Is he really a "true" black? - Page 2
 
 

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Is he really a "true" black?

This is a discussion on Is he really a "true" black? within the Horse Colors and Genetics forums, part of the Horse Breeds, Breeding, and Genetics category
  • True black smoky

 
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    02-25-2011, 02:14 PM
  #11
Trained
It'd be easier to figure out after you get different pictures, but right now I'd say either fading black (just a black that fades in the sun. Still black) or maybe smoky black, but you'd have to test for cream to be sure.

What are his parents' colours?
     
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    02-25-2011, 02:35 PM
  #12
slc
Weanling
Oh yes wicked nag that is a lovely, lovely color in your photo.

Personally I think brown is a super color especially with white markings.

And like any other color it can roan, I've seen some really beautiful brown roans too.

Fading black, smoky black, no. Not this horse. No signs of fading such as the ends of the mane, etc. Smoky actually looks smokey, as if the color was washed away.

When I go look on the internet it seems the 'thing' now to call brown horses smoky black or something else other than just brown. I guess it sounds 'cooler'.

They're just brown, guys.

Be brown and proud.
     
    02-25-2011, 02:39 PM
  #13
Yearling
He's brown, but very pretty!
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    02-25-2011, 02:40 PM
  #14
Foal
I think both of them look dark brown to me.
     
    02-25-2011, 02:42 PM
  #15
Trained
Going to heartily disagree with you slc. Smokey black does not have to look smokey. There are smokey blacks that have no indications that they are carrying cream and look just black as black. Cream does a very good job of "hiding" on a black horse.


Your attitude is a little off putting and basically telling everyone that because they want to know the exact color of their horse that they are too wrapped up in color. Wanting to know what exactly the color is is no different then wanting to learn other things.
     
    02-25-2011, 02:53 PM
  #16
slc
Weanling
I would say smoky black isn't always smoky, but very often is - to me it just looks a little bit different from a completely black, just a bit washed off looking - and yes some are 'on the border' and really look like other colors. But most of the time, the smoky black - to me, honestly, yes, it just looks somewhat 'smoky'. Not like a cream or Weimereiner color, but just a bit 'washed off'. For me the real tip off it's a smoky black is that the mane and tail color is very close to the body color. We almost bought an Icelandic of that color.

And actually, it is extremely rare that a black does not fade in sun - new research in color has shown that.

There now is a genetic test to differentiate black and bay from brown, so if you really are interested in seeing what your horse's color is based on its genes, you can do that.

There are other ways to tell what genes an animal actually has for color, for example, test breedings.
     
    02-25-2011, 02:58 PM
  #17
Trained
Well then I have one of those rares. My black tobiano mare does not fade. I know quite a few others (black horses) that do not fade. She me the research that says it is rare for black to not fade.

As for the testing for brown... Yes, there is a test. The place that tests for it only tests for the brown extension (At) and nothing else.
     
    02-25-2011, 03:03 PM
  #18
Trained
I also know of 3 black tobianos that do not fade in the sun.. Out of about 5 black horses that I know of. Nevermind. Out of the 5 I can think of, 4 don't fade. One's just a black QH. I wouldn't exactly call that rare.

Brown horses also usually have mealy muzzles and lightened flanks. I don't see that in those pictures.
     
    02-25-2011, 03:08 PM
  #19
Started
So what would my horse be? I know what he's registered as but i'm curious to see what your thoughts are.

This is from summer:


And this is from new years this year:




Also - if anyone is feeling skippy - what color would you say my 9mth old colt is. I actually need to mark his coloring and send his registration papers in so this is helpful. ;)



And his face to see a better/more detailed bit of color:


This is from when he was 3mth if that makes a difference:
     
    02-25-2011, 03:08 PM
  #20
Trained
Quote:
Originally Posted by slc    
I would say smoky black isn't always smoky, but very often is - to me it just looks a little bit different from a completely black, just a bit washed off looking - and yes some are 'on the border' and really look like other colors. But most of the time, the smoky black - to me, honestly, yes, it just looks somewhat 'smoky'. Not like a cream or Weimereiner color, but just a bit 'washed off'. For me the real tip off it's a smoky black is that the mane and tail color is very close to the body color. We almost bought an Icelandic of that color.

And actually, it is extremely rare that a black does not fade in sun - new research in color has shown that.

There now is a genetic test to differentiate black and bay from brown, so if you really are interested in seeing what your horse's color is based on its genes, you can do that.

There are other ways to tell what genes an animal actually has for color, for example, test breedings.
Also just because a black looks "washed out" does not mean that it is carrying cream either. The only way to know if a horse is a smokey black is to test (unless you want to take a chance with breeding, but why do that when a $25 test will tell you for sure?). You cannot tell smokey black by looking. Same thing goes for smokey brown.

I would never recommend test breedings just to figure out what color a horse is. Genetic testing is the cheapest and easiest route for that without adding to the horse population. Also test breeding is not possible if the horse is gelded or spayed.
     

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