Saddleseat- How has this not been outlawed? - Page 15

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Saddleseat- How has this not been outlawed?

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    01-21-2012, 04:27 PM
Originally Posted by drop_your_reins    
@Bubba13 ... Names, proof? I'm sure you are correct and that is a terrible story, but it's just one. It shouldn't represent the breed and trainers as a whole. And maybe it was my mistake for including Arabs, since I admit I don't know a ton about them.. I doubt that would happen in the Morgan circuit (of which I am primarily defending). I would never use corrective shoeing on a horse in addition to padding them up for saddleseat, especially if the horse can't handle it.
I won't provide names because I really don't want a libel lawsuit on my hands, nor do I want to jeopardize my future career. I tried to out a well-known hauling company once for hideous abuse I witnessed, and was rewarded with a threatening phone call from the owner after I sent in a report to the Better Business Bureau. People are nasty, and will do horrible things to protect their reputation. Proof....well, not sure how to provide that, either. Wish I had copies of the radiographs or pictures of the feet.

Hang on....Internet's acting up. More to come....
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    01-21-2012, 04:41 PM
Green Broke
Originally Posted by LadyDreamer    
I would be MORE than happy to help answer anyone's questions they have on the issue. I want nothing more than for myths to be dispelled or miscommunications to be sorted out.
The professionals that you mentioned regarding tail cutting, what is their profession? Here in SE WI, (lots of ASB farms), vets will not do the cutting, it's done by 'someone' else, either the trainer or someone the trainer knows.
    01-21-2012, 04:47 PM
It is really, really hard to find photos of their feet, but I found three from the barn in question. The first one is their big-name stallion. I'm no farrier, but I've discussed this extensively with my farrier (who used to shoe for them) and with other farriers online, and yes, this creates huge lameness problems down the road--and frequently in the current day. There's a reason that horses' feet don't naturally look like this: it's not conducive to soundness. Ever heard of "long toe, low heel" syndrome, and the problems it causes? Yeah. I have personal experience with that in my horses after an experience with a very bad backyard farrier. One constantly tripped very badly but recovered once his hooves were fixed, one developed navicular and never regained soundess, and one suffered multiple tears to the deep digital flexor tendon under the coffin bone. And weighted shoes, as I've said before, multiply the effects of improper movement and are tough on joints. When you need to bolt metal bands across the top of the hoof to make the shoe stay on, you know something is wrong.

Originally Posted by drop_your_reins    
If we want to start discipline bashing, I can bring up a ton of horror stories in the racing industry, working western (QHs), Hunter/Jumper circuit, Dressage, etc.
Absolutely. Lord knows the horror stories I could tell about Western Pleasure barns, halter, barrel racing, and roping. But I'd argue that most everyone is so accustomed and numb to the problems in their own discipline that they fail that they fail to see what others perceive as abuse. They see it as normal, necessary, right. Not so. If you stop thinking about it from the perspective of winning in the show ring, and consider the best interest of the horse and its welfare only, you'll see that many of the things we take for granted in our own sports are honest-to-god detrimental to the horse's physical and mental wellbeing.
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    01-22-2012, 01:32 AM
Originally Posted by drop_your_reins    
I am not in denial over anything. I know that I have ambitions to bring my mare to some Morgan regionals to show in Saddleseat.......

I'm sorry that there are people out there who abuse their horses and some of those people happen to be of a saddleseat background, but the sport as a whole is not harmful to the horse.

If we want to start discipline bashing, I can bring up a ton of horror stories in the racing industry, working western (QHs), Hunter/Jumper circuit, Dressage, etc. Everyone seems to think that the EXTREMISTS in a given discipline represent the discipline as a whole.
First, please note I never said a word about Morgans. Don't know a thing about them, I'm strictly into the Arabian and Arabian X thing, don't know nor care what another breed does in their own venues. I'm just commenting that people in the Arabian industry are trying to deny that abuses exist. I'm going to say that from what I've witnessed JUST in the halter barns gives the lie to saying abuse in the performance barns doesn't exist. And not just in saddleseat.

I am not discipline bashing at all. In fact, I'll give you lick for lick with what I've seen in halter training barns, look at the ridiculous padding up they do for main ring hunter pleasure and tell me you could chase a fox with your horse shod like that......not friggin' likely. Heck, they're even padding up Western Pleasure horses because they need to move rounder.....slower.......and deadening the WP horses tails.....oh's happened in the Arabian rings. I've seen horses with their heads tied up and pvc pipes or wood blocks wired in their mouths before a WP class.....tell me the therapeutic purpose behind that, will someone? And bring the London Bridge along with you because I'm a pretty hard sell.

After 40 years in the business, I have a pretty darned good idea what goes on in the back barns behind the curtains. I stick around because I love to show and I love my horses and when we're on, we show them that you CAN do au natural, no pads, no drugs, no ties, no ginger. You may not have the chemical, enhanced version of the Stepford Horse but you can be pretty darn good.
    01-22-2012, 10:22 AM
My thoughts are....there are two kinds of horse show people:

1. People with the "win at all costs" attitude
2. People WITHOUT the 'win at all costs" attitude

No discipline is immune from unsavory methods, and no breed is immune to unsavory methods, and the whole other side of the horse industry that DOES not show is not immune to unsavory methods. It comes down to which person YOU want to be....a number 1 or a number 2.

I show AQHA on a very competitive regional circuit with a competitive horse, but I have chosen to be a number 2 because I think of my horse's welfare first. And choosing to be a number 2 has not hurt my placings any; with a Top 5 and two Top 10's at our AQHA regional championship show. You don't have to succumb to the pressure of the "win at all cost" people to be just as competitive as them.
Gremmy, SorrelHorse and mystykat like this.

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