Originally Posted by GhostwindAppaloosa View Post
I don't know how many people here are into appys. Im sure more are into other breeds but if anyone knows what is and has been going on in ApHC for sometime now you would know that nearly every "Appaloosa" you see .. you'd be hard pressed to find any ACTUAL appaloosas in their pedigree... Example: This horse has several titleholders in the ApHC... but look at his pedigree? See the horses that say "appaloosa" look at what their parents are.. and so on and so on. Chocolatey Appaloosa
Interesting conversation. I agree with you on some things, disagree on others, and both agree and disagree with Bubba on certain issues.
There is probably more Appy expertise on this board than you might realize, so no need to think there aren't knowledgeable Appy people here. I am 64 years old and was raised with Appys, bred Appys for over 20 years myself, and my granfather, who was a Native American, raised Appys for about 30 years beginning back around 1925 - long before ApHC was ever thought of. And I went through the Appy wars with ApHC in the early 80's when ApHC made the decision to sell out the breed in favor of generating revenues and achieving major registry status by remaining a color registry instead of transitioning to become an actual breed registry. ApHC tries to promote itself as a breed registry, which is blatantly stupid...it also tries to lead people to believe it "originated" the Appy, which is even more stupid.
Here is where I sort of straddle the middle between you and Bubba. I am always pleased to see Appy to Appy breeding, however let's call a spade a spade - much of the foundation Appy breeding has been for color without always incorporating the best of choices in breeding stock for conformation and ability. As Bubba says, this has altered the original concept and purpose of the Appy, which was versatility - a combination of endurance and performance that no other breed has. The poor choice of breeding stock by many foundation breeders has destroyed much of that versatility (I am not necessarily referring to you directly here), so that many modern day "foundation" Appys, while truly Appys, are mere shadows of what the breed once was.
Of course that is still better than what ApHC has done. Many people don't realize that Appys pre-date Quarterhorses by many many years. Native Americans were raising Appys before Quarterhorses even existed and certainlygenerations before the first Thoroughbred set foot on American soil. Yet ApHC permits - and encourages - outcrossing with both Quarterhorses and Thoroughbreds. Crossing with Arabs doesn't bother me as much, because Arabs and Appys have very similar roots. While it is true Thoroughbreds arose from desert roots as did Appys, in the case of Thoroughbreds, they have long since been developed to have little to no resemblence to those roots, therefore outcrossing to modern day Thoroughbreds is not crossing similar to similar, but rather crossing two disctinctly different breeds resulting in what actually is nothing more than a grade. That is to take nothing away fromt the horses themselves...an Appy/TB cross can be a great horse, as can an Appy/QH cross. But they are not Appys.
You refer to Frank Scripter lines, but he was not noted for breeding great horses - he was noted for breeding Leopards. While that is great for Leopard folks, it is not necessarily great for the breed, and quite honestly I have never been impressed by his lines - other than the fact that they were at least ruly Appy lines and not Quarterhorses with spots.
To get back to your foal, I think the foal is very nice, and as I said I appreciate Appy to Appy breeding, but that doesn't change my opinion that the foal is still the result of mediocre breeding programs which are quite honestly color breeding programs rather than conformation and ability breeding programs.
Just my opinion, of course, and please don't take my opinion the wrong way, because any Appy to Appy breeding program is still better than what ApHC condones...