Do you see lameness? (video) - Page 2 - The Horse Forum

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post #11 of 24 Old 10-12-2011, 03:51 PM
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I agree with the toe first landings, that's what's causing his knees to appear like they don't lock. In addition to what others have said, I am seeing signs of pain on his face and I would suggest double and triple checking your saddle fit and having a chiro out to look at him. The way he moves and the look on his face says to me that he's hurting somewhere in his body and it may not necessarily be his feet.

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post #12 of 24 Old 10-12-2011, 04:53 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Royal Pine Buck View Post
the video wouldn't load for me :( ...however.

My horse's knee wouldn't fully lock and I kept telling the vets this fact and he had some synovial fluid around his knee joints (come to find outthat later my horse has arthritis in his knee)

. He also sometimes gimps out of a corner on the knee if not warmed up enough and trips on it if not ridden forward.

Also if both knees shake (sometimes just one) it could be from hoofs that are too tall in the heels . When the heels are too tall. The stay apparatus that allows the horse to lock his knees while standing therefore making him capable of sleeping while standing will not function properly.

That is also something to check out. Maybe post some pictures of his hoofs?
Hmm very interesting. He mostly has this problem while warming up if it happens. He seems to be fine standing/sleeping. I will have to ask my vet about this when I can get her out. His heel isn't long, I'm getting pictures of the hooves tonight. So I don't think its that. Thank you though.

Quote:
I agree with the toe first landings, that's what's causing his knees to appear like they don't lock. In addition to what others have said, I am seeing signs of pain on his face and I would suggest double and triple checking your saddle fit and having a chiro out to look at him. The way he moves and the look on his face says to me that he's hurting somewhere in his body and it may not necessarily be his feet.
Good thing my birthday is coming up because I'm asking for money for vet bills. I have been wanting to have a chiro come out and work on him but as a college student I don't want to dip into my emergency savings. So vet work first, then if we find nothing a few paychecks later I'll get a chiro out. Thank you for noting what you see.


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post #13 of 24 Old 10-12-2011, 05:50 PM
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I agree with the person who said his back left is off. Whenever he lands on his back left his head nods more forcefully =/
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post #14 of 24 Old 10-12-2011, 06:10 PM
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now take a video going in the other direction. It usually shows up worse going 1 way vs the other
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post #15 of 24 Old 10-12-2011, 06:45 PM
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It looks as both hind legs are stiff- the one closest to the camera always seemed worse.... ? Anyway, I would recommend taking off his shoes, that can help (and better for the horse). It has been shown that horses who go toe first on the ground, place their hoof flatter/heel first barefoot. I like chiropractors a lot. Compare this video (i know different horses- but it will give you an idea) of a shod horse
to this of a barefoot horse:
I pretty amazing difference right?! Good luck to you and your horse!

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post #16 of 24 Old 10-12-2011, 07:32 PM
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Casey, I would like to mention that shoes likely have very little to do with toe first landings unless the horse is shod incorrectly. Some horses land toe first, regardless of what you do with thier feet. My horse Dobe is that way, his leg conformation is pretty crappy and he always lands toe-first at a walk; barefoot, shod, short heels, long heels, etc.

I would be more apt to trust in the videos if they had used the same horse for both demonstrations so that the difference of natural movement could be discounted.

Always remember that feeling of looking at a big, open country over the ears of a good horse, seeing a new trail unwind ahead of you, and that ever-spectacular view from the top of the ridge!!! Follow my training blog: http://robertsontraining.blogspot.com/
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post #17 of 24 Old 10-12-2011, 10:55 PM Thread Starter
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Okay here is an overload of images and videos. He was actually feeling pretty good today and looking sounder than he has been in the last month.




Back Right Bottom Hoof
Back Left Bottom Hoof
Front Left Bottom Hoof
Front Right Bottom Hoof
Rear Left Side
Rear Right Side
Rear Both Front
Front Right Side
Front Left Side
Front Both Front

Whooo anyhow he is toed out in the front left, has sidebone on his front right and yes I'm barefoot for photos, I didn't want my tennis shoes getting wet when I bathed the horses.


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post #18 of 24 Old 10-13-2011, 12:26 AM
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Originally Posted by smrobs View Post
Casey, I would like to mention that shoes likely have very little to do with toe first landings....I would be more apt to trust in the videos if they had used the same horse for both demonstrations so that the difference of natural movement could be discounted.
Agree that whether or not a horse is shod or not doesn't necessarily influence that at all... although I'd guess that if it were the same horse, if he's landing toe-first in shoes - too uncomfortable to land heel first - he'd possibly be even more so without shoes on the same surface... wouldn't have put it on youtube as a good example of their hypothesis then! That's not at all saying shoes are necessarily good either though, but just taking the shoes off(or cutting down high heels, for that matter) without considering the whole equation is not likely to miraculously make the horse more comfortable on his heels. I think shoes used long term do tend to encourage contraction and weak heels, but they're not the only reason by far.
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post #19 of 24 Old 10-13-2011, 02:46 AM
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Hate that!! Just wrote a detailed response & lost it... so here's the abbreviated version... His front feet particularly appear to be a problem, whether or not that's the cause of the current lameness or not. Hard to tell from those angles but right fore looks a bit worse. Can't say much about the heels with those angles, but the fronts are very contracted & I suspect heels are a bit long all round, though a bit collapsed, which is why they may not appear high to you. While shoes have been set back at the toe to allow better a/p balance, they are all long in the heels & turned in, overlaying the frogs. It also appears the toe soles are pinkish? If so, this indicates bruising & thin soles. Toe-first impacts would likely be contributing to that.

I'd get the horse out of shoes, for now at least, and protect his weak heels & soles with boots &/or pads, to allow him to exercise comfortably & begin using his feet properly. This may or may not be the whole issue, but it should help and prevent damage from toe first impacts getting worse.
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post #20 of 24 Old 10-13-2011, 11:46 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by loosie View Post
Hate that!! Just wrote a detailed response & lost it... so here's the abbreviated version... His front feet particularly appear to be a problem, whether or not that's the cause of the current lameness or not. Hard to tell from those angles but right fore looks a bit worse. Can't say much about the heels with those angles, but the fronts are very contracted & I suspect heels are a bit long all round, though a bit collapsed, which is why they may not appear high to you. While shoes have been set back at the toe to allow better a/p balance, they are all long in the heels & turned in, overlaying the frogs. It also appears the toe soles are pinkish? If so, this indicates bruising & thin soles. Toe-first impacts would likely be contributing to that.

I'd get the horse out of shoes, for now at least, and protect his weak heels & soles with boots &/or pads, to allow him to exercise comfortably & begin using his feet properly. This may or may not be the whole issue, but it should help and prevent damage from toe first impacts getting worse.
Thank you. I've been considering putting him barefoot (As I've heard that helps with horses having issues with sidebone...) After the vet looks at him I'll consider it more. I've always had my horses shod and not sure how to transition into barefoot and what kind of care would be needed to help transition? One horse we had that I tried went lame because he was barefoot, another had his hoof constantly chipping and wearing down too fast. I've heard of supplements can help build stronger hooves...

I know of a barefoot trimmer that already comes to our stables. If I want to switch I know she specializes in barefoot and shaping the hoof up well. I'm just tired of switching farriers because of bad work!


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