xrays to share

I think the toes are much too long and are pulling the heels forward and the heels are running under. Medial to lateral things look good to me on this horse. On these kinds of unbalanced limbs, if you balance to the live sole, you will typically be fine. She's never going to have the exact same slope to her walls medial to lateral because of the deviation in the limb structure. Spacing does look good to me also.

What will help her is to get her breakover back and thus her heels back underneath her as best can be done effectively "standing her up" but doing it the right way. With horses like this, I like to trimt he toe back aggressively and use soleguard to inflate the back of the foot and help the heels unfold as I tweek them back in place. I sometimes will cast over the whole thing for a couple weeks or even more if necessary if the horse seems like he needs a bit of protection while this reorients. I don't shoe, so this is my way of correcting this without metal.

I drew because its easier. The middle red line is the center of the joint/coffin bone/widest part of the foot. You want equal length from this midline to the breakover and an equal length to the back of the heel. The blue line at the back is approx the center of the limb and where her base of support needs to get back to. This is hard to see. Basically, once you map the middle of the coffin bone, the rest of the foot should be balanced around that. The front should be equal in distance to the back or the back even greater than the toe in distance. If the toe is longer than the back of the foot, there is a problem and distortion present in the foot.

There is plenty of room to move breakover back. We don't have good pictures of the soles but this is what I see from here.

Note: my lines are just approximations.

That'll teach me to assume! At least she's got more 'normal' hoof angles than my assumption pre pics! While you can't do anything at her age(only potentially in very early foalhood) about the valgus fetlocks, it is *possible* with bodywork, as her legs appear to turn out from way up at the elbows or above, that that could be 'corrected'.

That'll teach me to assume! At least she's got more 'normal' hoof angles than my assumption pre pics! While you can't do anything at her age(only potentially in very early foalhood) about the valgus fetlocks, it is *possible* with bodywork, as her legs appear to turn out from way up at the elbows or above, that that could be 'corrected'.

Re the higher heels on the RF, for one, I don't think the angles are too bad at all - if anything, that one looks ever so slightly 'broken back' to me. Even if they're not ideal, check out one of the many club foot or 'high/low' threads for info on why it may be more problematic to lower the heels. I'd just tend to keep them well maintained in relation to the sole plane, consider bodywork, which *could* change things, and keep the toes under control.

Wow. Quite alot of knowledge from you two!. She has high/low syndrome, she's about 2-3 degrees difference. I have always kept her on a tight schedule for this and it looks like it paid off. I've followed live sole when I was doing her and it always came out with the same degree difference. It was easier than now because now she grazes all night, and it's harder to keep her there. But it's working. I do agree with you that she has some room to bring her heel back. And her toes are far too long for me. She's a gaited horse, but I really don't want them that long.

What is valgus fetlock?

Trinity, I love markups! It does make things clearer. Loosie, don't think your assumptions are worthless. The are worth alot because this is an ongoing learning thing and assumptions get alot of thinking going which leads to more knowledge.

This is a good pic to show how too high or low a heel and cause the bones to not line up correctly. See the lack of space between P3 & P2 on this foot. My horse is also high/lo and this is his low foot. We've since put shoes back on and now have more heel, but this a great pic to show a problem that needs to be fixed.

I have nothing of use to add. It's very interesting, thanks for sharing. My new filly is slightly pigeon toed. You have to watch for it carefully while she is walking toward you to pick up on it. I do as you have done and trim to the sole. It makes sense to me - if the bone is off it can't be "fixed", but to my way of thinking the sole should be "in tune" w the bone's defects.

Oh PFB, went looking for an online valgus/varus pic the other day & got side tracked, learning that my sister's 'bunion' is the same sort of thing!

Here's a pic that shows carpus valgus/varus, but it can be the fetlock joint(s) rather than the carpus(knee), as in your horse's case. I think of it as 'insy' & 'outsy' legs, but that's the more technical description!

Okay, farrier came today. I was really nice to him, LOL. He saw the xrays, and I told him what the vet said. So I believe he trimmed her nicely and he is lowering the medials, but he said "slowly". He left her some medial heel .

He is really a nice guy once we get on the same wavelength. I wish I could show you this horse's founder xrays. A few months ago Cinnamon foundered badly. She didn't pierce the sole but was pretty close. From what I gather, he cut away v shape in the hoof wall where the bone wasn't attached anymore, and packed it. He also put wooden shoes on her and casted her.
If you could see those xrays now, you can't even tell anything was ever wrong!

So, I didn't take pics today because I'm usually afraid to look the first day. But I'll be going there tomorrow and see if I can get them then.

Do you see on the xrays the black area inside the heel? Black means air on xrays, and means collateral grooves that are too deep. That is from bars that have been left too long and are jamming up inside the foot. This is pulling the heel bulbs under as well.

Here is how I understand it:

Farriers often leave one side of the hoof longer than the other, in your case the outside. This causes the bars and hoof wall to jam up on one side, causing discomfort. The hoof wall will flare out on this side because the bars as they overgrow lay over and push the sole and wall out. This brings the heel more forward and gives the horse less heel area to stand on. The horse will then stand on the more comfortable side, in your case the inside.

To combat this, the bars need to be kept trimmed down to the sole level or just below so they can come out of the foot and begin growing down straight instead of bent over. The heels landing area needs to be brought back to the widest point of the frog on both sides equally. The hoof walls need to be kept even with the sole so the jamming can grow out.

The horse may have some bone damage in his legs and may not stand perfectly if this has been going on a long time. But his stance will improve quite a bit if his feet become comfortable. For him it is like having rocks in your shoes.

Here is an xray of a horse that stood crooked because of bar issues:

Was going to post but Gottatrot took the words right out of my mouth.. or text box :)