Brindle or Roan? - Page 10 - The Horse Forum

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post #91 of 160 Old 04-27-2012, 04:07 PM Thread Starter
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Oh okay, sorry, I thought you were. And I am, but it's not just this whole convo causing it.
And I asked people what they thought about bay dun on a Kiger site, this is what was said
"There is a sooty gene, also called counter-shading, that puts back black into the coat. It's not understood really well but on some horses its like a darker blanket thrown over them, falling on the top surfaces of the horse. Think of a sooty buckskin. Sometimes it is all over evenly. Think of a dark chestnut or dark palomino. Since it is a separate gene it can occur with other genes, like the dun gene. Some experts say that if you don't have a light coat color it "can't" be dun. But a dun and a sooty gene cause a darker color, usually all over the horse. So if the horse has an eel stripe (a hard line dorsal) it is dun, regarless of coat color. The challenge is that the sooty gene also makes a dorsal, but it has fuzzy edges. When you have a horse that is so dark that you can't tell whether the dorsal is sharp or fuzzy you really can't say for sure that it is dun, but if it has other markings, like leg barring, ear barring or light hair inside the ears - it is likely dun. So a bay dun has a hard edged dorsal and a darker coat color."

Last edited by Mike_Admin; 04-28-2012 at 06:55 AM.
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post #92 of 160 Old 04-27-2012, 04:12 PM
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she is unique to say the least

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post #93 of 160 Old 04-27-2012, 04:14 PM
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Genetic testing would clear this up. It's fairly inexpensive and accurate.

Just be careful of people at the registry. They aren't always (and I'll even say RARELY) well informed about genetics. The ARE interested in promoting their breed, however.

Do some research on color genetics and testing. Have your horses tested. It would be exciting to see EXACTLY what genes are there, which ones are being expressed, and which ones might be hidden.

Good luck!

Come join us on the Texas Horse Friends thread.http://www.horseforum.com/horse-talk...riends-125927/
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post #94 of 160 Old 04-27-2012, 04:15 PM
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That answer is convoluted to say the least. Sooty has nothing to do with whether a horse is a bay dun or not.

A bay dun is defined as being a black horse with agouti and dun. Sooty has nothing to do with that description.
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post #95 of 160 Old 04-27-2012, 04:16 PM
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Well that's confusing Are they saying that it's only called a bay dun because sooty can make it appear darker? Because that's not what's being said at all...

Dun only exists on top of a base colour - like red or black, or red with agouti (aka "bay"). A bay dun is a bay base coat with the dun dilution. A red dun is a red/chestnut/sorrel base coat with the dun dilution. Black = black dun/grullo/mouse grey etc. They are correct that sooty can make any horse appear darker, but that has nothing to do with why he's considered a bay dun.

Edit: I stand corrected on the bay! Thanks ND, I thought I at least had that one down :P

Last edited by Gremmy; 04-27-2012 at 04:18 PM.
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post #96 of 160 Old 04-27-2012, 04:22 PM Thread Starter
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thank you texasgal, yeah i'd really like to. I will one day when I have the money.
And yeah ik Gremmy :/ and your right that it only exists on top of a base colour, but I think it could also be causing the black. I mean, his mane and tail are slightly bi-coloured, and there's no black on his legs where there's no zebra/dun factor. And his hind legs are almost completely orange. His stripes on his hind legs also almost seem to be kinda orange too. And his dorsal stripe is red, and so is the dun factoring above his nose. But his ear tips are black
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post #97 of 160 Old 04-27-2012, 04:23 PM
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Lol Gremmy there are only two base colors in horses, red and black with black being dominant over red. Everything else is a modification of those two colors. Clear as mud right?
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post #98 of 160 Old 04-27-2012, 04:23 PM
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Nokota = can you get/post a picture of the horse you are attempting to describe?
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post #99 of 160 Old 04-27-2012, 04:25 PM Thread Starter
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yes I can. But you can't see the red dorsal stripe without looking closely
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post #100 of 160 Old 04-27-2012, 04:29 PM Thread Starter
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I tried choosing ones with different lighting to show it best.[ATTACH][ATTACH][ATTACH]IMG_3292.jpg[/ATTACH][/ATTACH][/ATTACH]
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brindle , filly , grulla , nokota , roan

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