory.

I was being analytical of the learning/parenting process. Doesn't matter to me where the articles come from as long as the tests are legit; on such political issues, at least in my personal experience, I can't find thorough articles that are not related somehow to a religious group (including atheists/agnostics) or a political group. The article itself that portrays the data is limited to public view, this was the only site I could find that had a large portion of the studies online. That was my attempt to be fair; I was a bit hopeful of people to ignore any external factors.

So for being picky about people being raised by other people; now, I do not mean to discriminate strictly based on ethnic groups, but it is seen worldwide that people of the same culture or religion will gather together. Putting aside any thought of conspiracy, I would think this is a large factor in why you can see, essentially in early American history, groups of people from the same nationality forming their own towns inside a larger group. America is interesting (I am Austrian-Irish) as it shows a kind of diversity, yet separation at the same time, as you will travel throughout some parts of a state and find neighborhoods with Cherokes living close to each other, Italians living close to each other, so on so forth, though all will identify as Americans. Still, my point is that people of close biological traits tend to relate easily and soothed in the company of their groups. Interestingly, there is no 'race gene' that says "You are Italian," but there are traits that will occur frequently in certain places of the globe, which is majorly just natural selection over time.
I mean to say that birds of a feather flock together, colts learn to snake mares by watching stallions, and mares learn to mother by watching other mares; advanced needs are less complicated that way. For example, a woman of major Egyptian descent looks quite different than a woman of Norwegian descent. Giving to people's inclination to consider encounters at face value strictly, a person of Japanese descent won't know the difference between a man or woman of the bloodlines--- if you look only at the face of many different people worldwide, it can be difficult to figure out the gender and age. To a person outside those bloodlines, all they can go by is the person's word of mouth to identify their age, gender, and nationality when they have not seen people of those categories. So, now nobody really knows what a man or woman looks like, and clothes aren't much of a help as outfits vary widely.

The ability to identify our own members of the same species is detoriating--- and when you think about it, our ability to recognize subtle facial expressions and vocal intonations is as well thanks to electronic communications. I don't quite see such an appeal on announcing yourself to strictly relate romantically to one gender, or rather, the traits of that gender, because you do have masculine women of all orientations and the reverse as well. I don't think it's the gender that people are focusing on deeply, but the traits they believe are associated (for example, five gays I have met over the course of three months only engaged in relationships with men with at least three obvious traits in common such as face shape and body build). That there is an observation, though, nothing to really go off solely, as you do have preferences, but on several occassions when I introduced a gay friend to women with broad shoulders, he stopped dating altogether and spent time with the women instead. I can say of that, at a minimum, he was pleased with their bodily appearance.

So with parenting, I would want parents to raise a child in a widespread education. Of course in the situation of a child being dragged through a murky broken home or being re-homed to a person with a steady job and lifestyle who happens to be homo, the child goes to the homosexual. No group is immune from the same problems. If there's a person of sound mind, go ahead, I just wouldn't put a child from a broken home in a household where the parents are biased, whatever their lifestyle and belief is. Anybody who has had a shelter Pit Bull from a dogfighting past knows that the dog does not go to someone who will only pour love and kisses on it. Love and kisses do not keep the dog from ripping apart living beings, it is hard for me to hear someone say "as long as you love me/him/her/them," because you can love someone with all your heart, but being with you might not be best for that person. It takes more than love to raise a child, dog, cat, horse, et cetera. There are plenty of situations where people are in poverty trying to care for their children. If you gave these people the choice between holding onto their child, or giving the child to a rich boarding school where they probably would be indoctrinated but well cared for... You know the outcome, and this has happened in history all over the globe, poor people handing off their children in hopes of their children being cared for better. Then there are the times where mothers have thrown their children off cliffs and dove in with them to avoid the shame of surrendering to the enemy nation, but, that's the darker side of this point.

I skimmed the reply posts a bit, they don't look too nasty, I didn't catch anyone gnawing on each other's throats. Strong topic = strong emotions.

Speed; spectacular debacle. I haven't heard "psychobabble" in a while, not since Wedding Crashers. I can't tell exactly what you were remarking on, whether it was my meaning or my word choice.

Well, I'll take a tiny step. You are helping me with analyzing practice, thank you, though I wanted to stay on topic.

There is more than one definition of "bitter"; I meant "unpleasant to reception". That's a matter of tone and diction; you were so serious, I believed you could choose another theme of diction. I apologize for this mistake, it's hard to decipher meanings from colloquialisms. Usually it is appropriate to gently state an opinion of a hot topic. It is also appropriate to slap a smiley face on the end of it when using the internet, for lack of a face.

Sadly you did not prove me wrong. I praise you for paragraph spacings though, your generous sharing of commas and verbals were customary but relevant to your own points. More of a descriptive anecdote and a bit of explanation to the use of harsh words such as "hate" would improve the structure. Overall it was skeletal, I suggest to weigh future remarks with irrefutable claims and citations next time.
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