Question about genes
 
 

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Question about genes

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  • Homozygous paints.homestead.com
  • Can a homozgous black have a cream gene

 
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    09-02-2010, 04:24 PM
  #1
Foal
Question about genes

Hey guys I just got a little buckskin paint stud colt and his sire is triple homozygous. Homozygous for the Tobiano Gene, Homozygous for the Dilute Gene, and Homozygous for Black. So does that mean that my colt will also be homozygous for all of those to? Also here is the link to his sire http://homozygouspaints.homestead.com/MKSMagicJohnson.html
if you could please let me know what you think of the bloodlines that would be great to :)
     
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    09-02-2010, 05:34 PM
  #2
Lis
Yearling
No, it means he'll be heterozygous unless his dam was also homozygous for all that as well.
     
    09-02-2010, 05:55 PM
  #3
Showing
Not entirely sure how he can be homozygous black and perlino at the same time. Unless I am mistaken, adding an agouti gene and 2 creme genes would change the "black" part of that homozygous. Then again, I'm not really a genetics guru. Lis had that part right though, if he is in fact homozygous for all those things then your foal will be heterozygous unless the dam is also homozygous. I don't see anything outstanding anywhere in his bloodlines, however, I am not terribly familiar with APHA lines.
     
    09-02-2010, 06:14 PM
  #4
Trained
They are all separate genes so he can be homozygous for everything. He is a Perleno so that in and of itself is Homozygous cream on Black bass. He can be also Homozygous black and Homozygous Tab. He could also be Homozygous Agouti but it would be hard to see on a Perleno.

Past all that the sire will give one set of genes to the foal so Unless the mare some some of all of these genes will determine if the foal is Homozygous or not. He can not be homozygous based only on his sire. He needs the same gene from his dam also.
     
    09-03-2010, 12:05 PM
  #5
Yearling
Quote:
Originally Posted by nrhareiner    
They are all separate genes so he can be homozygous for everything. He is a Perleno so that in and of itself is Homozygous cream on Black bass. He can be also Homozygous black and Homozygous Tab. He could also be Homozygous Agouti but it would be hard to see on a Perleno.

Past all that the sire will give one set of genes to the foal so Unless the mare some some of all of these genes will determine if the foal is Homozygous or not. He can not be homozygous based only on his sire. He needs the same gene from his dam also.
You can't see "homozygous" for Agouti on a horse - they look bay (or buckskin)... it has to be tested for.

Other than that... yes, the foal will only be homozygous for any genes he also gets from it's dam.
     
    09-03-2010, 12:18 PM
  #6
Trained
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheLastUnicorn    
You can't see "homozygous" for Agouti on a horse - they look bay (or buckskin)... it has to be tested for.
Yes I know. I did not word that correctly. I was more saying that he may or may not carry it as you can not see the Agouti working on a Perleno like you do a bay.
     
    09-03-2010, 06:13 PM
  #7
Yearling
I suppose that's true enough - but the fact that it's Perlino tells you the horse carries agouti as it a bay horse with two cream genes. Perlino horses HAVE to carry agouti (heterzygous or homozygous), it's what makes them Perlino instead of Smokey Cream.

Even in a regular bay horse you can't tell zygositiy (of agouti) just by looking... it still needs to be tested for, at least as far as I know.
     
    09-03-2010, 06:18 PM
  #8
Trained
Yes you are correct. However most people will call a smakie cream a perleno as you can not really tell by looking.

I have a bay mare that all she will produce is bays. No other choice on her side. Now if the sire happen to have some other modifier you could end up with a different color but it really limits what you can get.

The one thing I am wondering is really where did the second cream come from. I know that it could have hid in his dam but man you really really really have to go fare back to find it and it would have to hid for a long long time. Not that it can't but I sure would want to see the DNA test that show parentage verification on that horse before I would use him for breeding.
     
    09-03-2010, 06:46 PM
  #9
Yearling
It must be that his dam was a smokey black. He didn't get both from his sire's side... and he's definitely a double cream dilute. I would find it odd that they'd "mistake" which mare he was born to... or lie. It'd be too easy to prove it incorrect. Just test the stallion's dam.

Cream is a dominant gene - the only thing it won't cover (entirely... you'll see it until the horse greys out) is grey. If the horse carries it, it's there.... the thing is, it won't show on a black coat (at least not the way we're used to seeing it). There's no such thing as cream skipping generations.

Within the Canadian breed (I know... different breed, bear with me) I know cream HAS indeed hidden itself well behind all the blacks. It's not very often that you can tell by looking at a smokey black that they have a cream gene. There was some "hype" over the first Smokey Cream Canadian horse - because it wasn't well known that they carried the cream gene at all.
     
    09-03-2010, 07:05 PM
  #10
Trained
Yes it can hid in black however look at his pedigree. It would have to hid for several generations. You normally will see a pally or buckskin one back and it hided in the next but in this case it is so fare back that you almost can not find it. There is not a cream dilute on his papers bottom side.
     

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