Help me out - She's brown, not bay, right? - Page 4 - The Horse Forum

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post #31 of 80 Old 03-17-2013, 02:27 AM
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Originally Posted by SorrelHorse View Post
Yes, Aires, in the summer she is a bright copper/red color.
But she's darker in the winter (like the last pic you posted)? If so, then I still say she's brown. Would be interested to see what Chillaa and NDAppy have to say.
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post #32 of 80 Old 03-17-2013, 02:29 AM
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Originally Posted by grayshell38 View Post
Case and point, guess what color this horse is genetically-

I know!! I know!!!

And, unless I'm mistaken, doesn't wild bay pretty much always express in the same way (light legs and mane with black on the end of the muzzle and ears tips)?
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post #33 of 80 Old 03-17-2013, 02:31 AM
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Thanks for being rude when I was just trying to help. I'm repeating what I know and do not appreciate being basically called a liar.
Have fun figuring out what colour your horse is. If you were asking what she was, how do you know she's not a wild bay? Doesn't make sense to me..
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Originally Posted by SorrelHorse View Post
Wildcard, I'm sorry for sounding rude, but I really don't take any credibility from "my friend's horse looked like this"....

I'm not completely ignorant, I know my mare is definitely not a wild bay.

Yes, Aires, in the summer she is a bright copper/red color.
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post #34 of 80 Old 03-17-2013, 02:33 AM Thread Starter
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I'm curious too! I'd love their opinions on this.

Of course now I'm looking at these pictures I have of her in the summer and wondering about how big of a difference there really is, and how much I might be exaggerating what my mind THINKS it sees in her vs. what the photo proof is telling me.

Summer:





Hmmm. She looks lighter but not a significant amount I guess. Am I overthinking?

Pssh.I didn't pick up the wrong lead
It's called a counter canter...
...A very advanced maneuver.
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post #35 of 80 Old 03-17-2013, 02:36 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Wildcard View Post
Thanks for being rude when I was just trying to help. I'm repeating what I know and do not appreciate being basically called a liar.
Have fun figuring out what colour your horse is. If you were asking what she was, how do you know she's not a wild bay? Doesn't make sense to me..

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I didn't ever say you were lying. Nor did I imply it.
I simply stated I don't think that statement is a credible one. Never said you were telling me lies.

Pssh.I didn't pick up the wrong lead
It's called a counter canter...
...A very advanced maneuver.
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post #36 of 80 Old 03-17-2013, 02:36 AM
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There is a difference. Not huge, but she is definitely darker in winter and you can see the lighter soft points.
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post #37 of 80 Old 03-17-2013, 02:36 AM
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Originally Posted by DraftyAiresMum View Post
I know!! I know!!!

And, unless I'm mistaken, doesn't wild bay pretty much always express in the same way (light legs and mane with black on the end of the muzzle and ears tips)?
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I never was too fond of this color until I ended up with one. (Not this shade, mind you, but genetically speaking...)

Bay, brown, and Wild bay are black base. They are black horses that are affected by the Agouti gene. The three colors/patterns whatever, are three variations on that gene.

Agouti suppresses the black body color of the horse and pushes it to the points. Each of the variations affect the black in differing amounts.

Bay pushes the black to the points of the horse.
Brown does the same but causes lighter coloration at the soft points of a horse.
Wild Bay really pushes the black off the map. Very low or nonexistant black points. Also, may demonstrate lightening on soft points.

Definitely NOT a pro or anything, this is just my plebeian go at it.
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post #38 of 80 Old 03-17-2013, 02:38 AM
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Originally Posted by grayshell38 View Post
Bay pushes the black to the points of the horse.
Brown does the same but causes lighter coloration at the soft points of a horse.
Wild Bay really pushes the black off the map. Very low or nonexistant black points. Also, may demonstrate lightening on soft points.
That's the way I understood it, too.
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post #39 of 80 Old 03-17-2013, 02:41 AM
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Sorrel, I would love to see Selena tested, just to satisfy my own curiousity. I personally think that she is probably going to test as being bay. However, I would hesitate to just call her bay, because she definitely has the lighter soft points, which a "real" bay does not. So go test her *poke*

Wildcard - just a few clarifications for you. First of all, there is no way that the OP's mare is wild bay. Wild bay restricts black extremely, and this includes on the legs and the mane and tail. Selena has far too much black on her legs for wild bay to be even a remote possibility. Secondly, the tests run by most labs for "bay" are not testing for the bay gene, but assuming it is there by elimination. They actually test for the recessive agouti gene, and if they cannot find it, they assume that the horse is carrying a dominant agouti gene. However, the flaw of this test is that there are three dominant agouti genes - wild bay, classic bay and brown - but the labs do not distinguish between them. The only lab that has any test that does is Pet DNA, so unless your friend had her arab tested through that particular lab, then the test result doesn't say the horse is bay - the results actually say the horse is not unrestricted black.
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post #40 of 80 Old 03-17-2013, 02:50 AM
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Yeah I realized she is not a wild bay, I got confused there :p and no my friend tested him through a university genetics lab, it cost her 50$ and they sent the paper back saying something along the lines of dominant agouti
Etc therefore the horse is tested as bay. Ill see if I can get her to scan the test for me. I'm not sure what you mean by pet lab?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chiilaa View Post
Sorrel, I would love to see Selena tested, just to satisfy my own curiousity. I personally think that she is probably going to test as being bay. However, I would hesitate to just call her bay, because she definitely has the lighter soft points, which a "real" bay does not. So go test her *poke*

Wildcard - just a few clarifications for you. First of all, there is no way that the OP's mare is wild bay. Wild bay restricts black extremely, and this includes on the legs and the mane and tail. Selena has far too much black on her legs for wild bay to be even a remote possibility. Secondly, the tests run by most labs for "bay" are not testing for the bay gene, but assuming it is there by elimination. They actually test for the recessive agouti gene, and if they cannot find it, they assume that the horse is carrying a dominant agouti gene. However, the flaw of this test is that there are three dominant agouti genes - wild bay, classic bay and brown - but the labs do not distinguish between them. The only lab that has any test that does is Pet DNA, so unless your friend had her arab tested through that particular lab, then the test result doesn't say the horse is bay - the results actually say the horse is not unrestricted black.
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