PMU Mares, please read! - The Horse Forum

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post #1 of 10 Old 06-25-2011, 08:40 AM Thread Starter
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PMU Mares, please read!

I found these threads while googling for pregnant mare info, thought I'd share. I have already decided against estrogen therapy, but this cinches it. Poor mares and babies, I've heard of this before, hrer's proof of it's existence. Friends of Animals | Pregnant Mares' Urine Investigative Report . Born to Die? For what good? --PMU foals , The PMU Industry: 2010 Year in Review | Tuesday's Horse | Page 2 .

Many people have sighed for the 'good old days' and regretted the 'passing of the horse,' but today, when only those who like horses own them, it is a far better time for horses. ~C.W. Anderson
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post #2 of 10 Old 06-25-2011, 08:55 AM
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At best, that information is about 10 years out of date. At worst, it's nothing more than hyperbole and hysteria.

The PMU industry has been heavily regulated for the last 10 years, and there are only a handful of farms still in existence. Of that handful who are actually producing to sell to the pharmaceutical industry, the mares are selectively bred to produce lovely, in demand foals.

The mares are NOT kept locked up in stalls until they foal, nor are the foals considered culls of the industry any longer. Selling a well bred foal to sport horse people has been a lucrative sideline way to make money for PMU farmers.

The people screeching about the horrible conditions are either lying, or they're basing their information on the farms who were once a part of the PMU industry, but are no longer licensed as such. Some of those farms have continued to produce crap foals and still claim they're in the PMU network.

It's a racket, pure and simple, and plays on the sympathies of those people whose only research on the subject has been through the AR websites.

I'm in full menopause right now, but take nothing for my symptoms. I'm one of the lucky ones, in that I'm not having a bad time. Some women aren't so lucky, and of those who aren't, many simply cannot take a synthetic substitute for Premarin. They have to take the actual product.

I don't know how old you are OP, but until you're actually experiencing menopause, you won't know how badly it's going to affect you. If mine was making me crazy, homicidal, and suicidal, you can bet I'd want anything that worked to bring me back as close to normal as possible.

Premarin is a necessary drug to help women, and the industry that produces that drug is not as it used to be.
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post #3 of 10 Old 06-25-2011, 09:12 AM
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^^ This. I actually take the artificial stuff, and am fortunate it works.
I also have a PMU rescue-he is just coming 6, and I have found that for the last 6-7 yrs, the foals have been more difficult to come by.

I also was recently made aware of the nurse mare industry....similar, from what I have seen, but relatively small numbers.

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post #4 of 10 Old 06-25-2011, 07:14 PM Thread Starter
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I know they are mostly regulated in US (by the Pharm co) but if you read on they are moving their base of operations over the big pond where regulations are not so strict. Does it matter to you if it is here or there that they are abused. I have a problem with folks who raise animals as a by product, and their mothers are made to suffer as a result. I'm not a bleeding heart tree hugger, but god they're babies that did nothing but be born for their moms urine. I have a mare fixing to foal and I didn't want a foal, got her that way unkowingly, but will keep the baby cause I'll know what will happen to him, he'll have a happy home forever. And I am pushing 50, and am on the final lap of menopause, and also took no chems for it, just diet and natural food solutions. Try Black tea (Earl Grey) in morning, Plain almonds (handfull 3 x a day) helped me a lot. And Tai Chi or pilates for stress relief. My mare agrees I'm better, used to yell/cry a lot.

Many people have sighed for the 'good old days' and regretted the 'passing of the horse,' but today, when only those who like horses own them, it is a far better time for horses. ~C.W. Anderson
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post #5 of 10 Old 06-25-2011, 07:28 PM
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I have no experience in how it's working across the pond(though there are plenty of other members who may), but the PMU foals here catch quite a pretty penny and are far from being neglected and abused for the most case. They're usually sold as sport horses or something similar and there's enough demand for draft cross types that they can ask much higher than feed lot prices for the foals.

It's not nearly as big and dramatic as an issue as it used to be, as has already been stated.

As far as the menopause goes, all women are going to react differently. For some, a half full of almonds and tea will be enough to regulate the body. For others, this is not the case and they have to go the pharmaceutical route and with the way the mares and foals are treated these days, I don't think there's much of an ethical issue there.
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post #6 of 10 Old 06-25-2011, 07:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Missdv View Post
I know they are mostly regulated in US (by the Pharm co) but if you read on they are moving their base of operations over the big pond where regulations are not so strict. Does it matter to you if it is here or there that they are abused. I have a problem with folks who raise animals as a by product, and their mothers are made to suffer as a result. I'm not a bleeding heart tree hugger, but god they're babies that did nothing but be born for their moms urine. I have a mare fixing to foal and I didn't want a foal, got her that way unkowingly, but will keep the baby cause I'll know what will happen to him, he'll have a happy home forever. And I am pushing 50, and am on the final lap of menopause, and also took no chems for it, just diet and natural food solutions. Try Black tea (Earl Grey) in morning, Plain almonds (handfull 3 x a day) helped me a lot. And Tai Chi or pilates for stress relief. My mare agrees I'm better, used to yell/cry a lot.
Maybe not, but whoever wrote the most recent article, tuesdays horse, most certainly is. OP-remember that anyone can write an article and put it on the internet......that does not mean it is accurate. It would appear to me that they are trying to stir things up. If I needed it, I would take it. Period. The writer exagerates the cancer risk too. It is not a scientifically based article. Just some persons opinion, and when it comes to health-I prefer scientifically based data and studies. They taught me that in Nursing School.

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post #7 of 10 Old 06-25-2011, 11:18 PM
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I bought a PMU foal from a Canadian Farm -- that gray stud colt was Apache Blue Boy. I trained hin to be a working cowhorse, but I could see that his talet laid in running hard to cattle and stopping hard. He was the hardest stopper I ever rode.

I sold him as a calf roping / heeling prospect to a man looking for a World Class roping horse.

To Date, Apache Blue Boy has won over 1500 AQHA points, has won 11 AQHA World Championships and has won over $60,000.00 in Show winnings.

All of his show winnings have been matched dollar for dollar by the North Americam Ranching Association of PMU Horse breeders.

So, maybe you should check for facts and not hype and animal rights nutcases lies and half-truths.
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post #8 of 10 Old 06-25-2011, 11:36 PM
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I don't remember where I read it, but I just heard about a PMU foal that won some big thing. Sorry for being so incredibly vague. Just backing up what's been said...

I may only be 17 now, but I probably won't take the drug anyway unless I REALLY need it when I'm older. My mom has exhaustively researched it because she's in the drug industry. Too many risks...Breast cancer, stroke, and heart attacks are all much more likely on the drugs with forms of estrogen in them. Very scary.

"The wise man thinks he knows nothing.
The fool thinks he knows everything."

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post #9 of 10 Old 06-26-2011, 08:48 AM
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Missdv, if it's indeed true that the Premarin industry is going to be moving overseas, it depends to what country they're being moved.

European regulations are even stricter than US/Canadian ones, so unless they're going somewhere like India I don't see it as being an issue over which to be alarmed.

Tymer, yes, there are increased risks with taking HRT, but for some women it's a necessary thing. My symptoms aren't that bad, but some days I feel like I could run rampaging through the streets with a gun. Some women really, truly go crazy during menopause, so whatever works for them I say take it.

You want the truth? You can't HANDLE the truth!

Last edited by Speed Racer; 06-26-2011 at 08:51 AM.
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post #10 of 10 Old 06-26-2011, 10:13 AM
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I didn't go read the articles, but know we have a rescue here that used to go every year to Canada to get pmus. The last time they went was 3 years ago. I never knew why they stopped, but I figured it was the downturn in the economy. I know they have several 3 YOs they couldn't get adopted then for $800.00, well still can't. But I do seem to remember the draft crosses went first. Because I couldn't understand why someone would walk past a registered AQHA for a cross. But I ended up with Sienna instead and I'm pretty happy with my choice (love her almost as much as family).
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