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Horse shoeing question

This is a discussion on Horse shoeing question within the Hoof Care forums, part of the Horse Health category
  • Ground control plastic horseshoes for navicular
  • Magnitude for barefoot horses

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    05-16-2012, 05:49 AM
  #21
Green Broke
The pony in question had nearly perfect feet, perfect shape and size for him, no gaiters, pads or inserts needed. Rides tended to be an hour to an hour and a hallf each day. Pony also had no conformational of gait issues to contend with (county winning show pony, in the UK showing is 90% about conformation and movement).
The farrier often described the pony as having textbook perfect feet. He only ever needed a quick tidy up and new shoes on. His feet were black and hard as nails.

Also it is not just one pony. I have tried them on several ponies (owning 5 does have its advantages) with the same results (rubbed heels even after just one or 2 uses normaly after the horse had pulled a shoe off). I also have several good friends with various types of horses who have tried using boots and all of them got rubbed heels as well. Between us all we probably have every brand of horse boot in every size that is available on the market.

Boots are excellent short term if you lose a shoe etc but absolutly useless on a day to day basis. Some boots even reccomend having to bandage your horses feet before putting them in the boot. I certainly havn't got time to do that every day (and what a huge waste of money!)

I'm a great believer in barefoot if possible but when it is not possible shoes are the best answer.
     
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    05-16-2012, 06:58 AM
  #22
Trained
Quote:
Originally Posted by faye    
Boots are excellent short term if you lose a shoe etc but absolutly useless on a day to day basis. Some boots even reccomend having to bandage your horses feet before putting them in the boot. I certainly havn't got time to do that every day (and what a huge waste of money!)
Wow, I better sympathise with your bias, if you've had a number of these type experiences! I would suggest that the likeliest reason is the boots didn't fit as well as you thought. I'm a hoof care practitioner, with lots of experience of boots, both with my own animals and clients, not to mention many friends and associates that use them and can tell you that this is not a general problem at all. While badly fit boots do tend to cause various issues, well fitting ones tend to be fine. I have only personally known of one instance of heel bruising due to well fitting boots - unfortunately one of my own horses, and that was resolved by using rubber pads in the boots. If that didn't have the desired effect, gaiters or neoprene 'socks' would have been my next thing to try.
     
    05-16-2012, 07:12 AM
  #23
Green Broke
Loosie. Thing is having tried just about every size available you would think that at least one of them would have fit properly. Gaitors and pads, so when I go through a stream my horses can have wet soggy rubbed heels? Or if I go through mud they can have Mud stuck on the inside of the boot causing more friction?

My farrier (one of the best in the UK, he is qualified to the highest level, he lectures all around the world etc) is happy to leave horses and ponies barefoot and will trim properly for barefoot but is absolutly against boots as he says they cause more problems then they solve.
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    05-16-2012, 11:50 AM
  #24
Weanling
Quote:
Originally Posted by faye    
My farrier (one of the best in the UK, he is qualified to the highest level, he lectures all around the world etc) is happy to leave horses and ponies barefoot and will trim properly for barefoot but is absolutly against boots as he says they cause more problems then they solve.
So your farrier is a registered master FWCF?

Of the hundreds of thousands of farriers worldwide, the list of those who have successfully negotiated the FWCF level fills... one page.

Of all American farriers, I think there are maybe four that have done it and a few more that have negotiated the AWCF level. I've personally trained with two of them and learned in the process that, on my best day, I'm barely qualified to sweep up after them.

How tough is the FWCF? Take the American CJF certification (our best) and crank it up about four notches!

Loosie, you're in over your head by several orders of magnitude!

Cheers,
Mark
     
    05-16-2012, 12:03 PM
  #25
Green Broke
Horseman, yes he is FWCF. When we first used hiim he was only AWCF.

I personaly wouldonly ever use anyone with qualifications lower than AWCF in an absolute emergancy.
There are plenty of AWCF qualified farriers in the UK no need to go for anything less.
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    05-17-2012, 03:57 AM
  #26
Trained
Quote:
Originally Posted by faye    
Gaitors and pads, so when I go through a stream my horses can have wet soggy rubbed heels? Or if I go through mud they can have Mud stuck on the inside of the boot causing more friction?
Haven't found that's a problem generally either personally, but I agree, boots(or anything else IMO) aren't a universal best solution & you have to do what works & what you feel best for your horse & it sounds like boots are perhaps just not appropriate for your situation. The reason I wanted to reply to you on this was not to make an argument about specifics at all, just about the across the board statement that 'boots are only good for short term emergencies'. In my experience, I just haven't found that to be the case at all. It also sounds like you're in really excellent hands regarding your farrier, so I imagine being shod is not really an issue for your horse, and if it(or anything else) became one, your farrier is likely to have the answers!

Quote:
Loosie, you're in over your head by several orders of magnitude!
Am I? I seem to be getting enough oxygen ATM, but I don't get what that comment is about? Are you saying 'several orders of magnitude' have proven that boots are always bad news, or...?
     
    05-20-2012, 12:51 PM
  #27
Foal
To give you an idea of other possible options besides shoes, barefoot or hoofboots, look up 'Equisocks' and 'Ground Control shoes'. These are both great options, no metal, can go without nails in the foot and the Ground Controls outlast metal shoes. There's enough info around, you just got to go and look for it.
     
    05-20-2012, 02:16 PM
  #28
Started
My horse used to have only fronts, but just riding in the sand arena was enough for her backs to require shoes or else she would go extremely lame. My horse has thin walls as it is and without them her hooves would wear down very fast.
     
    05-20-2012, 03:02 PM
  #29
Weanling
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jierda    
To give you an idea of other possible options besides shoes, barefoot or hoofboots, look up 'Equisocks' and 'Ground Control shoes'. These are both great options, no metal, can go without nails in the foot and the Ground Controls outlast metal shoes. There's enough info around, you just got to go and look for it.

Curious as a cat at a mouse hole.

Faye is obviously more than pleased with her horse's long history of problem-free hoofcare and performance. Her farrier is trained and certified at the highest level of competence on the planet.

Why would she shun 20 years of success and a world class farrier in exchange for gimmicks?

It's already tough enough to find competent farriers in a lot of rural areas. This barefoot/boots thing is a cancer on the industry that is slowly diminishing the number of young people willing to do the brutally hard and long training required to best meet the needs of ALL horses, whether barefoot or shod. Another twenty years of this nonsense and horses in real need are going to go wanting.

Cheers,
Mark
     
    05-20-2012, 03:30 PM
  #30
Foal
Quote:
Originally Posted by Horseman56    
Faye is obviously more than pleased with her horse's long history of problem-free hoofcare and performance. Her farrier is trained and certified at the highest level of competence on the planet.

Why would she shun 20 years of success and a world class farrier in exchange for gimmicks?

It's already tough enough to find competent farriers in a lot of rural areas. This barefoot/boots thing is a cancer on the industry that is slowly diminishing the number of young people willing to do the brutally hard and long training required to best meet the needs of ALL horses, whether barefoot or shod. Another twenty years of this nonsense and horses in real need are going to go wanting.
At first, I wasn't commenting on Faye's situation, but on someone asking what about other options, and I provided some that I have read about. I've never tried either and can't attest to their usefulness, but I have followed a bunch of cases of a farrier who uses them all the time and who has a lot of success with them. And I don't just mean regular hoof care, but pathologic cases of navicular disease, laminitis, bad hoof cracks, white line disease and thrush (most often in combinations), where regular methods had all been tried to no avail and she often was called there as last resort. The previous farriers might just have been incompetent, I don't know, but you cannot deny the results she got. Visit her website and read for yourself: Home There's a lot of case studies on there complete with pics.

Besides, all you are trying to say now is that you are against innovation? I believe any farrier, trimmer or anyone otherwise involved in long-term care of hooves should have plenty training, extensive scientifical knowledge and a lot of practice before they should be allowed to work on their own. Do I think everyone should switch over to barefoot and completely drop the concept of metal shoes? No, I don't, and never claimed to, but I do think people owe it to themselves and their horses to not limit their vision on 'the way things were always done' and educate themselves on what else is out there. In the end it comes down to what our horses are happiest with, and not what the owner wants (if only every owner thought that way). Barefoot is far from a new concept, and I definitely won't be the one blaming people for trying to find new and better ways to do it, and while they're at it, why not improve the metal shoes too? It's all for the good of the horse, after all. Here's also an article from the same person about the Ground Control shoes and scientific reasons of why they are preferable: The Natural Farrier: The Best Horseshoe Plastic Ground Control vs. Steel and Aluminum Horseshoes
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