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Vegetarian and Vegan members

This is a discussion on Vegetarian and Vegan members within the General Off Topic Discussion forums, part of the Life Beyond Horses category

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    06-16-2013, 08:58 PM
I'm always interested in vegetarian recipes so I can cook for my vegetarian friends but my going vegetarian....not likely I tried once and then my Dad made steak for dinner...didn't stick too long. But hey at least I gave bit a go.....right?
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    06-17-2013, 09:47 AM
Super Moderator
Originally Posted by Lockwood    
I have never been able to make tofu taste good, so it is usually just added to a meal as a stand in and I quit trying to make it a star ingredient.
Smothered in something tasty tofu can be edible, just gotta think about something else.

Now I know many of you may not want to make cheeses, but I have learned how to make cheese and it opened some good dining choices. There is a nice, mild, and super easy home cheese you can make that is far more useful than tofu. It can be used just like firm tofu... in that it doesn't melt or get gooey, keeps it shape under heat, and is the pure protein portion of the milk. But, it tastes soooo much better than tofu.
It is easily flavored to many cuisine styles, palettes, and dishes.
(If anyone is interested I can post how to make it..)

But anyway, that's my answer on how to make tofu taste good.
Please post - not sure about making it at this point in time but I like to keep ideas on file
Is this made from cow or goats milk?
    06-17-2013, 11:25 AM
Green Broke
I too would like the cheese instructions.

I'm not vegetarian. We eat tons and tons of fruits/veggies but never turn down a good steak. Animal welfare does concern me and so I now raise 99% of the meat/eggs we eat.

It's rather nice to know that Miss Piggy, Wilbur, Porky, Bacon, Elvis Piggsley, Dr Evil Porkchop, Hamm, Wings, Turkey Lurkey, Gobble Gobble, Sir Loin, Georgie and all the rest were fat, happy and very well-loved until we parted ways and they landed in my freezer.

I have zero qualms about collecting/eating eggs. I'd have thousands of rotten eggs otherwise as in the past two years TWO hens have gone broody. One abandoned her eggs after two weeks when she realized it was grasshopper season and she was missing out and the other is rather halfheartedly sitting on a Polish egg she stole (because laying her own is apparently too much work). Half the time she manages to con another hen into sitting on the egg for her!
    06-17-2013, 08:28 PM
Super Moderator
Originally Posted by jaydee    
Please post - not sure about making it at this point in time but I like to keep ideas on file
Is this made from cow or goats milk?
The recipe calls for cow or goat milk, either fresh or store bought.
I've only made it with fresh goat milk. And no, I don't like the goaty-ness that some people like about some goat cheese. (Not all goat cheese is goaty, just depends.)

This cheese can be made with vinegar or lemon juice, I prefer lemon juice, which does not come through in the finished product. Do not use lime juice unless you really like the taste of lime in your cheeses.....ask me how I know this.

Queso Blanco/Panir
4 quarts whole milk
1/4 cup white vinegar
1/4 to 1/2 cup lemon juice (bottled is ok)

1. Warm milk in large stainless steel pot (not aluminum) over medium heat to 180 degrees F, stirring gently to prevent scorching. Once at 180, reduce heat to low for a few minutes (to allow entire gallon to reach temperature evenly) then remove from heat.

2. Add vinegar (or lemon juice) slowly while stirring. Continue stirring until there is a clear separation and the solids rise to the top. (Will be white and look clumpy or stringy, while the liquids will be somewhat clearish.) If there is not clear separation within 10 minutes, add another 1/8 to 1/4 cup vinegar (or lemon juice) and continue stirring.

3. Pour contents into a cloth lined colander (I have used clean cotton, cheese cloth, and butter muslin, all work fine) and let drain. Gather the corners of the cloth and tie together like a bag and hang for several hours.
(Hang time depends on the texture you like. See my notes below)

4. Unwrap, flavor as desired, and store in a covered bowl in the fridge.

Easy peasy lemon squeezey....literally.

Here is a Queso Blanco recipe with pics so you know what the separation looks like.
Queso Blanco

My own notes:
- I aim to get a temp between 180 to 183. Stay under 185.
- With fresh goat milk the curds (solids) separate very quickly.
- I drain the pot through the colander as noted above, but instead of letting it go down the drain I catch it in another pot. This is the whey portion. It is full of nutrients still and is good for cooking with and baking with. Or, my chickens love it. It also adds nutrients to a compost heap if you are not inclined to use it for cooking and doní»t have chickens.
- Draining and hanging- Most recipes call for draining or hanging for a few hours, but I have found my separation is so good with lemon juice and if I drain it more than a few minutes, it becomes dry and crumbly much quicker.
- Flavors - This cheese will take up just about any flavor you might like in cheese or cheese dishes. As soon as I remove it from the cloth and it is still warm, I drizzle mine with a little olive oil and a sprinkle of salt and work it in. Then I might add sun dried tomatoes, a little garlic and herbs. The flavor is up to you, but olive oil helps incorporate and meld the flavors.

Here is an excerpt from a goat dairy website that tells how to use Panir like tofu -

"Now that you have this rubbery ball of cheese, what do you do with it? Panir is like tofu: it will take on the flavor of the food it is cooked with. Just cut it into bite-sized cubes and throw it into chili or spaghetti. You can cook the noodles in the leftover whey. You will need to cook them a little longer than usual; test to make sure they're done to your liking. I love pasta cooked in whey. I always save whey just for this purpose. Try serving your chili over vermicelli cooked in whey, topped with a sprinkle of cheese, some sprouts and a dollop of yogurt (goat of course).

You could use Panir as a meat extender/replacement. Since we are vegetarian, we use a lot of Panir. When you make taco meat, I cut it up in tiny cubes and simmer it with the meat for about an hour. I make "chick'n a la king" using cubes of Panir instead of meat. A quick dinner is mac'n cheese, made from a box, but also add onions, Panir cubes, peas and use buttermilk in place of regular milk.

You can marinade the Panir and throw it on top of salads or use it in stir-fry. Panir is really in its element when used in curry. Serve the curry over rice cooked with whey instead of water and add a handful of raisins and a clove to the rice as well, to make it really authentic.
There are endless uses for Panir, so make some of this quick and easy cheese and experiment for yourself."
    06-17-2013, 09:30 PM
Green Broke
I've been vegan for six years now, and vegetarian my entire life (I'm 23). I find parts of it easy and parts of it tricky.

What I find easy is the practical side. I don't get how people have difficulty understanding what I eat... I can eat pretty much anything they eat, I just change it around a bit. Very few people just eat steaks and drink milk, they eat a range of foods. Most places have vegan and vegetarian options to eat. I traveled through Europe and parts of Asia and had no problem being vegan. I think it would be kind of awful to walk through a supermarket and be able to eat everything, there would be no excitement finding a new product, no frequenting specialist stores, no understanding of everything you eat. Sure some "meat eaters" try new things, but many people I meet don't even know what quinoa is, and it's brilliant for everyone! I never feel restricted or as though cooking is difficult or time consuming.

What I am finding increasingly hard is balancing what I think with how I live. As a vegetarian kid everything was black and white, even as a teenager. But as an adult it's harder.

I choose to eat this way because I like animals, and that will never change. But lately it's harder to value life. Like going to horse sales I know I could save the life of some of them.. but I don't. I bought well bred puppy rather than rescuing one, it's hard seeing one life as significant when there are so many others that are not, and it makes me sad that I now think this way. I own leather things and that bothers me.

The way I see it is that everyone has a line, we just draw it in different places. Meat eaters will argue that, saying morality isn't subjective but rather objective (as long as what they do is the norm). Many people are happy eating a cow or chicken but would draw the line at a dog, or maybe some kind of protected or endangered animal, like a tiger. And obviously humans. They say it's not same, but it is in the way that we make the personal choice to say this is where it stops being okay, we all draw lines at different places. So people joke about killing vegetables, and such, but I draw my line where I draw it. And it's arbitrary line, I'll be the first to admit it, but we all do it. My line is at a different places to theirs, and it might not make sense to me, but they don't make sense to me either. How can you eat a cow and not a cat? Why is a pig fair game but god forbid someone eat dolphin? Then people will accuse me of saying it's okay to eat dolphins or whales or tigers, but they don't get that to me it's not okay to eat any of it and that was the point all along.

Where-ever I go people constantly "go" me about it. Whether it's asking ridiculous and insulting questions, making constant comments or just treating me differently. Eating with other people, whether at work or uni or flatmates people will waive meat food at me, or biscuits and go "oh this is so nice" "just have a bite" etc. I don't ever really get upset or comment, normally I just palm it off with a joke but people wouldn't do this to other people.

If an obese person were on a diet to lose weight it would be grossly inappropriate to come and wave chocolate cake in their face. If a Muslim were at a workplace people would not joke about their religion, wave a crucifix at them and start quoting all the benefits of the bible. In fact that would probably be illegal.

And then there is the bringing up of current events for innocent "discussion". Which is just a cover for someone preaching to me about their beliefs. Again, if it were religion, or homosexuality or a range of other things people would not bring it up. It would be inappropriate to comment on, and argue with, the way someone lives their life. But not with this. It's plain rude and not something a friend would do.

It's not that different what I do to religion or anything. It's something I do everyday, and I have done it without fail for over 20 years. I do it when it's easy and when it's hard, and I make life choices based on that. I don't tell others how to live and eat, but if I just sit there people will come and tell me how to live and eat, and expect me to defend my choices. Tell me how it's just unreasonable what I do. Blame me for farmer's suicides (it has happened). I've been called a "crazy vegan" countless times.

No one gets how I can be into horses, apparently it's "un-vegetarian" keeping and riding horses. It's okay when a meat eating person keeps and rides a horse but when a vegan keeps and rides a horse it's suddenly "cruel" to keep them locked in paddocks, and "abusive" riding them about. I don't get it. But I just do what I do and if people don't like, well I couldn't really care less about them. I'll live my life how I choose and that is that.

Okay... so end rant. Sorry about that.

But does anyone else get this?

I live out in the country and everyone is just so different from me in every way and I feel like I am constantly justifying and defending my beliefs from my "friends". Do other people get this?

And I feel I have to justify horse riding to other horse riders! For some reason they think it's immoral for me to ride... I just don't get it
lovexlaugh likes this.
    06-17-2013, 09:37 PM
Originally Posted by Foxhunter    
It is a fact that a vegetarian diet is healthier for the human body than a diet that includes red meat.
Can you provide reliable evidence for this? I'm not being confrontational, I'm genuinely curious. I find the possibility very interesting, given our evolutionary process, and the way we assimilate nutrients in our bodies. (What I'm really wondering is if red meat is targeted specifically due to it's saturated fat content? Must research.)

I've done a lot of self-experimentation in regards to different ways of eating, including vegetarian and vegan. Heck, one time I even followed the Food Guide! Due to dairy, beef, gluten and egg allergies, I was a "near vegan" for a couple of years, but once those issues were resolved, I went back to my meat-eating ways. Still don't consume a lot of dairy and I prefer wild meat, but I'm a sucker for fresh eggs!

I'll admit that I've never really understood what motivates people to become vegan but I'm under the impression that the reasons are morally/ethically-based rather than health-based. I'd love to hear some perspectives. However, I can respect those choices and I am in awe of the creativity of the vegan/vegetarian cooks I know!
    06-17-2013, 10:34 PM
Green Broke
Originally Posted by Saskia    
I think it would be kind of awful to walk through a supermarket and be able to eat everything, there would be no excitement finding a new product, no frequenting specialist stores, no understanding of everything you eat. Sure some "meat eaters" try new things, but many people I meet don't even know what quinoa is, and it's brilliant for everyone!
Just because we eat meat doesn't mean we ONLY eat meat, nor does it mean we live under a rock.

Quinoa isn't exactly a mainstream popular food but it certainly is gaining in popularity and most people I know have tried it or eat it on a regular basis.

I serve it quite often but I *gasp* cook it in CHICKEN broth... I know... the horror!

I frequent specialty stores.... most folks I know do. Specialty stores tend to have a good selection of fresh, local produce and inexpensive grains in bulk.

Who are you to say I have no understanding of what I eat!!?? Do YOU go outside and personally raise all those veggies you consume? Do YOU plant seeds, watch them grow and then harvest everything yourself? Not only do I raise as much of our produce as possible (from seed to harvest) that we consume but I am standing there as each animal baby is born on our farm. I name our babies, I castrate them if needed, I feed our babies, I give them whatever medicines are needed, I treat any owies, I love them, I bring them treats, I scratch their itchy lil cow horns, I play ball with the baby piggies and when it's time I butcher many of them myself and the others I drive to the butcher and stay with them until they are hanging on the rack. Every animal on our property runs when they hear me calling... one of these days I'm going to break my neck tripping over goats, chickens, piggies and calves as everyone feels the need to crowd around and follow me everywhere.

Not sure how one could have any more of an understanding of their food and I am *gasp* an EVIL MEAT EATER!!
Stan likes this.
    06-17-2013, 10:36 PM
If an obese person were on a diet to lose weight it would be grossly inappropriate to come and wave chocolate cake in their face.
The problem lies in that quote right there. When anybody is doing anything in regards to their food that isn't the 'norm' people feel like they have the right to poke fun at them, insult them, wave food in their faces, etc. I talk to a lot of people who are trying to lose weight and a lot of them find that people are so astounded that an obese person would choose to diet and lose weight that they think it's okay to say things along the lines of 'why eat x, y, and z, it isn't working'. When someone is focused on health, and chooses not to eat fast food (especially if they're not overweight) they get 'you don't need to eat healthy, you're already skinny' or 'you need to eat a hamburger'. The fact is- what someone else is eating is absolutely nobody elses business. If someone decides they want to be vegetarian then awesome, if someone decides to eat meat then okay that's great, nobody should preach THEIR ways at someone else just because a diet that might work for them might not work for you and that includes poking fun, waving food in your face, making rude comments, etc.
    06-17-2013, 11:01 PM
Originally Posted by Saskia    
. I think it would be kind of awful to walk through a supermarket and be able to eat everything, there would be no excitement finding a new product, no frequenting specialist stores, no understanding of everything you eat. Sure some "meat eaters" try new things, but many people I meet don't even know what quinoa is, and it's brilliant for everyone!
ummmm what? I get excited about new products all the time, in fact it's generally harder to find vegan things and vegetarian things. Just because something has no meet doesn't mean I won't eat it in fact I eat veggies as breakfast most days, I can still go to specialty stores but because my diet isn't as limited by the typical grocery store options I'm not going to out of my way to find one. I understand most things I eat, it's food it's not that complicated. Almost every meat eater I know tries new things at every opportunity and the sames goes for knowing what quinoa is, we sell a quinoa salad at work and it's one of the most popular items.
    06-17-2013, 11:33 PM
Green Broke
I didn't mean to offend anyone, and I clearly said some non-vegetarians try new things and I'm sure many do know what stuff like quinoa was, but I've never met anyone who wasn't vegetarian/vegan that did. They say "what is that?" "why would we eat it, that's weird". It's not just that but other things I thought were main stream, hommus, felafel, even tofu, tapioca, buckwheat, chickpeas, people some in their 30s or 40s, have never tasted or heard of. When I moved to my small university my flatmate looked at my after I said I was vegan and said.. "What? I though that was just a myth" and he fully believed that. I mean supermarkets don't even have these different kind of foods in the "normal" shopping section, you have to go to the area that has the foods for people with allergies, or other problems.

Maybe you do get excited over a product, but mentioning to my friend I wanted to taste something, like marshmallows, or some kind of biscuit... the answer is "just go buy it". There is no searching, looking, or heaps of excitement when you're local shop has it's first vegan biscuit. I remember having looked for vegan marshmallows for 3+ years and finally finding them in Germany. It was brilliant.

My friends just go "oh cool new biscuit" and put it in their basket. I'm not saying this is you, or everyone, but in my life and world this is what the people are like. And that's fine for them, but I don't want that. And it's great for people who actually read labels, but again, for example, out of my friends not one of them knew that about 90% of breadcrumbs from the supermarket had fish oil in them.

I was just trying to share my experience, to see if anyone else shared them, not trying to offend anyone. Which is why I posted in a vegan and vegetarian thread, not anywhere else on this forum.
lovexlaugh likes this.

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