Trim critique?
 
 

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Trim critique?

This is a discussion on Trim critique? within the Hoof Care forums, part of the Horse Health category

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        10-13-2013, 09:11 PM
      #1
    Green Broke
    Trim critique?

    20 year old Arabian. His feet used to be "normal" (sorry no pictures at this time) and have looked odd to be for awhile now. Got a second opinion from the vet and she said his heels looked low but ok otherwise. My mother talked to the farrier when he came next and he double checked and showed her how he measured and said they were fine. I don't know.. they just haven't looked right for awhile. The other two look fine to me (boarder's a mess, but that's a different story). Not so sure if I'm thrilled with the farrier, we have had him for awhile and never had any "problems" but don't know if they are where they should be, he is good to talk to and work with but... idk lol. Anyways, just seeking a second opinion. They look better in the pictures than in person I feel. Hopefully between all of those there are some decent ones.. Please excuse the unicorn fetlocks and pony feet in the background. The last picture is of the pony's feet for comparison.

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        10-13-2013, 09:26 PM
      #2
    Started
    That's not the worst job I've ever seen, but I've seen better too. How long between his feet being done and these pictures? Pretty average job, maybe better than many if you were in my area, fwiw...

    It looks like he has some flares in the hoof walls, some side-to-side imbalance, and there's something funny about his foot at the coronary band. Almost like it's sunken and his coffin bone is moved further down towards the ground than it should be. Is he sore or thin-soled?

    I know very little though, so I look forward to reading the opinions of the real experts here.
         
        10-13-2013, 09:42 PM
      #3
    Green Broke
    Oh well that's good! Honestly I don't remember, these pictures are from a few months ago. I THINK maybe a week old? I meant to mention he is on an 8 week schedule, which in most cases works well for him. I do see the flaring and don't feel like it's been addressed at all. Nope, never sore/lame/anything. Granted he's not one to show pain, at all, but he seems perfectly normal. No abscesses ever, never any "problems". They just look odd to me. He doesn't get worked much.

    Thanks for responding!
         
        10-13-2013, 09:49 PM
      #4
    Yearling
    Nice pics. Nothing really jumps out at me. All the angles look good. The front feet look wide, but they are nice and round, I don't see flare but the front feet look like they have spread and the sole is lower because of it (?) I'm going by what I see. Farrier has addressed the edges, but possibly the fronts might not spread out as much if the edge was rolled more to prevent that outer hoof from dragging everything outward with it. It would keep the foot more together and not so wide. Same thing happened to my friend, and I just rolled the edges more, and the foot changed so much that she thought her feet were trimmed a few weeks later and they weren't !

    The backs look fine. On all the soles, the hoof looks proportioned well, not running forward.

    So I would not get rid of the farrier, just see if he can give those fronts a really good rolled edge to prevent that spread. The feet look healthy and maintained.

    Even my old first horse started getting the spread in his front feet because of his age, and when I pointed it out, the farrier rolled the edges and his feet looked great. And all that happened years ago when I was young and clueless.

    I know you think the feet look better in the camera than real life, but it's usually the other way around with the camera distorting the problems. Look at the feet and smile
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        10-13-2013, 10:06 PM
      #5
    Green Broke
    Thank you for your helpful critique princess! Can you explain the difference between flare and spread? Yes the back feet do look better.

    Glad to here to keep the farrier, I would like to. He does roll the edge but I will see if he can do it a little more next time. He does do a good job overall, just not sure about the way they looked or the fact they didn't use to look like that. I didn't really think of it as being an age thing, not something I've come across much.
         
        10-13-2013, 11:22 PM
      #6
    Yearling
    My 1st farrier in NY, the best one, I had him and the horse for 19 years, said that when horses age , their feet spread, their coffin bone gets lower to the ground. I remember him increasing the roll on the edges and the feed held together much better.

    My friend here has a 4 year old who had pancake feet, and I rolled the edges for her and it seemed that the feet liked that better! And stopped spreading. Hers had flaring and spreading. And it did stop.

    Flares are when the hoof wall gets pulled away from the laminae, . Spread is when the whole foot is stretching out and sole getting lower from age. I've heard that Arabs do have wider feet in front because they were meant to run in sand (with sheiks ) Like the Black Stallion's race in the desert. Who knows.

    Your horse's feet look well maintained, and your farrier is a keeper. Just get the edges rolled a bit more, or ask him about the feet spreading and what he could do.
         
        10-14-2013, 12:39 AM
      #7
    Green Broke
    Hmm interesting. Not something I've noticed before but it makes sense. I will try that!

    So spread it the whole foot, OK. I assumed they were one and the same. Yes but not noticeably so and as I said they have changed.

    Glad for all the positive input. I will try to get some before and after pics to see how things are. If anyone has any other ideas I'm open of course. Thanks!
         
        10-15-2013, 01:47 AM
      #8
    Trained
    Had a hard time being sure about too much from those pics. Some good ones there, but lighting, blurriness, angles of pics, dirty feet & not newly trimmed all make critiques harder. Please see link in my signature for tips on picture taking.

    At any rate, agree basically with Sharpie. Not a terrible job, but I agree with your 'NQR' worries.

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Sharpie    
    ...and there's something funny about his foot at the coronary band. Almost like it's sunken and his coffin bone is moved further down...
    Good observation! Can't tell how much or little it is with these pics, but I agree it appears these hooves are 'stretched' forward & dropped more than they may seem - dorsal walls appear quite straight without flares, so it could look like the h/p angles are right. But coronary border appearing pushed up, hairline angle, particularly right at the toe, heel height & possible angle, amount of hoof in front of the frog, etc, lead me to suspect all is not as well as it may seem with regard to hoof balance. Quarter walls are obviously flared. Bars also appear overgrown.

    I'm curious what made the vet think heels were too low, and what did the farrier measure to check his work? Does he trim to certain measurements & angles?

    Quote:
    said that when horses age , their feet spread, their coffin bone gets lower to the ground.
    Yes, they don't have to be old for that to happen, and it's not due to age IME, but how they're managed. I think what you mean by 'spread' is that the laminae 'stretch' but the hoof walls stay straight? I think this is more to do with breed - arabs for eg. Seem to have stronger walls that are more likely to keep growing straight despite lack of firm attachement, while TBs are more likely to become 'dishy'. I suspect this horse's quarters have dished because they've been under more pressure.
         
        10-15-2013, 05:59 PM
      #9
    Yearling
    Most of the photos are nut useable to properly evaluate the trim. Sorry. The side vies must be taken with the camera literally ON the ground so the photos is exactly level. Not angled at all, ad pointing squarely at the side of the foot. ANY angle makes causes picture distortion and impossible to evaluate the foot. Sole views taken STRAIGHT ON with the camera pointing squarely at the center of thew sole are also important . You do have a couple of those but the foot is too dirty to truly see the ends of the heels and the condition of the bars, both very important. If you wire brush the bottom of the foot with a good hard wire brush that helps.
         
        10-16-2013, 01:04 PM
      #10
    Green Broke
    Yes the pictures were old and I was hoping people would be able to piece together and idea. I will try to get some real pics to get a real critique. I think the farrier is out beginning of November but I will update then!

    I was hoping you would post loosie, I appreciate your knowledge.
    I don't know I was not there for the vet or farrier that time (basically me harassing my mother to get a second opinion on the feet for me). I can tell you the farrier does not usually use any measuring tools. Just nips and rasps, a basic trim. I sort of wish he would watch the horses move and stuff but even the really good farriers around here don't unless there's a problems. So no he seems to trim to the foot and not check measurements and angles unless there is a problem. The other horses feet look more normal to me. I can get pictures of them too.

    Well he is an Arab with good feet but I guess they missed that memo. Our boarder has dreadful feet (and that's a whole other story) same farrier but I think he does his best. They are very flared/dished also but are overall neglected and I can see where the farrier has tried to fix the flaring after a trim.

    Just wanted to mention again he is on an 8 week schedule. Didn't use to be a problem but maybe he needs more frequent trims now?

    Thanks again, better pics to come.
         

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    flares, trimming

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