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Anaphylactic shock

This is a discussion on Anaphylactic shock within the Horse Health forums, part of the Keeping and Caring for Horses category

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        10-05-2012, 10:11 AM
      #21
    Started
    Also, from what I understand, the IM penicillin shot with the procaine should be refrigerated before use. If it was on a trip, it may have been too warm and therefore the procaine could have entered the bloodstream even if the needle didn't hit the vein. The penicillin wasn't the problem, the procaine (and possibly the method of administration) was. Don't throw the baby out with the bathwater, please. Penicillin is a very useful drug.
         
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        10-05-2012, 10:17 AM
      #22
    Green Broke
    I'm so sorry for the tragic loss of this horse.

    I am reminded, again, one of the many reasons I carry a pistol when I'm out in the boonies.

    So sad.
    Boo Walker likes this.
         
        10-05-2012, 10:30 AM
      #23
    Weanling
    I also think the pencillin was injected into a vein.

    Sorry for your friends loss

    Super Nova
         
        10-05-2012, 12:41 PM
      #24
    Yearling
    I've always wondered why you don't give horses IM shots in the butt. I've worked on dairy farms my whole life, and that's the ONLY place you give IM shots. Much less risk. Just give them a few firm taps with your fist and then jab the needle in. It's less of a shock that way. I've never given a shot this way to a horse, so I don't know if it works the same, but I can't see why not...
         
        10-05-2012, 01:01 PM
      #25
    Trained
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by gypsygirl    
    you can give horses IM injections in the butt or the chest. I don't like doing either, because when you do the butt there is a higher risk of the horse disliking it and kicking you, and in the chest, if it swells, it will pool there and is a pain.

    IN THE CHEST? Never heard that one. I now know, neck, stifle and Butt are the 3 places on equines that you CAN give IM injections. I do agree that anything in the rear you do have more risk of a kick coming your way, but if I was the OP and had personally seen this several times......I woud be taking that risk personally.

    Tealamut-do you think this sounds like anaphylaxis? Have you experienced the other reaction from the procaine leaching (not even really being injected) into the vein?
         
        10-05-2012, 02:55 PM
      #26
    Showing
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by franknbeans    
    IN THE CHEST? Never heard that one. I now know, neck, stifle and Butt are the 3 places on equines that you CAN give IM injections. I do agree that anything in the rear you do have more risk of a kick coming your way, but if I was the OP and had personally seen this several times......I woud be taking that risk personally.
    Giving IM in the chest is pretty commonly accepted. The downside is that they're prone to developing seromas after an injection there. After the neck and bum, it's the next best thing. I've heard that the large muscle of the front leg as being a last resort kind of thing if for whatever reason you can't give it in the neck, bum or chest, but I've never heard of giving it in the stifle.
         
        10-06-2012, 10:13 AM
      #27
    Started
    Penicillin needs to be given slowly in whatever muscle you choose. Most use the neck because horses do not like the sting and when you use the butt, they can kick.. So the neck is easier to reach with less chance of getting kicked. It still needs to go in slowly, the faster the injection, the more it stings.
    K-Pen( I think its called) can be given in the vein, but it still has to be done very very slowly to watch for reaction, and is usually only done by vets.
    Penicillin can and has been used to euthanize horses in extreme conditions when nothing else is available. And I hate to say it, but the explanation given by the OP is not what happens when Pennicillin goes into the vein, the horse immediately collapses and can have seizures, but they do not get up again. It takes awhile to actually die with Penicillan, it is slow. When people would want to euthanize a horse but not have personal property and had to take to dump to dispose of, we would give a light tranquilizer first, then lightly sedated inject the Pen. Horse would drop but heart still beats for a bit, some leg "seizures", not the calm way of the usual euthanisia. The dump requires with a bullet or Pen injection, no buthanasia injection in case of burial at dump and ground contamination.
    I am sorry for the death of this horse, but it sounds more like the horse reacted to the sting and went over and out of control. Two lessons: always carry a gun when camping or out of fast phone contact and when giving pennicillin, be very careful of how its administered and where.
    Uniprim is one powdered Pennicillin and is great, one or two scoops one time daily in grain or mixed up with applesauce by mouth, no shots. Its amazing how many people say after giving Pennicillin shots twice a day for the treatment, their horse is alot more spooky and weird when approached. Those shots HURT and STING and horses hate it.
         
        10-06-2012, 10:27 AM
      #28
    Weanling
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by franknbeans    
    IN THE CHEST? Never heard that one. I now know, neck, stifle and Butt are the 3 places on equines that you CAN give IM injections. I do agree that anything in the rear you do have more risk of a kick coming your way, but if I was the OP and had personally seen this several times......I woud be taking that risk personally.

    Tealamut-do you think this sounds like anaphylaxis? Have you experienced the other reaction from the procaine leaching (not even really being injected) into the vein?
    I've been doing the chest right into the pectoral muscle (and so does my vet) for over a decade.

    Super Nova
         
        10-06-2012, 11:35 AM
      #29
    Yearling
    Why was a sick horse taken camping in the first place?
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        10-06-2012, 04:14 PM
      #30
    Yearling
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by franknbeans    

    Tealamut-do you think this sounds like anaphylaxis? Have you experienced the other reaction from the procaine leaching (not even really being injected) into the vein?
    No, I don't think this sounds like anaphylaxis, however having not been there I can't really say what went on. I do think it sounds more like a procaine reaction. I have never seen it seep into the vein and cause this, but I have seen one horse do this when it was directly injected into a vein/artery.
         

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