Anyone else have a horse who just plainly has bad feet? My Lisa gets the same care that Jade gets, but I'm always fighting thrush, bacteria in her walls and a rough sole. Granted, Lisa came to me as a rescue already lame, bowed tendons and undernourished, but she's been here for years now (5 or so). Is this what the future holds for this horse forever?
For 20 years we've had awesome durable trail horses that always went barefoot. Paso Finos, Missouri Fox Trotters, Quarter Horses, etc. Recently we've acquired Thoroughbreds, one has good feet and the other has very weak feet. It's been a constant struggle keeping him sound. A few weeks after we bought him he started pulling shoes, so we got special clips put on his shoes. Then he got an abcess, vet thinks from a dirty nail. Then, after 2 months of being unrideable from those problems, another horse kicked him and gave him a deep cut on the inside of his leg, it got infected within 12 hours, and he's been unrideable for a few weeks with that now. He hasn't been sound since September, which sucks, because we need to be getting ready for eventing season.
Thanks, E. I know I would never take this same horse in now. I look at a horse's feet right off the bat and Lisa would certainly fail my current standards.
I did rescue her, no doubt, and I had low expectations which she has far exceeded, but when my son asked me who else would have taken her, I said probably no one and realized that at this point now, I wouldn't even have brought her home. Ya, I'm definitely tired of her feet and I'm convinced that she will one day have to be put down due to lameness. Other than her feet, she is such an easy keeper, never seems to get seriously hurt (knock on wood) and stoic about any little bumps and nicks she does get. I must learn to focus on how little I really do have to do for her after all.
PeggySue, thanks but I'm not looking for help with her feet. Just whining. As I said, my other horse is fine. Other horses I have had in the past were fine. Lisa is just difficult.
each horse is unique... I have four here adn three can go bare just fine but one can't. What I have found with her is that her nutrition level is a tad higher then the other three
I use a ration balancer at 1 1/2 lbs with her as well as remission and MSM and that "seems" to be working at the moment
Beau used to have TERRIBLE feet until I moved him to our property... now I can really micro-manage them, which helps.
It seemed he ALWAYS had thrush at the boarding barn, I visited him him atleast 5-6 days a week... always had to put kopertox in his hooves. It got so bad I resorted to packing his feet with thrush magic and cotton. He would be lame for weeks from it.
He also could not keep his shoes on, rarely did he go the 6 weeks between shoeings without losing one or both of his fronts.
Since he's been home, we haven't had any trouble with him - I think it's a combo between better ground (very little mud) and a better diet.
My horses are barefoot. I have already emailed my trimmer about adding a supplement. I could only reasonably add supplements because Lisa is already fat on hay and 12%.
Anyone else out there with more than one horse that has one that's just more hoof-demanding than others?
Northen have you tried a ration balancer??? That is what has worked best for Sassy
only 1lb a day and has amino acids and biotin already in it... runs about 50 cents a day on average and you don't need any other additive to get most to eat it
see Ontario would be Argi Brand Purina's Equalizer, Step 7 I think it is called, All Phase or maybe Buckeye's Gro N Win
Sassy's problem is thin soles and none growing so I am looking at different challenge then yours but since changing to a ration balancer I have had ZERO thrush and I have a pond they all stand in when it is wet and mud out my hiney.. my proptery sits inside corn/bean fields and they are all "higher" ground so I get all the run off ... in the spring my stalls have standing water
i am really frustrated with my mare because she has 3 really nice feet that can go with out shoes, but one that just gets more tender that needs a shoe. grrr i want a barefoot horse !!! im gonna tack her front shoes back on even though i only pulled them 4 weeks ago. she hasnt been lame or anything but i can tell the LF is tender. we also dont have a lot of snow this year and the ground is really hard and icy, so that doesnt help.
i am really frustrated with my mare because she has 3 really nice feet that can go with out shoes, but one that just gets more tender that needs a shoe. grrr i want a barefoot horse !!! im gonna tack her front shoes back on even though i only pulled them 4 weeks ago. she hasnt been lame or anything but i can tell the LF is tender.
If she has one tender foot, it doesn't need a shoe, it needs *protection*. What do you see is the difference between 'lame' & 'tender'? Unless it's one of degree, I don't understand the difference?
It's so odd that her two front feet give me a hard time, but her back feet don't. That's why I've always figured it's just something that's part of this horse, rather than diet. If a ration balancer will help the fronts, it certainly won't hurt the backs. Lisa is an easy keeper. She's only slightly overweight now even though I say she's fat, but not so much that it's a problem, esp. in winter. But more feed and she definitely will get FAT.
If I add anything to her feed it should be some kind of powdered supplement. She'll eat it, I have no doubt about that. I just don't want to add any more fibre and volume to her diet. As it is now, she gets the 12% only so it's part of the daily routine and if I ever need to add things to her diet, I can. She gets very very little. I'd have to weigh it, but it's a plastic laundry scoop a day. One of the scoops that come in the Tide boxes, you know.
I would drop the 12% and add the ration balancer... approx 3 cups per day ...
well poo the ag brands purina one isn't listing the biotin level ... grr I hate all parts of Purina
let me see if I can explain this right... bear with me
you need amino acids, biotin, zinc, copper and iron for good hoof health... with the iron, zinc, and copper it should be a ratio 4;1;1
without the proper balance it all can go wonky... and while some horses it doesn't bother others it throws for a loop
IMO the reason we see the problem more with the fronts instead of the hinds is that most horses carry the majority of thier weight on the fronts if I remember right it is 60/40
She may be absorbing nutrients differently than your other horses. Put her on Source Focus HF. It's high in zinc and copper, which is important for horses that are prone to thrush and poor feet. I would also do a round of soaking to really get rid of the deep infection. I'd use White Lightning. Soak everyday for 3 days, then 2-3 days a week until you see good healing. Between the supplement and the hoof soak, you should see good improvement. If she's not barefoot, pulling her shoes might help too.
PeggySue -- I'll call my supplier tomorrow and see what they have. I don't mind replacing the 12% -- good idea. 3 cups is a lot for her, but she'll love the extra munchies! Any point in trying just 2 first / 1/2 lb? She weighs about 900 lbs and hardly works. A couple of hours a week is all she is ridden, esp. in the winter.
Luvs -- they are barefoot. Treatment for thrush is always ongoing for her, including soaking, but she's a witch to soak. I got 5 minutes twice out of her today. If it wasn't -20 celcius I would have gone again, but the resulting ice gets dangerous. In the summer I can soak her no problem.
And the hoof supplement I posted will really help. The added zinc, copper, and amino acids really make a difference. If she has the pinched heel bulbs in the back, a round using "Pete's Goo" might help a lot. New Page 15
Before adding iron, you may want to have your hay and fields tested, and your water if you use a well. High iron will negate the added zinc and copper. New Page 14
Luvs, there is no place local to test my hay; it's been an issue for a while up here. The people that sell hay south have to take a load down just for testing. I don't know where to get the iron content in my water checked, but I'll ask MDH -- he drills wells, so he will have an in somewhere.
If the high iron negates the zinc and copper then why does PeggySue's ration balancer have so much iron in relation? 4:1:1
I'm going to ask my trimmer what is available locally as well as calling my supplier.
She doesn't have contracted heels. They're not as wide as I'd like, but she is what she is. My trimmer agrees. She has widened significantly since she came to me.
Good thing I posted on here about my frustration; even though I only wanted to complain, maybe I can find a solution. Still waiting for my trimmer to answer my email. Hopefully tomorrow.
Read the links I posted. There is information on how to get your hay tested. You send a sample in by mail.
Ration Balancers have 100% nutrients. Iron is important, but if your hay and/or water is high in iron, than a 4:1:1 iron:zinc:copper feed will give your horse too much iron, which will block the horse's ability to absorb the zinc and copper.
Have your hay tested. You may only need to supplement a few minerals and vitamins. If so, you can get a custom supplement made to balance your horse's diet perfectly, and save some money.
Right, which is good, but if your hay is not balanced and your water is high in iron, then the ration balancer isn't going to work as well. Plus, if you test your hay, you might discover that you only need to add a few key minerals and vitamins, which will help you get your horse's diet properly balanced and save some money.
Very true. I've nailed mine down to two different suppliers. I'm having them both tested again to make sure my supplement has everything it needs in it, and nothing it doesn't. I'll probably test it again when I get next year's first batch in.
you actually need to test several bales from each cutting for it to be accurate Which is why I just do the best I can... I have three fields and my hay guy has ten. With two to three cuttings per year that's alot of testing
Not having a lot of luck yet finding a supplement up here; will probably have to drive out of town. I'm thinking if I'm going to go to a supplement I may as well go whole hog and get something that's a general supplement. A friend recommended Hoffman's Minerals. It sounds good, but I have to see if I can get it here.
The others that have been suggested here are all lacking in one thing or the other. Apparently this Hoffman's is pricier, but you don't use much.
BTW, hay testing is a pipe dream up here. I have a hard time keeping one hay supplier from year to year. I did manage one for three years straight, but he fell short one year and this year had nothing at all for me. Unless I am willing to pay 2x as much, I have to take what I can get -- within reason of course.
So, even if I could get it tested, I'd have to do it so often plus I'd end up losing out on the hay to another buyer, there's not much point. It's the old "eyeball" to look at the type of grasses and maturity level. Baling quality leaves much to be desired in my area as well. Our youngest son finally saw a bale of quality, tightly baled hay last fall (not from here) and said, "Oooooh, NOW I know what you mean when you say all our local hay sucks, mom." LOL -- it's not all THAT bad, but still...
Oooh! Boe is that way. Horrid feet. Soft, hard to keep shoes on in the summer...but he has badly underrun, crushed heals so he can't go barefoot (our one attempt at doing so almost resulted in pulled tendons...his heals are so bad it's like he's standing in high heals backwards when he's barefoot). He has to stay in semi-theraputic shoes that have an elevation to the heal. $80 every 6-8 weeks, every 4-5 weeks in the summer. *shudder* With our tax return, I'm actually setting aside a chunk in a separate account just for his shoes (so I don't spend it on anything else). But, with these shoes on...he is great! We ride all over. He's a bit of a hard keeper, difficult to keep weight on, but he's SUCH a sweet horse. He's SO kind and gentle, so willing and eager...he's going to make an awesome eventer or fox hunter...or even just a fun, bold trail horse (he LOVES trails). In some horses, the foot issues are worth it. In others, it's just a matter of time before they are in so much pain from their feet they have to be put down. I have a cyber-friend whose mare is like that...and it's just a matter of time, sadly. But for Boe, it's worth it. Every day.
but he has badly underrun, crushed heals so he can't go barefoot (our one attempt at doing so almost resulted in pulled tendons...his heals are so bad it's like he's standing in high heals backwards when he's barefoot). He has to stay in semi-theraputic shoes that have an elevation to the heal. .... it's just a matter of time before they are in so much pain from their feet they have to be put down.
Unfortunately, your last sentence I quoted hit's the mark - treatments such as allowing long, underslung heels & keeping the horse shod, especially in high heels, can only ever be a palliative measure and tend to lead to the underlying probs getting worse, so eventually even palliative measures quit working to keep the horse comfortable. IME there is every reason to keep shoes *off* a horse in this state, although they will probably need frog support pads/boots for a while. Particularly as you mention 'high heels backwards' which gives me the idea he may also have developed negative palmer angles from the long heels, which will also be putting further pressure on the navicular region.
NorthenMama I feel for you the guy I get ALL my rounds from every year ran short this year and we are hay hunting NOW.. we found some now to hope the horses eat them.
I gave my old horse flax seed added to boiling water and allowed to steep unjtil the seeds are swollen, plus 1/4 c of corn oil 2 x daily to his senior's pellets. Within a 6 weeks his coat had developed a beautiful bloom and his hoofs began to improve, eventually becoming more elastic. I started with 1/4 c of flax seed to 1 c water. It will be mucuousy but I just dump it all into the pellets. The horse loved it. After a few days I upped it to 1/3 c flax seed.
I thought boiled flax was toxic?? Peggysue...where are you!?
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