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Critique this colt. Opinions - can I correct him?

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  • Smokey black colt guaranteed gold

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    01-05-2012, 10:47 AM
  #71
Green Broke
I wish I could send you my farrier she would fix him up
     
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    01-05-2012, 11:15 AM
  #72
Banned
Exclamation

After going through some of the previous post/comments I wanted to add this.


Quote:
Originally Posted by New_image    
Smokey Black Thoroughbred. Coming two year old. By Guaranteed Gold out of one of our Puchilingui daughters (born prior to our purchasing the mare). This was her first colt. His owner offered him to me but feels he should be kept a stallion.
The colt has never been outside of his stall. He was stunning as a foal but has gone down hill since, he actually looks much better here than the last time I saw him about six months ago.

He needs a lot of work (Needs to accept being touched, handled, learn to lead, tie, he has never seen a farrier, learn to not bite, not kick people and as stated he hasn't even seen the outdoors... ohh yippy, all I can say is I hope he inherited his sires disposition!)
Here ^^^ new image states that this horse is almost 2 yrs old.
She also stated in those almost 2 yrs he has never been out of his stall nor had he ever seen a farrier.
She also states she owns his mother whom had this colt before she purchased her, so in stating this makes me think she was aware of the horses well beings when she purchased his mother. I will give her the benefit of a doubt that things were not as bad when she purchased the mother, but if they were then shame on her for not trying to do something about it.
She also states that the little guy is going to need to accept being touched, handled, being lead, being tied, being trimmed, learn not to bite or kick, and accept being outside. (I will come back to this point in a min.)

Quote:
Originally Posted by New_image    
I have a couple of mares from the same farm, one is his dam. She was outside with minimal handling but has come around nicely. The other is her half sister who was in a stall until I picked her up (age 5) and she appears cow hocked from how her feet were left to grow as a baby and has the same swollen knees. She was in this stall longer, obviously, until five but the knees haven't gone down and she just grew a bit crooked which at this point cannot be fixed.

Here ^^^ she talk about the little guys mother that she owns again, stating that she was outside with little handling. She also says she owns her mares half sister, who she purchased when the half sister was 5. This 2nd mare she refers to was also in a stall for her whole life, until age 5. This same mare was visibly in bad shape and she was aware of this horses well being and yet still did not do anything about it! (I will also come back to this point)





Quote:
Originally Posted by TrueColours    
Just to give everyone some background on this colt (and New_image - I am SO glad to see him go to you! ), the breeder and owner of this colt passed away about a year ago now. He was in his 60's and did 100% of the horse duties himself

When this colt was born, he had just undergone major surgery (hip replacement) and was bedridden a lot of the time. His daughter helped out as much as she could. His wife always had "0" to do with the horses and didnt participate at all after his surgery, nor did she help out after he passed away either. He was also in ailing health overall but too proud to admit it and slow down. It was nothing for him to put up 3000-4000 bales of hay by himself if he couldnt get anyone to help him

The daughter did the very best she could in managing her own home and family and coming over every day to tend to the needs of the horses, while grieving the loss of her father. She also got the word out on the horses and slowly, one by one, placed them.

I know that she intended to keep this colt - she liked him a lot, but I believe she wasnt given that opportunity due to circumstances beyond her control and I believe what happened next was that without her there looking after the horse end of things, this colt was left in the care of the mother who - once again - had "0" interest, ability or desire to look after any of them let alone a young colt. Remember she was in her 60's as well, in poor health and probably never dealt with any of them let alone a young, rambunctious colt, so she simply left him in the stall until she could figure out what to do with him

No excuses for any of this. It was simply a horrific set of circumstances and the horses did end up suffering through no fault of their own but I guess when you have someone in their 60's with no interest in the horses overnight being given the responsibility of looking after 20+ of them, a lot of things arent done correctly at all. The father adored these horses - they were his whole life and he did the best for them when he was living. In an instant he was gone through a freak accident, with no one to step up to the plate after him

I miss him terribly still. He was a wonderful man and a very dear friend ... he would have been terribly upset to see what life this colt had led before New_image got him

All the very very best with him

Here ^^^ True Colours gives a background of this little guy.
She states the his original owner (whom also owned both mare New Image refers to in her previous post) past away a year ago now. She also states that at the time this horse was born the original owner had just had hip surgery, that kept him bedridden a lot of the time, and that even before he was not in the best of health. Obviously he was still the main care giver when the mares New Image refers to were on his property. Meaning he was aware the one mare was not being handle much, basically left outside to be wild, while another mare was locked in a stall 24/7, basically rotting away. If he "adored" these horses as much as you claim why would he allow them to live like this? There are 1,000s of horse lovers/adorers out there that want/have horses but only a handful of them are actually decent caregivers and very few are good horse owners.

She also states he was to proud to admit her could no longer handle everything or slow down but yet she did nothing to help the situation and if she did nothing that worked.

She also states about how the daughter tried to help. She says the daughter got word out and slowly re homed them, this I would like to applaud. It is very hard to re home horses, especially horses in poor health/condition even harder when you have so many horses.

She then goes on to say the daughter really liked this colt and that she planned to keep him but things beyond her control prevented this from happening. From this comment I get confused, why if she cared so much for this colt did she not do anything, she did not even let him out of his stall for heavens sake.



Again I have to point out, if he cared so much for these horses why would he not have set something up for them in case something happened to him. If he was in bad health I am sure he was aware so there is no way he could not have thought something could happen to me and then who would care for them? I mean I am sure he was also aware is wife had 0 interest in them so he could not have thought she would be able to care for them when she in no way cared for them while he was living. I still point my finger at him.

Also, I understand his family was dealing with a loss, I am not heartless to think that in no way should a loss of a father or husband would keep you from care for an animal because I know if I loss either it would be hard for me to even get out of the bed to care for myself. I also know when to ask for help and I know when I can not handle it anymore. In this day and time I know there are 1,000s of organizations that would have stepped in. So again I point the finger at them and anyone who was aware of what was going on.







Quote:
Originally Posted by New_image    
The daughter did have every intent on offering this little guy a good life and wanted very much to keep him. It is very sad for him how things ended up but it was certainly not intentional! Hopefully I can get him turned around, handled and eventually placed if not just keep him here myself. I have acquired several of this farms wonderful horses and also miss our dear friend.

I touched on this ^^^^ above.



Quote:
Originally Posted by TrueColours    
You need to read what I have posted

The breeder had hip replacement surgery when this colt was born. Wasnt planned that way at all, but that's just how things went.

He then passed away suddenly in a freak accident

His wife, in her 60's and in ill health for many years, NEVER did a thing with the horses. Not a single thing, so now - all of a sudden - overnight - she is now mourning the loss of her husband, has a ton of work to do to put closure on his passing, has a farm to run full time and about 30 horses to look after on her own including this young colt, a couple of stallions and a bunch of youngsters and mares. And winter is setting in.

One family member came to the table and started to assist in putting all of his affairs in order and looking after the horses but this family member had her own family and home to also look after and again - overnight - she was mourning the loss of her father, and looking after the horses and farm full time

Unless you have walked a mile in the shoes of the individuals involved, sometimes it is very easy to sit on the side and pass judgement and criticism when you don't even know 1% of what actually went on

What the family member battled every single day in regards to the horses and their well being, when she was overruled every step of the way by the other family members, speaks volumes about her tenacity and her desire to do the right thing for all of them. In honor of her father and what he had spent his life creating and developing and also for the sake of the horses.

Don't worry. He isnt breeding anything anymore. He passed away ... remember ... ?!

Here ^^^^ I would like to say again the time line does not match up to the state of all the horses, this one colt in bad shape and left in a stall all of his life I could almost understand/accept due to the owner under going surgery and then sadly passing away but it was not just this one colt, it was others before him as well.

I will also add that True Colours is correct, all I can do it sit on the side lines and take in what I am reading, what information is being given to me. I was not there and I do not know everything that went on or played a part in what happened, but I can say from the information given to me by True Colours and New Image I do not retract my original post. I also can not believe nothing was done by these two people who claim to know so much and that the original owner was such a dear friend.

NO WAY IN HELL WOULD I ALLOW FOR MY DEAR FRIENDS HORSES TO END UP THE WAY THEY HAVE!!!!!


I am sorry if this offends anyone but this is just how I feel, in my honest opinion.



P.s. To New Image I also would like to applaud you for stepping up now and taking on the care of the horses from this situation that you have. He is looking great and I wish you all the luck!
     
    01-05-2012, 12:29 PM
  #73
Started
I have heard that the farm ran beautifully back when the original owner was younger and all of the kids were involved. I am sure Donna knows better than I. I have only known the farm personally since 2004 so I cannot judge how anything was done previously. Back when I met them in 2004 I thought the owner needed to down size and/or hire in help. He had way to much on his plate and while he loved his horses they were not taken care of how I personally would have liked. This said, there are many horses not cared for how I would personally like and there is little to nothing that you or I can do about this.

BUT these horses have always had food, clean water and basic care. The outdoor horses never came in and the indoor horses never went out. If this family so chose to have twenty brood mares in a pasture that were not often handled, never taken out to be ridden and not otherwise "used" but they were fed, watered and healthy then this is not neglect nor abuse its just not the most ideal. The colts dam that I have here was one of those. She required a lot of work, because she was only asked to accept human contact the twice yearly her hooves were trimmed she wasn't well mannered. And as Donna mentioned her early life was shabby.The second mare mare that I have (and a third who came with her and has been re-homed) had never come out of a stall and I have no good reason for why not. This is a good question!
The rest of the indoor horses were stallions. Yes, ideally the stallions in the barn should have had individual runs or some sort of turn out as well. Again, as I've mentioned I think the owner had more horses than room, energy or time but everyone was fed. When he was around the stallions were always groomed and the stalls cleaned. The stallion that I have here NEVER looked like he does right now. The daughter was the only one to step up to bat for the horses as said and some horses lost weight, they hadn't been groomed, she couldn't afford farrier work or bedding for stalls and so fourth.. (If someone passed away would you financially be able to carry 30+ horses?!) but she slowly placed them in the best homes that she could while dealing with the passing of her father, her mothers failing health, her own children and her marriage as well as running her home and taking care of the handful of horses that she already owned.

Again, the owner passed away in a freak accident not due to failing health. I am not sure that he could have for seen the lack of care when it came to the horses. I personally have nothing set up for what happens to my horses should I tumble off from a training project crack my head and pass away. My husband would be clueless and without knowledge of the computer and where to list them I am sure he'd try to find someone by word of mouth and slowly disperse them as did this guys daughter.

I will not argue with you there are things the original owned could have done different but the truth is that not all large breeding farms are as fancy and glorious as you may imagine. None of this is relevant any more because as Donna said "Dont worry. He isnt breeding anything anymore. He passed away ... remember ... ?! "

This is why I was hesitant to bring up any of the specifics, only offering some details to get opinions on the colt. I do not agree with the way this farm has done things in the past but it isn't my business and certainly not my intent to make them look bad. I have simply offered the daughter a hand in placing a handful of horses and hope to help her get everything back on track. I am glad that she has given me the chance to work with some of these outstanding creatures and that she made the painful decision to disperse the herd.
     
    01-05-2012, 12:58 PM
  #74
Teen Forum Moderator
I've been lurking this thread since it started, but just had to step in today. Looking at those first pictures of him, I was skeptical that he'd even make a good gelding, but seeing his progress and the round pen pictures of him....phenominal! I wouldn't of believed he's the same horse. He looks so happy and just being allowed to move around has already done him a world of good. I can't wait to see after his hooves have been done and he's standing correctly. I actually see a lot of potential. Not for a stallion- mind you, but there is a lot to like about him. How about sending him to me? ;D any GG baby is good in my books!

So glad that you guys were able to step in and help the poor 'little' guy out. He definitely deserves it. What an unfortunate situation he and the stud got thrown into. I can't help but feel sorry for his previouse owner though, it really does sound like he wanted what was best for his animals.

I'm looking forewards to many updates! And I just love the idea of 'Jinx'
     
    01-05-2012, 01:18 PM
  #75
Banned
Quote:
Originally Posted by New_image    
I have heard that the farm ran beautifully back when the original owner was younger and all of the kids were involved. I am sure Donna knows better than I. I have only known the farm personally since 2004 so I cannot judge how anything was done previously. Back when I met them in 2004 I thought the owner needed to down size and/or hire in help. He had way to much on his plate and while he loved his horses they were not taken care of how I personally would have liked. This said, there are many horses not cared for how I would personally like and there is little to nothing that you or I can do about this.

BUT these horses have always had food, clean water and basic care. The outdoor horses never came in and the indoor horses never went out. If this family so chose to have twenty brood mares in a pasture that were not often handled, never taken out to be ridden and not otherwise "used" but they were fed, watered and healthy then this is not neglect nor abuse its just not the most ideal. The colts dam that I have here was one of those. She required a lot of work, because she was only asked to accept human contact the twice yearly her hooves were trimmed she wasn't well mannered. And as Donna mentioned her early life was shabby.The second mare mare that I have (and a third who came with her and has been re-homed) had never come out of a stall and I have no good reason for why not. This is a good question!
The rest of the indoor horses were stallions. Yes, ideally the stallions in the barn should have had individual runs or some sort of turn out as well. Again, as I've mentioned I think the owner had more horses than room, energy or time but everyone was fed. When he was around the stallions were always groomed and the stalls cleaned. The stallion that I have here NEVER looked like he does right now. The daughter was the only one to step up to bat for the horses as said and some horses lost weight, they hadn't been groomed, she couldn't afford farrier work or bedding for stalls and so fourth.. (If someone passed away would you financially be able to carry 30+ horses?!) but she slowly placed them in the best homes that she could while dealing with the passing of her father, her mothers failing health, her own children and her marriage as well as running her home and taking care of the handful of horses that she already owned.

Again, the owner passed away in a freak accident not due to failing health. I am not sure that he could have for seen the lack of care when it came to the horses. I personally have nothing set up for what happens to my horses should I tumble off from a training project crack my head and pass away. My husband would be clueless and without knowledge of the computer and where to list them I am sure he'd try to find someone by word of mouth and slowly disperse them as did this guys daughter.

I will not argue with you there are things the original owned could have done different but the truth is that not all large breeding farms are as fancy and glorious as you may imagine. None of this is relevant any more because as Donna said "Dont worry. He isnt breeding anything anymore. He passed away ... remember ... ?! "

This is why I was hesitant to bring up any of the specifics, only offering some details to get opinions on the colt. I do not agree with the way this farm has done things in the past but it isn't my business and certainly not my intent to make them look bad. I have simply offered the daughter a hand in placing a handful of horses and hope to help her get everything back on track. I am glad that she has given me the chance to work with some of these outstanding creatures and that she made the painful decision to disperse the herd.


Although I see your point and agree with a lot of things you have stated I still want to repeat what I said earlier about knowing when enough was enough and when to ask for help. I am not trying to bad mouth the dead or this farm, even if it may seem that I am.

I applaud his daughter for trying to help and finding new homes for as many as she can, I also applaud you for taking in some of the horses. It just kills me when I hear of horses in such conditions. I have never heard of horses being stalled 24/7 and no matter the reasoning its not okay.

Like I said before I understand it was hard for them to deal with what they were left to deal with after their father/husband past away, because if I lost either it would be hard for me to care for myself. I also believe any responsible horse owner HAS or SHOULD HAVE a back up plan for if anything were to happen to them what would happen to their horses. Like I said I have a plan, everyone I know knows what I want to happen to my horses when/if something happens to me.

I also understood that he did not pass away due to his health issues, I was saying that with his standing condition I can not believe he did not think what if.
I also recommend that you should talk to the people, that your horses care would fall back on if something were to happen to you, about what you want them to do with your horses.
I don't know about everyone else I can only speak for myself but my horses are like my children. Luckily the law covers what happens to you children (if under age 18) after you die, sadly your horse depend on you!

I guess that is really the point I am trying to make, that we as horse people need to be more responsible and we should also hold other horse owners accountable for their actions.
The other point I was trying to make is that we as horse owners should get more involved and be willing to give one another a helping hand instead of standing on the side lines.

I am not saying you have or have not done this.

Also, in my opinion, what happened to these horses was neglect and abuse, maybe not intentional but it still happened at the hands of whom evers care they were under at the time. And its sad to know that there were other aware of what was going on and did nothing about it.


P.s. This this comment "not all large breeding farms are as fancy and glorious as you may imagine" I do not think all breeding farms are fancy and glorious I am aware of real life!
     
    01-05-2012, 05:49 PM
  #76
Weanling
Wow, you've done such a great job with him so far. Looking forward to hearing more updates!

Also it's kind of depressing that this good deed has turned into a debate.
     
    01-05-2012, 05:49 PM
  #77
Started
Here are some happier photos, the mane is free! Six hours of brushing and a bottle of MTG later. Sadly the length was mostly dead hair but on the plus side I didn't have to cut it.



Baby really enjoyed his first walk outside! He was interested in the snow, grass, trees, stump, horse trailer, fences......


     
    01-06-2012, 12:04 AM
  #78
Green Broke
They are both such gorgeous boys!
     
    01-06-2012, 03:53 AM
  #79
Yearling
I'll just say I love them both and I honestly hope life gives them the contentment and care they deserve from now on. That baby is looking awesome and New Situation is a suitable name for him :)
As for Mr Studly, I like him better with every pic you post :) I have other names to suggest, but it's late and will wait til tomorrow. (Insomnia stinks LOL)
     
    01-06-2012, 10:03 AM
  #80
Green Broke
I am in love with that colt, he is such a cutie. Glad they are both doing so much better:)

It's pretty sad that this has turned into a debate.
Things happen. Maybe he DID have a plan and it was never expressed.
When my grandpa passed away, my dad was supposes to be the executor of the estate. Guess who is selling all of my grandpa's things? Not my dad. Not my uncle. The step aunt. Freaking troll *cussing rant to self*
     

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