In-Utero Foal (Arabian)

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In-Utero Foal (Arabian)

This is a discussion on In-Utero Foal (Arabian) within the Horse Breeding forums, part of the Horse Breeds, Breeding, and Genetics category

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    08-29-2012, 08:38 AM
In-Utero Foal (Arabian)

My uncle owns and Arabian breeding facility and currently just bred one of his Arab mares to his stallion Zaire SLG who is the son of his famous stallion Zambizy (I've been trying to get my hands on a Zambizy baby my whole life! Haha). I am VERY interested in the foal and he agreed to let me purchase him/her if I choose after its born. I am an endurance rider and currently own one Arab gelding who still have a few years atleast of training to get through, so theres no rush on time. To make a long story short, this baby won't be born for another year, however I would like to get your opinions on this cross.

Sire: Zarie Slg Arabian (sorry his dam IS registered just not in the database at this time...she is on arabian data source if you are a member)

Dam: Jj Emilee Arabian

I don't have a picture of the Dam but below is the Sire. Will try to get a pic of her soon.
I have seen both sire & dam in person multiple times.

Thank you!
Attached Images
File Type: jpg ZAIRE2.jpg (56.3 KB, 147 views)
File Type: jpg ZAIRE3.jpg (52.4 KB, 147 views)
File Type: jpg ZAIRE.jpg (22.8 KB, 148 views)
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    08-29-2012, 10:22 AM
I'd like to see Zarie's dam's pedigree. On his sire's side, he has quite a few inbreedings back to Comet. I've never been a fan of the overbreeding of one particular lineage in a horse's pedigree. If his mother has sufficient outcrossing, I wouldn't be as concerned.

Both the mare and stallion have Bask as well as Comet in their pedigrees, and the mare also has Aladdin, whom I liked quite a bit.

On paper they look fine, and the stallion looks put together well enough, although I can't really tell much about his conformation. The only really decent picture is the one of him under saddle, and of course that covers up part of his body.
    08-29-2012, 11:13 AM
Here is a picture taken of his FULL pedigree. Hopefully you can see it...sorry for the poor picture quality. Does his dam have anything to compensate in his breeding? I've heard of Nazeer a few times but not sure what he's all about.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg ZAIRE PEDIGREE.jpg (38.8 KB, 118 views)
    08-29-2012, 11:15 AM
Oooohhh, some Egyptian! Would love to see halter shots of both without the saddle! Has this cross been made before? If so, do you have any pictures of the offspring? If this cross has not been made it would be nice to see pictures of their off spring and the horse/s they were mated with. You will see traits coming through.
EnduranceLover6 likes this.
    08-29-2012, 11:19 AM
Wow, his mother has a royal pedigree! A veritable who's-who of Polish and Egyptian breeding. I bet she was quite the looker in her day.

Nazeer was one of the premiere Polish breeding stallions of his day, and Ansata Ibn Halima was a well known Egyptian stallion. The cross of Polish/Egyptian strains has created some absolutely lovely horses.
    08-29-2012, 11:37 AM
Great info! Thank you! No my uncle has not bred Zaire yet, so this foal will be his first. Fingers crossed. His sire Zambizy was another stallion my uncle owned and bred but unfortunately was put down years ago. Zambizy produced some fantastic horses, which is why my uncle has high hopes for Zaire. I will try to get him to send me some pictures of both Zaire & JJ Emilee so you guys can tell me what you think =) Below I posted a picture of Zambizy...handsome black fellow with the best personality. Body wise, he and Zaire are almost identical.

I love how you guys can tell me so much about the horse's in both pedigrees...i know very little about the history of them...keep it comin'!!!
Attached Images
File Type: jpg zambizy.jpg (29.3 KB, 120 views)
    08-29-2012, 12:15 PM
Most of the horses 4 or 5 generations back were all multiple National Champions or had comparable titles from other competitions around the world. Some in halter but many more in performance, which is what you're looking for when you want a strong, willing, under saddle partner.

Bask was imported to the US from Poland, and he was a VERY big player back in the 1970s-early 1980s. There were very few horses bred that didn't have Bask somewhere in their pedigree. My now deceased heart horse was Crabbet bred, but also had Bask in his dam's lineage.

Bask wasn't the 'prettiest' Arabian, but he had substance and put good bone and sturdy bodies on his foals, who in turn did the same for their foals. As a Polish bred his profile was straighter, because the Polish Stud was concerned more about their horses overall conformation and longevity, than worried about whether or not they had exaggerated jibbahs.

Ansata Ibn Halima was THE Egyptian stallion people bred to back in the day. Ansata Arabians had some lovely horses, but I think they inbred far too much in later years. Some of their horses were dingbat crazy.

There are a lot of mares I recognize as well, so it wasn't just the stallions who put their stamp on the resulting foals. In order to produce a superior animal, both sides of the equation need to be superlative individuals.
Wallaby and EnduranceLover6 like this.
    08-29-2012, 12:41 PM
I'm interested about the Bask in there, many people beleive that Bask bred horses can be a little "coo-coo". Do you find this true? My other gelding is strongly Bask bred and he is a handful and a half, I've only owned him for a year and just barely starting to get somewhere with him. Then again, I think being an unhandled halter stallion for the first 4 years of his life has a lot to do with his "mental" status. Some say he may never be cut out to handle the trail because he is halter bred, im not giving up yet, but do you think this is true? Here is his pedigree and a picture.

Magnific Af Arabian just curious about Bask in general...some say stay away...others adore him. Is it the inbreeding that tends to be too much? Obviously Zaire doesn't have Bask inbreeding but maybe inbreeding in general should be a concern?

Will post pictures of sire & dam tonight.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 058.jpg (100.0 KB, 106 views)
    08-29-2012, 12:51 PM
Magnific doesn't appear to have an overabundance of Bask in his lineage. He has quite a few other horses in there as well, and he's as royally bred as Zaire. I noticed Ruminaja Ali and Khemosabi in his pedigree, both of whom I adored. Khemo was a standard unto himself, and I could wax poetic for hours about him alone.

I never found Bask bred horses to be nuts but they are sensitive, intelligent, and easily bored. They're also powerhouses, and if you're not a firm handler they'll walk all over you. The Varian horses are the same way (Bey El Bey).

People who find Arabians 'crazy' tend to be the ones who shouldn't own them. They're not horses for the timid or who want a horse who doesn't think for itself. With an Arabian, you need to convince them WHY they should listen to you. Many people don't want to deal with that attitude, and that's fine. Just don't label the horse nuts because you're not smart enough!

Halter bred horses can be and often are retrained for under saddle work. It depends on the horse's personality whether or not he'll be able to go out alone, not his breeding. I currently have a pure Polish bred gelding who simply cannot go out on the trails alone. With other horses he's completely fine, but alone he has a meltdown. Easy enough to deal with, since I rarely ride alone now that I'm not young and fearless anymore!
EnduranceLover6 likes this.
    08-29-2012, 01:15 PM
The Bask in Zaire's pedigree wouldn't concern me nearly as much as the multiple lines to Comet. Comet bred horses can be VERY hot, which is also what makes them excellent candidates for endurance and trail. They want to GO.

Your gelding is not what I would call over bred with Bask, and while Bask horses can be a handful, very opinionated and lots of energy, most are really good hearted. Bay El Bey, even generations back, is a very prepotent ancestor and gives his relations a real good opinion of themselves.

On paper the breeding looks good, but I would want really good shots of both stallion and mare, as well as any known issues either one has before I'd evaluate the breeding. I like to look at the whole pic, not just part of it.
Speed Racer likes this.

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