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Brown or Bay?

This is a discussion on Brown or Bay? within the Horse Colors and Genetics forums, part of the Horse Breeds, Breeding, and Genetics category

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        11-20-2012, 11:33 PM
      #11
    Yearling
    Ijafisdfinaisn -keyboard slam- The photos refuse to upload T.T However there is a decent picture of his head in my horsey/barn-thing if anyone thinks it would help.
         
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        11-20-2012, 11:37 PM
      #12
    Banned
    Haha good grief, I surrender.....it's all too confusing! I've been around horses for years.....and I am really surprised by all the different names, terms, and descriptions of all the colors and color possibilities!
    EvilHorseOfDoom likes this.
         
        11-21-2012, 12:09 AM
      #13
    Trained
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Muppetgirl    
    Haha good grief, I surrender.....it's all too confusing! I've been around horses for years.....and I am really surprised by all the different names, terms, and descriptions of all the colors and color possibilities!
    The differences between brown and bay are easy to spot once you know what to look for

    Let's look at this guy. He is fairly textbook for brown, making it very easy to see what you are looking at.



    Brown and bay are mutations of the same gene, so they act in a similar way. Bay (A) restricts black production over the majority of the body, only allowing it to be on the "hard" points of the horse - the extremities such as mane, tail, legs, ears etc. Brown (At), on the other hand, only really restricts black production from the "soft" parts of the horse - flank, muzzle, behind the eye, elbow, under the tail etc. Brown will often allow extensive black on the rest of the horse, as we see in our test case here. Other times, however, brown will mimic closely to bay, and you can be hard pressed to see the difference. That is where winter pictures come in - brown horses tend to change from season to season a bit more than bay horses do, and it is often in winter coat that we can see the clear restriction of black in the soft parts.

    Attached is an image that has the soft parts highlighted, to really bring your eye to them.
    Attached Images
    File Type: jpg brown1.jpg (71.9 KB, 81 views)
    nvr2many and BBBCrone like this.
         
        11-22-2012, 10:29 AM
      #14
    Weanling
    So, not to hijack the thread, but is Caesar bay or brown? He has a lighter muzzle but not around his eyes or flanks.
         
        11-22-2012, 11:42 AM
      #15
    Super Moderator
    So which is Belle ? I'd love to know Passport says bay and she is pretty much always described as a boring bay tb.
    Winter



    Summer
         
        11-22-2012, 12:14 PM
      #16
    Super Moderator
    ...but learning frm other threads...technically brown as she has paler points?

    The thing is, in common usage of the term "bay" (and understanding) I doubt I will persuade anyone that she is brown over here
         
        11-22-2012, 07:00 PM
      #17
    Trained
    Caesar is brown, and Belle is brown
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        11-22-2012, 07:54 PM
      #18
    Trained
    Yay brown!
         
        11-22-2012, 11:21 PM
      #19
    Weanling
    I was starting to think that, but I wasn't sure.
         
        11-23-2012, 03:27 AM
      #20
    Super Moderator
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Chiilaa    
    Caesar is brown, and Belle is brown
    I totally understand now thankyou , (have read other threads too).

    I think there are different levels of reading and understanding colour though, over here (UK) she is bay in the general understanding of the term and common usage and that wont change by her being technically brown If the majority use a term to mean a colour brown with black mane and tail and legs (and are technically wrong) then that term has it's own meaning and that doesn't make it wrong (like the word "gay" meant happy originally but now has a whole new life and valid meaning). Also, you will never tell the irish that their connemara ponies are not duns!
         

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