the plea for barefootedness - Page 10
 
 

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the plea for barefootedness

This is a discussion on the plea for barefootedness within the Hoof Care forums, part of the Horse Health category

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        08-06-2013, 06:46 PM
      #91
    Green Broke
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by gigem88    
    Although the owner has the final say, nothing wrong with starting a dialogue on going shoeless. If the owner was that interested in the horse, I would think they would not lease it in the first place.
    We don't know why the owner is leasing the horse out. The owner could have health problems, family stuff or was relocated due to a job and moving their horse isn't an option at the moment.

    Many many many reasons could cause a lease to happen.
         
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        08-06-2013, 07:07 PM
      #92
    Green Broke
    There's something going on with this horse's legs and hooves I think, which is why it is shod.

    Looks like has foundered in past possibly, and seeing a blow out possibly also high on one hoof by coronet band?

    And some tension along the cannons and pasterns with distended veining it looks like?

    Also either windpuffs maybe?

    Too many pictures to go through again, but I didn't like the looks of the legs or the condition of hooves, they are almost flaky looking in a couple of pictures by coronet band, seem dry and would make me wonder about the beginnings of ringbone in one?

    OP. I agree with others about this is not your horse and you need to back off. And for another thought, if you manage to push owner into pulling shoes off and horse goes lame and can no longer be ridden at all? They will not say it was their idea to pull shoes, but that you badgered them or worse that you lied and they didn't know shoes had been pulled, and you could be sued for the loss of their horse's usefulness.

    That happens more than you know. And even if horse might not be ruined? The costs to vet one could run into thousands of dollars.

    If you are toting all of the costs on a horse save for 35 dollars? Then it is apparent that you could afford a horse of your own, where you can make the decisions all by yourself.

    You should not have taken horse that had shoes if you are so anti shoe.

    And not all horses can go barefoot either. I am betting this horse is one of those.

    Tossing this in too, asking for review of a farrier used by owner will result in anyone looking for him by Googling name, coming up with this thread, and showing it to both him and the owner.


    Might also add to OP. Just how many places have you posted about this lease horse and Brian Rusnak? Apparently quite a few from what I am seeing. Several of us, if not most of us are on different forums.

    So what is the deal, you didn't get advice telling you to go ahead and do what YOU think is best? You just keep trolling around trying to find other opinions that match yours?

    If I was the owner, or Brian and I saw all of this? Your head would be spinning like a spool on a spindle right now. And the horse would be out of your control.
    NdAppy, flytobecat, AlexS and 2 others like this.
         
        08-06-2013, 07:12 PM
      #93
    Weanling
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by EdmontonHorseGal    
    an update: owner's farrier cannot make it out right away so I asked the owner about a different farrier (one I trust to do a good job) pulling shoes and doing a trim and he said that he wants to wait for his farrier to come out to replace the shoe. That tells me that the owner wants the horse kept shod. As I stated previously in this thread, I am not going to contest the owner's wishes. The horse is his property. I do have a right to my opinion though, and my opinion will always be to have a horse barefoot if there is no valid reason for shoeing. What I won't do is try to ram that opinion down the owner's throat.

    What happened to this?

    From reading back through the post it seems like you have broached the subject at least twice with the owner (you mentioned a call about it earlier and the owner replied that he has just always had shoes so he wants to keep it that way or something along those lines...), both times he has wanted to keep the horse shod and wanted to keep his farrier. You keep saying that you're willing to do what the owner wants and not shove the subject down his throat, yet you won't take no for an answer. You seem convinced that you know best, not the owner, yet the owner has known this horse for how many years and you just started leasing him?

    You really should go buy your own horse.
         
        08-06-2013, 09:13 PM
      #94
    Banned
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by tinyliny    
    Now wait a minute. She is asking what we would do in the same situation. Most folks say talk with the owner, and I get the feeling she has plans to do so. But, I think her objective was to kind of test the waters as to what other people thought of asking an owner who has previously kept a horse shod for reasons that are not clear to the leassor. Personally, I don't see anything unreasonable by that. She asked for "what would you do" opinions, and she got some. Fair enough.
    Ok taking it from that point of view. I prefer my horses shod on all 4. I am yet to see an Olympic level horse barefoot. Of course my horse is not close to that level, but if it's good enough for them, it's good enough for me.
    The barefoot movement is new, and has holes, in my opinion. No pun intended. To each their own, it's not for me. And it's not for the owner of this horse either, and that's what matters.






    Quote:
    Originally Posted by gigem88    
    Although the owner has the final say, nothing wrong with starting a dialogue on going shoeless. If the owner was that interested in the horse, I would think they would not lease it in the first place.
    I could not disagree more. The farrier gave 40 mins notice, and it was before the OP was awake. It's reasonable to assume that the owner wasn't awake either - but yet she got to the barn to hold the horse when the leaser could not.

    I firmly disagree with the judgement about people who lease out horses. If the horse is not under your riding level, but you want to ensure it gets the level of care for the rest of its life, you'd lease it out. I cannot think of a more responsible thing to do. Please hold back on judging the owner, who is not here to speak for herself.
         
        08-06-2013, 09:25 PM
      #95
    Yearling
    The bottom line is that is isnt your horse. You don't get to pick.


    However. Those feet could be improved. Bare or shod. There are fixable problems there.

    I don't see where there is any more to say on the topic unless and until you own the horse or make the decision on who and how hoof care is provided.
    flytobecat and AlexS like this.
         
        09-02-2013, 04:17 PM
      #96
    Foal
    Smile

    Hi. I'm new to the forum, just figured I'd put my 2 cents in. I'm all for barefoot! My last horse I had for 14yrs. I always assumed he needed shoes, because I didn't know any better. I was still competing in LD's and doing lots of trail riding. He was 21yrs when I had his hind shoes pulled. I thought that was a safe way to start. I noticed absolutely no difference in how he moved. Not tender or sore. About 6 months later I pulled his front shoes and had pretty much the same result. I had purchased a pair of Renegade boots for his transition period. Well they are definitely designed for a barefoot horse. My horse's heels were a bit too high and I kept losing the boots. The last time they came off I finished my trail ride w/o them. He was fine! Strong lil' Arab feet! I realized I wasted $ on shoes for years!
    Anyway, maybe you could ask the owner about pulling hind shoes first and see how the horse does. If that goes well, maybe they'll consider agreeing to pull front shoes too. Barefoot is just healthier for their feet. My current gelding has been barefoot for 4 yrs. We do tons of trail riding and have completed several 25-30 races with out even using the boots I for him!
    And I don't think your wanting what's best for the horse is disrespectful at all! Good Luck!
         
        09-03-2013, 03:30 AM
      #97
    Green Broke
    Arablover, there is no scientific proof that barefoot is healthier, infact in a lot of cases barefoot criples a horse.

    I have had horses barefoot, shod and most variations in between (including racing plates, stick on shoes and heart bars).
    Currently my lad is barefoot, but he is struggling on stoney ground and quite unhappy so he will be being shod for the first time when the farrier is next on the yard.

    Horses for courses
    NdAppy likes this.
         
        09-03-2013, 03:47 AM
      #98
    Super Moderator
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by faye    
    Arablover, there is no scientific proof that barefoot is healthier, infact in a lot of cases barefoot criples a horse.

    I have had horses barefoot, shod and most variations in between (including racing plates, stick on shoes and heart bars).
    Currently my lad is barefoot, but he is struggling on stoney ground and quite unhappy so he will be being shod for the first time when the farrier is next on the yard.

    Horses for courses

    Struggling on stony ground is often a mineral / diet / management issue. Read the Rockley farm Blog - they hunt barefoot.

    Barefoot hooves grow stronger when given the correct diet and movement (lots of evidence on the blog I mentioned) and it was part of farrier training to give hooves a break from shoes in the past so hooves could recover from the damage caused by shoes.

    Being barefoot is natural to horses so if they are being crippled then it is down to management and diet of those hooves or a metabolic issue such as cushings. Shoes don't cure hooves but they mask the problems if there are any often until the hoof break down and when even remedial shoeing fails then barefoot is often the only solution (and often a fantastic cure for sick hooves).
    Wallaby likes this.
         
        09-03-2013, 08:21 AM
      #99
    Green Broke
    CLava, Reeco is blood tested regularly and on god knows how many supliments.

    A Blog is hardly peer reviewed data in a vet journal. Note it USED to be part of farrier training but now no longer is!
    Reeco is currently trimmed at 4 week intervals by a very good farrier who is highly trained in remedial shoeing AND in barefoot trimming, but even he agree's his feet just can't take barefoot.

    Barefoot may be natural but so is natural selection and wild horses are bred for strong hooves (because those that can't cope die, survival of the fittest) most competition horses are not bred for strong hooves that go barefoot and thus weaknesses are found. Carrying people around on thier back is not natural and nor is tarmac.

    I don't like seeing my horse sore in his feet and I will do what is in my power to make him happy, that means shoes for him.
    NdAppy, katbalu and NBEventer like this.
         
        09-03-2013, 09:20 AM
      #100
    Super Moderator
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by faye    
    CLava, Reeco is blood tested regularly and on god knows how many supliments.

    A Blog is hardly peer reviewed data in a vet journal. Note it USED to be part of farrier training but now no longer is!
    Reeco is currently trimmed at 4 week intervals by a very good farrier who is highly trained in remedial shoeing AND in barefoot trimming, but even he agree's his feet just can't take barefoot.

    Barefoot may be natural but so is natural selection and wild horses are bred for strong hooves (because those that can't cope die, survival of the fittest) most competition horses are not bred for strong hooves that go barefoot and thus weaknesses are found. Carrying people around on thier back is not natural and nor is tarmac.

    I don't like seeing my horse sore in his feet and I will do what is in my power to make him happy, that means shoes for him.
    It nolonger is customary to give horses a break from shoes through client pressure to shoe not because it is bad practice!! Farriers are still taught it but don't practice it.

    The blog I mentioned is as close as you will get to scientific barefoot study if you had read it you would understand. No-one will fund actual studies but you take the info that is available to further understanding. No remedial shoeing has ANY scientific basis either! And Rockley has an impressive rate of rehab with navicular which is exceptionally well documented. Just because your good farrier says your horse can't go barefoot does not mean someone else couldn't succeed with the correct minerals and management.

    As for tarmac being an issue, that is laughable as it is the best surface for barehooves for being conditioned. Riding and roads may not be natural but they are not the determining factors, but diet and management are. Shoes have their place for owners wishing to use them and who cannot provide the perfect environment for a barefooted horses or do not wish too which is fair enough and that is fine, but they are always detrimental to the health of hooves in some way, but for most people and horses they work ok.
         

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