Hi guys, I'm new to the forum and just after some advise.
Ok so my story is a pretty long one but I'll try and cover it all so you guys know where I'm at and whats going on.
Firstly, I am not a horse breeder. I have worked on a couple of thoroughbred and warmblood studs for time but that was a few years ago now. I do have basic experience in foaling horses down. (Ive assisted with half a dozen foals personally) I am also a veterinary nurse although I predominately work with small animals. I have owned and ridden horses from a young age and have often bought project horses and ponies, broken them and sold them on down the track so I'm not new to the whole horse game.
Now to my current predicament.
I few weeks ago I purchased a pony mare as a bit of a project. (Little Buckskin I named Lou Lou) The information I have on her is that she was mustered up with a mob of wild horses from a large property that was owned by a mine that now wanted to begin to develop it. The woman I bought her off had owned her from about 6 weeks and had done very little handling. She was very thin but with a large belly but looking you couldn't tell she was in foal. (I thought she was just wormy as Ive had them like that before) Anyway, I brought her home, put in a few days of good handling, wormed her, vaccinated her and then got her checked by the vet. Surprise surprise she was heavily in foal. Her udder was present and empty, and the vet estimated her age at about 13 years old. Im assuming she has had multiple foals before.
Once I found out she was in foal I contacted the previous owners to see if I could chase up any more history. When I spoke to them they didn't know anything more but gave me the number of the woman who organised the sale. (The mob was sold off the back of a truck on the way to the doggers.)
They also mentioned that her sister had another mare from the sale mob (They bought two and one sister got one, the other sister got the other) I was pretty reluctant to take on another horse after just finding out my one project pony had just turned into two but once they showed me the photos I felt so horribly sorry for her that I went and picked her up.
This is where the story gets really sad.
The second pony (A palomino I named Xena) Was very emaciated. She had a pretty serious looking injury to her back off side hoof and she was totally terrified. I have worked with some difficult horses but this was like nothing I have even seen before. She was being kept in a cement backyard, hardly enough room for her to walk around and lie down. She had been flogged within an inch of her life. (The boyfriend made a show of demonstrating how he felt with her before I swiftly put an end to that!) He informed me straight off the bat, she kicks, she strikes she's stubborn. (He seemed to think that the horse throwing itself over a fence and onto the ground while being flogged demonstrated stubbornness) Even writing this down makes my blood boil!! So we ran her onto the float and I wormed her and vaccinated her in the float. For the first 24 hours I fed her only a limited amount of grass hay and she pooed straight dirt. I can't believe she didn't colic. I got the vet out straight away to check her leg and also got her scanned to see if she was in foal. (I figured she couldn't be very far along if she was in foal and I was considering terminating it if she was due to her horrible body condition.) When the vet tested her he was as surprised as me that she was also heavily in foal. He said if it was a regular horse he would estimate she was due in 2-3 months but due to her malnourishment she may be further along and the foal might just be small. He said the foot wasn't good but it wasn't infected and he estimated it was injured about 6 weeks ago. (They mentioned she cut her foot on the tin when they first got her) Even so sedated she had to lean against the fence to stand we still had to twitch her to stop her from kicking the absolute s*** out of the vet. He said at this stage it wasn't worth putting her body through the stress of the sedations needed to try and treat the foot now. It was to much risk for her and the foal so we are going to revisit it once she's a bit better handled and the foal has been born. It also looks like she has foaled before (judging by her udder)
I'd like to point out at this point that these people only had these horses for 6 weeks!
I managed to contact the woman who organised their sale, (She was as horrified as me) and she sent me photos of the horses from before they took them. They were fat and shinny.
So I've had these girls for about a month now. Just spend a lot of time feeding and gentle handling. Lou Lou has progressed extremely well. She had very little handling so is frightened but a very kind girl who is pretty cruisy about everything as long as you take your time with her.
Xena is a different story.
For the first few days she just about tried to kill herself every time I went into the yard to pick up the poo. She will also stand and shake like a leaf. Absolutely trembling from head to foot. After a while she began to calm down but its been a slow process. Every time she gets a little fright and jumps a little she immediately thinks she will get flogged and absolutely flies off the handle. This has made her pretty dangerous and unpredictable to handle not only for me but also for her. She will literally throw herself through anything and everything in her path to escape. Luckily I have reasonably good horse yards with better ones on the way. (I'd rather spend the money on fences then vet bills when a foal puts its leg through the fence) I know even the safest fences aren't a guarantee but I'd like to be as safe as possible.
Anyway, she's getting much better now. Ive taught her to lead, back up, step forward and she's getting more comfortable with me touching her neck and back. Her greatest achievement by far is that now if she gets a fright its just jumps and whys. She doesn't absolutely flip out although she does still tremble when exposed to new things. Well some days are better then others but she's come such a long way!!
Ok, so now that I've rambled so long you guys probably won't even read the whole post I'll try and get to the point.
Soooo, I check both their udders twice a day when I feed them. Last night I noticed Lou Lou was starting to bag up. No massive deal... She's put on a lot of condition over the last few weeks and I'm optimistic that her foal will be fine.
The real shock came when I had a look at Xena's udder and she's beginning to bag up too. She doesn't even look remotely in foal. Her ribs are still showing its just sad all round.
First question! (Told you I would get to it eventually)
What are your experiences with older mares that have foaled before? Do they generally bag up earlier or later in the pregnancy? I know that question is totally mute because it totally depends on the mare and not having any history there now way of knowing with these girls) Just after some reassurance guys its been a few years since I've done this and I've never had the stress of them being my own horses!
Second question! (I have already called the vet waiting for him to call me back he's king house calls today)
Anybody had experience foaling poor/thin mares. Any thoughts on how the foal might be affected or how the mare might handle the delivery? I'm already thinking weak/small foal. I should be sourcing some colostrum in case it is to weak to feed. (I would never be able to milk her) I'm also thinking hopefully the mare has enough reserves to produce enough milk to feed the foal, or even just to get through the labour.
Stressful times!!!
Anything you guys can think of, helpful pointers or tips would be great! I'm hopeful not to get to many negative comments. I've taken on a lot with these girls and I just want to give them and their foals the best care I can.
(I should mention here although its common sense I've got these girl on high quality breeder pellets, and as much lucern hay as they can eat)
I've tried to attach some photos but not sure if they will work.
Thanks guys for your time!
Lauren
Ok so my story is a pretty long one but I'll try and cover it all so you guys know where I'm at and whats going on.
Firstly, I am not a horse breeder. I have worked on a couple of thoroughbred and warmblood studs for time but that was a few years ago now. I do have basic experience in foaling horses down. (Ive assisted with half a dozen foals personally) I am also a veterinary nurse although I predominately work with small animals. I have owned and ridden horses from a young age and have often bought project horses and ponies, broken them and sold them on down the track so I'm not new to the whole horse game.
Now to my current predicament.
I few weeks ago I purchased a pony mare as a bit of a project. (Little Buckskin I named Lou Lou) The information I have on her is that she was mustered up with a mob of wild horses from a large property that was owned by a mine that now wanted to begin to develop it. The woman I bought her off had owned her from about 6 weeks and had done very little handling. She was very thin but with a large belly but looking you couldn't tell she was in foal. (I thought she was just wormy as Ive had them like that before) Anyway, I brought her home, put in a few days of good handling, wormed her, vaccinated her and then got her checked by the vet. Surprise surprise she was heavily in foal. Her udder was present and empty, and the vet estimated her age at about 13 years old. Im assuming she has had multiple foals before.
Once I found out she was in foal I contacted the previous owners to see if I could chase up any more history. When I spoke to them they didn't know anything more but gave me the number of the woman who organised the sale. (The mob was sold off the back of a truck on the way to the doggers.)
They also mentioned that her sister had another mare from the sale mob (They bought two and one sister got one, the other sister got the other) I was pretty reluctant to take on another horse after just finding out my one project pony had just turned into two but once they showed me the photos I felt so horribly sorry for her that I went and picked her up.
This is where the story gets really sad.
The second pony (A palomino I named Xena) Was very emaciated. She had a pretty serious looking injury to her back off side hoof and she was totally terrified. I have worked with some difficult horses but this was like nothing I have even seen before. She was being kept in a cement backyard, hardly enough room for her to walk around and lie down. She had been flogged within an inch of her life. (The boyfriend made a show of demonstrating how he felt with her before I swiftly put an end to that!) He informed me straight off the bat, she kicks, she strikes she's stubborn. (He seemed to think that the horse throwing itself over a fence and onto the ground while being flogged demonstrated stubbornness) Even writing this down makes my blood boil!! So we ran her onto the float and I wormed her and vaccinated her in the float. For the first 24 hours I fed her only a limited amount of grass hay and she pooed straight dirt. I can't believe she didn't colic. I got the vet out straight away to check her leg and also got her scanned to see if she was in foal. (I figured she couldn't be very far along if she was in foal and I was considering terminating it if she was due to her horrible body condition.) When the vet tested her he was as surprised as me that she was also heavily in foal. He said if it was a regular horse he would estimate she was due in 2-3 months but due to her malnourishment she may be further along and the foal might just be small. He said the foot wasn't good but it wasn't infected and he estimated it was injured about 6 weeks ago. (They mentioned she cut her foot on the tin when they first got her) Even so sedated she had to lean against the fence to stand we still had to twitch her to stop her from kicking the absolute s*** out of the vet. He said at this stage it wasn't worth putting her body through the stress of the sedations needed to try and treat the foot now. It was to much risk for her and the foal so we are going to revisit it once she's a bit better handled and the foal has been born. It also looks like she has foaled before (judging by her udder)
I'd like to point out at this point that these people only had these horses for 6 weeks!
I managed to contact the woman who organised their sale, (She was as horrified as me) and she sent me photos of the horses from before they took them. They were fat and shinny.
So I've had these girls for about a month now. Just spend a lot of time feeding and gentle handling. Lou Lou has progressed extremely well. She had very little handling so is frightened but a very kind girl who is pretty cruisy about everything as long as you take your time with her.
Xena is a different story.
For the first few days she just about tried to kill herself every time I went into the yard to pick up the poo. She will also stand and shake like a leaf. Absolutely trembling from head to foot. After a while she began to calm down but its been a slow process. Every time she gets a little fright and jumps a little she immediately thinks she will get flogged and absolutely flies off the handle. This has made her pretty dangerous and unpredictable to handle not only for me but also for her. She will literally throw herself through anything and everything in her path to escape. Luckily I have reasonably good horse yards with better ones on the way. (I'd rather spend the money on fences then vet bills when a foal puts its leg through the fence) I know even the safest fences aren't a guarantee but I'd like to be as safe as possible.
Anyway, she's getting much better now. Ive taught her to lead, back up, step forward and she's getting more comfortable with me touching her neck and back. Her greatest achievement by far is that now if she gets a fright its just jumps and whys. She doesn't absolutely flip out although she does still tremble when exposed to new things. Well some days are better then others but she's come such a long way!!
Ok, so now that I've rambled so long you guys probably won't even read the whole post I'll try and get to the point.
Soooo, I check both their udders twice a day when I feed them. Last night I noticed Lou Lou was starting to bag up. No massive deal... She's put on a lot of condition over the last few weeks and I'm optimistic that her foal will be fine.
The real shock came when I had a look at Xena's udder and she's beginning to bag up too. She doesn't even look remotely in foal. Her ribs are still showing its just sad all round.
First question! (Told you I would get to it eventually)
What are your experiences with older mares that have foaled before? Do they generally bag up earlier or later in the pregnancy? I know that question is totally mute because it totally depends on the mare and not having any history there now way of knowing with these girls) Just after some reassurance guys its been a few years since I've done this and I've never had the stress of them being my own horses!
Second question! (I have already called the vet waiting for him to call me back he's king house calls today)
Anybody had experience foaling poor/thin mares. Any thoughts on how the foal might be affected or how the mare might handle the delivery? I'm already thinking weak/small foal. I should be sourcing some colostrum in case it is to weak to feed. (I would never be able to milk her) I'm also thinking hopefully the mare has enough reserves to produce enough milk to feed the foal, or even just to get through the labour.
Stressful times!!!
Anything you guys can think of, helpful pointers or tips would be great! I'm hopeful not to get to many negative comments. I've taken on a lot with these girls and I just want to give them and their foals the best care I can.
(I should mention here although its common sense I've got these girl on high quality breeder pellets, and as much lucern hay as they can eat)
I've tried to attach some photos but not sure if they will work.
Thanks guys for your time!
Lauren