Update on Candy - Deep Sulcus Thrush - Page 2
 
 

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Update on Candy - Deep Sulcus Thrush

This is a discussion on Update on Candy - Deep Sulcus Thrush within the Hoof Care forums, part of the Horse Health category
  • The shabby frog
  • Deep sulcus thrush

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    06-20-2012, 05:39 PM
  #11
Trained
Mark, while I must admit I splattered my monitor with Mountain Dew while reading your unicorn post, I am dismayed by how much you dismiss anyone but certified farriers, like they are the end all/ be all to horse foot care. Niche businesses emerge for the sole reason that there is a need for them. Many people, myself included, have been burned over and over again by certified experts claiming they know everything while nobody else knows squat and keep our horses moving poorly or worse, lame.

In the past week, I have been to two barns and seen two instances where the owner is being absolutely robbed blind by their $200 per shoeing certified farrier. The first horse has been lame for awhile. The farrier says it's not the feet and to check further up in the body. I took one look at the bottom of the feet and saw black, gooey, smelly nectrotic frogs from hell. The poor thing has sulcus thrush so deep in 3 of it's feet, I was able to stick a hoof pick almost 1 1/2" into the heel crack. The sole is so stretched forward, the frogs are like toothpicks. Please tell me how a highly trained certified professional farrier misses something that a first time horse owner saw within seconds??

Another horse I recently saw had heels so high, the frogs were easily 3" off the ground, small as my pinkie finger, and heels so contracted they looked like Chevy Chase's chin. Different farrier, but again, not cheap, knows it all, certified journeyman farrier. The owner has this horse on so many joint supplements because her horse is older (age 7!!!) and seems stiff all the time. Ya think??

I get that you dismiss the barefoot trimmers as hacks that best use their hoof knives for slicing tomatoes, but the claim that a knowledgeable farrier is the equivalent of angels singing...give me a break!

If you truly want to help out horse owners, get together with your expert buddies and devise a standard testing system where farriers must show certain skills and be graded on their work, so when we pick a name out of a hat, there is some data we have to go on other than their name and contact number.
     
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    06-20-2012, 07:52 PM
  #12
Weanling
Quote:
Originally Posted by MyBoyPuck    
Mark, while I must admit I splattered my monitor with Mountain Dew while reading your unicorn post, I am dismayed by how much you dismiss anyone but certified farriers, like they are the end all/ be all to horse foot care. Niche businesses emerge for the sole reason that there is a need for them. Many people, myself included, have been burned over and over again by certified experts claiming they know everything while nobody else knows squat and keep our horses moving poorly or worse, lame.

In the past week, I have been to two barns and seen two instances where the owner is being absolutely robbed blind by their $200 per shoeing certified farrier. The first horse has been lame for awhile. The farrier says it's not the feet and to check further up in the body. I took one look at the bottom of the feet and saw black, gooey, smelly nectrotic frogs from hell. The poor thing has sulcus thrush so deep in 3 of it's feet, I was able to stick a hoof pick almost 1 1/2" into the heel crack. The sole is so stretched forward, the frogs are like toothpicks. Please tell me how a highly trained certified professional farrier misses something that a first time horse owner saw within seconds??

Another horse I recently saw had heels so high, the frogs were easily 3" off the ground, small as my pinkie finger, and heels so contracted they looked like Chevy Chase's chin. Different farrier, but again, not cheap, knows it all, certified journeyman farrier. The owner has this horse on so many joint supplements because her horse is older (age 7!!!) and seems stiff all the time. Ya think??

I get that you dismiss the barefoot trimmers as hacks that best use their hoof knives for slicing tomatoes, but the claim that a knowledgeable farrier is the equivalent of angels singing...give me a break!

If you truly want to help out horse owners, get together with your expert buddies and devise a standard testing system where farriers must show certain skills and be graded on their work, so when we pick a name out of a hat, there is some data we have to go on other than their name and contact number.
Thank you for posting with tact that which I have been yelling at my computer monitor, repeatedly, after reading some of his posts.

And I'm just going to leave it at that, since I have already typed and deleted many paragraphs trying to add my thoughts...you have already stated them much better than I ever could.

Roperchick likes this.
     
    06-22-2012, 08:39 PM
  #13
Started
Quote:
Originally Posted by Horseman56    


What is it that makes you think there is anything "natural" about hoof boots?


Notice that the 'whiteline disease', or more specifically, the wall separation that provided opportunity for infection, does not appear until after the first trim (2nd photo).

Nothing was done to address that distal wall separation until the pathology had progressed through the 6th photo (5 trims?).

Mark.....what caused the white line to stretch out during these trims?
     
    06-22-2012, 08:54 PM
  #14
Started
Mark...also in the last picture of the pictures OP first posted....I think I see the bar on the left squashed into the sole....I believe it then continues around the frog apex to the other side? So then the bar needs to be removed until you reach actual sole and is not laid over?
     
    06-24-2012, 05:10 AM
  #15
Weanling
*Update*

FYI, just with the photos I've posted, the horse was trimmed twice during this time by two seperate farriers (4 week intervals). Not each photo is after a new trim, it was more to show the development of the thrush and the treatment.

Candy had X-Rays on Wednesday and the vet is not convinced it is navicular (phew).

She has bilaterla forelimb lamesness when places on a circle. The left fore showed signs of a moderate broken back hoof-pastern axis and small digital cushion.
The right fore is slightly better, mild broken back hoof-pastern axis and a small digital cushion.
The left fore shows a mild degree of pedal osteitis with a scalloping of the bone due to toe-first landing.
Her hooves are being compromised due to the way she is walking to relieve the heel pain. She has virtually no heel and the foot lies very flat.

I am very much trusting the vet in her plan of action and she is working closely with the farrier.

I was extremely reluctant in using shoes (have been reading LOTS of Pete Ramey and the horse has been barefoot her whole life) but after they both examined the X-rays the plan was to be:

Therapuetic shoes with a 3 degree raised heel on both fores. The idea is that these will relieve the tension on the navicular structures and the deep digital flexor tendon which is currently under alot of strain.


So, I was convinced into shoes... she doesn't have to have them on forever, just to encourage a normal landing and development of a healthier digital cushion.


Yes, I have concerns for the frog and the sulci as without the pressure release motion (as a barefoot horse) the frog will not develop and the heels are not likely to relax... meaning without maintenance thrush treatment it is likely to return. Candy's frogs are particularily shrivled and were not on the ground in barefoot anyway.. but once the hoof structures are more more-normal I will look at going back to barefoot and developing that frog.


Here are some shots of the new shoes/X-ray of the left fore and some before-the-shoes-shots.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Right_Fore.jpg (41.7 KB, 103 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_7621.jpg (35.8 KB, 105 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_7622.jpg (34.0 KB, 104 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_7623.jpg (57.2 KB, 101 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_7630.jpg (61.2 KB, 100 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_7633.jpg (52.6 KB, 100 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_7642.jpg (24.0 KB, 105 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_7643.jpg (20.0 KB, 101 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_7670.jpg (50.7 KB, 98 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_7671.jpg (46.8 KB, 100 views)
     
    06-24-2012, 05:15 AM
  #16
Weanling
And more...
Attached Images
File Type: jpg IMG_7672.jpg (76.4 KB, 101 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_7673.jpg (61.2 KB, 96 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_7674.jpg (83.8 KB, 104 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_7676.jpg (52.5 KB, 103 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_7677.jpg (62.0 KB, 105 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_7679.jpg (50.8 KB, 103 views)
     
    06-24-2012, 05:16 AM
  #17
Weanling
Darker hoof with the shabby frog is the Left fore, the white hoof is the Right Fore (with the better frog)..
     
    06-24-2012, 12:29 PM
  #18
Yearling
Much better with the shoes. Shoe job looks good to me, but Ill leave the farrier experts to comment on the skill of application. Id probably fill the soles with SolePak CS to help with the thrush and provide stimulation and cushion while those feet rehabilitate. In this case, I think shoes are a very good option. I have achieved the same result with casting, sole pack and rubber shoes, but its just different means to the same end.

The tell tale sign is...How is she walking? :) Id bet better.
     
    06-25-2012, 07:57 AM
  #19
Weanling
She's walking a whole lot better, which is great to see :) The shortness of the stride has stopped and she's gone from being quite sore to running around happy again.

! It never even crossed my mind to pack her soles. Great idea. I will read up on it and hopefully can get some SolePak in Australia, if not I'm sure we have the equivelant.

Were you experiencing a similar problem Trinity?
     
    06-25-2012, 09:33 AM
  #20
Yearling
I have rehabilitated similar issues in client horses. I did not use metal shoes however but used casting, Vettec products, and ground control shoes to regain alignment and comfort while the hoof capsule regrew in stronger and more correct.

Im not surprised she is walking better :) Very glad to hear.
     

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