Bay or Brownskin? - Page 2
 
 

       The Horse Forum > Horse Breeds, Breeding, and Genetics > Horse Colors and Genetics

Bay or Brownskin?

This is a discussion on Bay or Brownskin? within the Horse Colors and Genetics forums, part of the Horse Breeds, Breeding, and Genetics category

    Like Tree8Likes

     
    LinkBack Thread Tools
        09-26-2012, 02:14 PM
      #11
    Yearling
    Really cool. I told my mother in law, and she didnt seem as interested as me, lol... I really like this stuff and learning. I am wondering about his mom. I think she might be a brown too. We have always thought she was a bay too... The last pic I posted just because itt's pretty, lol...
    Attached Images
    File Type: jpg 25102_105595469468922_3619684_n.jpg (79.3 KB, 62 views)
    File Type: jpg 25102_105595476135588_3293124_n.jpg (63.6 KB, 60 views)
    File Type: jpg 29781_121081397920329_2947257_n.jpg (91.2 KB, 63 views)
         
    Sponsored Links
    Advertisement
     
        09-26-2012, 02:23 PM
      #12
    Yearling
    And my horse Buck. The first horse posted (Tollo) is his half brother. They have the same daddy (sorry, habit, lol... sire!). So father is a black and white tobiano paint, and Buck's mother was a chestnut with rabicano. He has white ticking in his barrel, which makes him most likely red based, right? So (as long as Buck is a red bay like I thought).... The sire has a bay gene, which for some odd reason isnt being dominent with this mare when they foal? She had one more foal from him (she was already pregnant when we got her) that was a chestnut paint. So which one is more likely to be passing the bay gene? Buck is a bay, And if it's the daddy, then why isnt tollo a bay? I thought bay was dominant? Again I posted the last one bc I think his coloring is pretty, lol.....
    Attached Images
    File Type: jpg 29781_121081354587000_5256402_n.jpg (82.7 KB, 58 views)
    File Type: jpg 548336_2010100709479_1939620825_n.jpg (88.7 KB, 67 views)
    File Type: jpg 547634_2030841707991_1183290106_n.jpg (34.0 KB, 56 views)
         
        09-26-2012, 02:31 PM
      #13
    Green Broke
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by NdAppy    
    No. It used to be thought of as a sooty buckskin, but since the discovery that brown is a separate gene a lot of buckskins that were thought to be sooty are actually brown based and "black horses with pangare" are actually browns.
    So, I realize that brown used to be mistaken for a lot of different things, but I'm curious about that particular horse as it doesn't look like other brown buckskins I've seen (e.g. The OP's post in this thread: Buckskin...?)

    Chiilaa, do you know that horse personally?
         
        09-26-2012, 02:40 PM
      #14
    Trained
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by verona1016    
    So, I realize that brown used to be mistaken for a lot of different things, but I'm curious about that particular horse as it doesn't look like other brown buckskins I've seen (e.g. The OP's post in this thread: Buckskin...?)

    Chiilaa, do you know that horse personally?
    He's just darker.. There are varying shades of every color. He looks the same as the one you've linked to, just darker. It's only seeing bright orange sorrels and then seeing a liver chestnut and saying, "The one doesn't look like the ones I've seen."

    For everyone to see, this is what a sooty buckskin would look like:
         
        09-27-2012, 01:09 AM
      #15
    Yearling
    He's pretty...

    Poseidn! You know ur color and genetics, and you didnt reply! LOL I think you helped me confirm that buck is a light red bay with countershading (I thought he was a dark buckskin or dun in a post long ago). Buck's mother was a chestnut (which means she obviously wouldnt have a bay gene (I think), and so that leaves the sir (the black and white paint) to be the one carrying the bay gene. And if that is so, why wasnt it passed to either of foals (the original gelding in question, and his full brother, who is a chestnut and red ONLY- no points AT ALL!!! Paint)
         
        09-27-2012, 01:21 AM
      #16
    Trained
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Wheatermay    
    He's pretty...

    Poseidn! You know ur color and genetics, and you didnt reply! LOL I think you helped me confirm that buck is a light red bay with countershading (I thought he was a dark buckskin or dun in a post long ago). Buck's mother was a chestnut (which means she obviously wouldnt have a bay gene (I think), and so that leaves the sir (the black and white paint) to be the one carrying the bay gene. And if that is so, why wasnt it passed to either of foals (the original gelding in question, and his full brother, who is a chestnut and red ONLY- no points AT ALL!!! Paint)
    It is entirely possible for Buck's dam to carry agouti (the bay gene). Agouti restricts black to certain points, which is the difference between a black and a bay. However, chestnut horses are red based, not black based, so there is no black to restrict. They can carry agouti, but there is no way to know without genetic testing.

    It is impossible for a black horse to have agouti because the black is not restricted. Bay is black + agouti A (the At mutation of agouti is brown). Agouti is a dominant gene, meaning if a horse carries it, it WILL show it.

    I started answering before I finished reading this entirely. Based on what you said about his brother, their dam is heterozygous for agouti, meaning she will pass it on 50% of the time. And also that their sire is heterozygous for black if he has a red foal because black is dominant. A homozygous black horse will always produce a black-based foal. Sorrel/chestnut horses are homozygous for red, which is why crossing a chestnut with a chestnut will always result in chestnut.
         
        09-27-2012, 01:42 AM
      #17
    Yearling
    Man I had to read that a couple times, lol. I get it finally tho! Thanks you very much! :) I have a hard time remembering all of it, but I do love it! Ur a genius! Different momma's tho. Same sire!

    Ok I understand Buck...

    So what is the gene's for brown? Does it have a black base? Mom is a brown right?
         
        09-27-2012, 01:44 AM
      #18
    Yearling
    The first headshot of the bay (Buck) has the paint gelding I was speaking about. That is Tollo' s full brother.
         
        09-27-2012, 01:47 AM
      #19
    Trained
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Wheatermay    
    Man I had to read that a couple times, lol. I get it finally tho! Thanks you very much! :) I have a hard time remembering all of it, but I do love it! Ur a genius! Different momma's tho. Same sire!

    Ok I understand Buck...

    So what is the gene's for brown? Does it have a black base? Mom is a brown right?
    Brown is caused by agouti also. There are three mutations of agouti: A, At, and A+. A = bay. At = Brown. A+ = wild bay, which isn't nearly as common and hasn't been isolated yet so there is no test for it. Wild bay restricts the black to the pasterns and the rest of the body is generally lighter than the average bay. I've never seen a wild bay, personally, but I did see a "Wild buckskin" once. Typical-looking buckskin, but the black on his legs only went up to his fetlocks. BUT I digress.

    All three are black based, as they are all some variation of Black + Agouti. There are only two base colors, red and black. Any other color is a modification of either of those two colors.
         
        09-27-2012, 01:50 AM
      #20
    Yearling
    Awesome! Thanks! Very cool stuff! I can understand you far better than anything online, lol... I get everything now! :)
    Poseidon likes this.
         

    Quick Reply
    Please help keep the Horse Forum enjoyable by reporting rude posts.
    Message:
    Options

    Register Now

    In order to be able to post messages on the The Horse Forum forums, you must first register.

    Already have a Horse Forum account?
    Members are allowed only one account per person at the Horse Forum, so if you've made an account here in the past you'll need to continue using that account. Please do not create a new account or you may lose access to the Horse Forum. If you need help recovering your existing account, please Contact Us. We'll be glad to help!

    New to the Horse Forum?
    Please choose a username you will be satisfied with using for the duration of your membership at the Horse Forum. We do not change members' usernames upon request because that would make it difficult for everyone to keep track of who is who on the forum. For that reason, please do not incorporate your horse's name into your username so that you are not stuck with a username related to a horse you may no longer have some day, or use any other username you may no longer identify with or care for in the future.

    User Name:
    Password
    Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
    Password:
    Confirm Password:
    Email Address
    Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
    Email Address:

    Log-in

    Human Verification

    In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.


    Old Thread Warning
    This thread is more than 90 days old. When a thread is this old, it is often better to start a new thread rather than post to it. However, If you feel you have something of value to add to this particular thread, you can do so by checking the box below before submitting your post.

    Thread Tools



    All times are GMT -4. The time now is 10:42 PM.


    Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
    Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
    Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.6.0