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I'm having trouble finding PSSM info/ answers. I need help...

This is a discussion on I'm having trouble finding PSSM info/ answers. I need help... within the Horse Health forums, part of the Keeping and Caring for Horses category

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        04-14-2013, 12:35 AM
      #41
    Super Moderator
    LHP, the omega horseshine is 4 oz per cup. I weighed it because of blimp problems

    A lb of Timothy hay has 2.5% fat
    When offered in a slowfeeder net, the average QH eats about 16-18 lbs of hay daily. I also, just like Oldhorselady, noticed that they eat less hay, voluntarily, when eating out of such net( mine went from 25 to 15 lbs hay).

    So let's say horse eats 2% of it's bodyweight.
    1000lb horse eats 20 lbs of feed.
    15 of the 20 lbs is hay.
    So hay supplies 0.375 lbs of fat/day
    Now all the other supplements can be added.
    I find the math much easier when I transfer everything in grams and kilos, it's dezimal....for me anyway. 1 lb = 450 grams, or 0.45 kg
    Did I confuse everybody enough?
         
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        04-14-2013, 12:52 AM
      #42
    Started
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by deserthorsewoman    
    LHP, the omega horseshine is 4 oz per cup. I weighed it because of blimp problems

    A lb of Timothy hay has 2.5% fat
    When offered in a slowfeeder net, the average QH eats about 16-18 lbs of hay daily. I also, just like Oldhorselady, noticed that they eat less hay, voluntarily, when eating out of such net( mine went from 25 to 15 lbs hay).

    So let's say horse eats 2% of it's bodyweight.
    1000lb horse eats 20 lbs of feed.
    15 of the 20 lbs is hay.
    So hay supplies 0.375 lbs of fat/day
    Now all the other supplements can be added.
    I find the math much easier when I transfer everything in grams and kilos, it's dezimal....for me anyway. 1 lb = 450 grams, or 0.45 kg
    Did I confuse everybody enough?
    O.........M...........G..............What language was that in?
         
        04-14-2013, 01:28 AM
      #43
    Super Moderator
    So I did......confuse everybody....lol.......
    I hope you mean the lb/gram/kilo thing.....I hope I hope......
         
        04-14-2013, 02:01 AM
      #44
    Started
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by deserthorsewoman    
    So I did......confuse everybody....lol.......
    I hope you mean the lb/gram/kilo thing.....I hope I hope......
    I guess it's not SO bad...I know how to do the math, once I know how to create the equation...lol.
         
        04-14-2013, 02:20 AM
      #45
    Super Moderator
    I just thought it might be easier to do it in decimals since % is also in decimals.
    In case you feel up to it....a lb: 450 grams, a kilo : 2.2 lbs or 1000 grams........
         
        04-14-2013, 11:35 AM
      #46
    Started
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by deserthorsewoman    
    LHP, the omega horseshine is 4 oz per cup. I weighed it because of blimp problems

    A lb of Timothy hay has 2.5% fat
    When offered in a slowfeeder net, the average QH eats about 16-18 lbs of hay daily. I also, just like Oldhorselady, noticed that they eat less hay, voluntarily, when eating out of such net( mine went from 25 to 15 lbs hay).

    So let's say horse eats 2% of it's bodyweight.
    1000lb horse eats 20 lbs of feed.
    15 of the 20 lbs is hay.
    So hay supplies 0.375 lbs of fat/day
    Now all the other supplements can be added.
    I find the math much easier when I transfer everything in grams and kilos, it's dezimal....for me anyway. 1 lb = 450 grams, or 0.45 kg
    Did I confuse everybody enough?
    You're confusing people by incorporating the fat content of the hay into the calculation of the magic 1# of fat. The goal here isn't one pound of fat, it's the 20-25% of calories coming from fat.

    The OP states that her horse is a hard keeper. He probably eats more than his share of hay. Let's say he eats 30# of hay per day (not unreasonable).
    30# of hay is going to provide .75# of fat. If I only need to meet the 1# goal, than 1/2 C of oil will provide that additional .25#. Now what % of the calories comes from fat?
    Grass hay has approximately .9 Mcals/#. 30# of hay will provide 27 Mcals. 3 Mcals are coming from the .75# of fat.
    Oil has 4 Mcals/# (2C). 1/2C is going to provide 1 Mcal.
    So the horse is getting 28 Mcals per day and 4 Mcals are fat calories.
    The % of his calories that come from fat: 4 divided by 28 is 14.3%. Not nearly enough to meet the goals of the diet.

    If I carried this out all the way, I can meet the 1# goal with 40# of hay only problem is only 11% of the calories will come from fat.

    Now if we look at OHL's diet with the 1# of fat in addition to the hay:
    20# hay and pellets is going to have .5# fat and 18 Mcals
    OM will have 2 oz fat and .63 Mcals
    CC100 6 oz fat and 1.32 Mcal
    Senior 1 oz fat and .75 Mcal
    Oil .5# fat and 2 Mcals
    So in this diet, she is receiving 22.7 Mcals, 1.55# of fat (6.2 Mcal)
    % of fat in the diet is 27%. It is on the high side but she's seeing results than she's on the right track. If she dropped her fat intake to the 1# but keep the same Mcals to maintain condition, her % would drop to 17.6%. If any horse consumed more than 20 Mcals/day, they will automatically fall below the desired 20+% if they only get one pound of fat in the diet.

    Simplify the calculations, throw out the 2.5% of fat in the hay, and try to meet the 1# of additional fat with high fat options. The extra fat that the hay contributes is not going to be of detriment but if you are relying on it to be part of the overall fat intake, it can easily pull that percentage down as the hay portion increases.
         
        04-14-2013, 12:08 PM
      #47
    Super Moderator
    Call ME confused now...I'll leave it to you.
         
        04-14-2013, 01:44 PM
      #48
    Weanling
    So if I feed 2 cups corn oil that makes a Lb of fat... So that's all I have to do? Besides his hay, Ultium, and vit E?

    I read other people's stories and it seems like it could take anywhere from a month or two on the diet to a year to get the results you want and for the horse to seem normal.

    At this point I guess we should stop riding him because he is showing stiffness and I would guess pain / tenderness in his back...

    Thanks for everyone's help so far. I'm still really confused and I contacted vets on Friday and no one seems to have much of a clue as to how to help me manage my horse.

    This has been very frustrating.... I think I'll go for a ride to clear my head... Oh that's right I can't. :(
    Posted via Mobile Device
         
        04-14-2013, 02:28 PM
      #49
    Started
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Lopin N Paint    
    So if I feed 2 cups corn oil that makes a Lb of fat... So that's all I have to do? Besides his hay, Ultium, and vit E?
    Posted via Mobile Device
    In theory that's all you have to do but good luck getting even the piggiest horse to slurp down 2C of oil. I don't see where you state how much Ultium he gets but if the meals are 2.5# Ultium, each meal would provide .3# fat (2.5X.124). If he gets one 2.5# meal, you would need to add .7# fat (about 1 1/2C oil) per day, if he gets 2 meals or 5# Ultium, you would drop that down to about 1C oil (5x.124=.6# fat) or adding about 1/2 C oil to each meal. Very manageable and most horses will eat that amount in one feeding. Managing the feeding of oil when you rely on others to do it can be a huge problem and what's where the CC100, while an expensive alternative, can be the only way to get them to feed it. You would replace the .5# oil straight up for .5# of CC100. On day's when you feed, go with the oil and on days when you have to make up baggies of goodies for them to feed, go with the powder. Another option is to have buckets with snap on lids (you can pick them up for free at the bakery department in the grocery store, icing comes in them) and make them up for them. You can probably get away with 2 days in advance. Make their lives easy and put a clip on the buckets (so they hang them not dump them, much of the oil might be on the bottom of the bucket) so they don't have to figure anything out.
         
        04-14-2013, 02:45 PM
      #50
    Started
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by deserthorsewoman    
    Call ME confused now...I'll leave it to you.
    If you're confused, than I'm not getting the point across. Am I cutting a corner and over simplifying some part of the calculations? Where am I loosing you?
         

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