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random head shakeing?

4K views 49 replies 16 participants last post by  Blue 
#1 ·
for the past week and a half Odie has started tossing his head. it more of an upward spazem. at first i though he was getting a weird stall vice but he was doing it while he was trying to eat and drink. even when turned out he would do it. could not get him to stop, poll pressure seamed to make it worst but when we kept messing with his poll the results were inconsistent. he did it for two days then stopped for two days. then started up again and stopped. its on and off. i road him last night and he was fine. gave him his dinner and it started up again. he has been doing this since 8pm last night. kinda seamed to stop after our ride to day and a bath. asked my vet and he said it could be a few things but he is booked until mid november, and my only other options are a questionable vet group (who has killed or nearly killed most of the horses we know they have treated. they are NOT aloud near our horses any more) or a Track vet.

he is in no imediat danger so i thought i would ask you guys what you all think

here is us riding today.



and him a few days ago at the hitching post.



and he just dose that constantly. even when turned out with another horse. he tries to act normal but he just keeps tossing his head.

again already contacted my vet and will get the next appointment of the end of november but that dose not help me much at the moment. Sooo anyone had this issue before?
 
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#3 ·
yeah. just came to the barn one morning and he was just rocking out to the music in his head. no change in feed. same hay bag he has been using for forever. my mare was in the same stall for months and he had been in said stall for a 3 weeks. the gelding next to him who eats the same food an everything is fine. he is gaining weight nicely and he still rides nicely. my fiance said he did this a few times a 2-3 year old but it came and went quickly. this is the longest he has done this. never had this issue at the old barn ether.

could something like PSSM cause this?
 
#4 ·
He had quite a bit of crust built up around his eye, could be the face flies have made the eye sore enough that he's trying to keep them off before they land.

I did have a mare who would do that if she was standing tied and got bored but since Odie does it in the pasture I don't think boredom would be the reason.
 
#5 ·
i was putting the mask on but it made it ALOT worst. i have used fly spray to keep the flys off. swat as well. the drainage around the eyes is a thing with most the horses right now. my arab is a mess because of our "second Spring". my eyes are runny from it as well. when he stops and i put the mask on he starts up again, so i though he maybe hit his head somehow (he is talented that way) and that the mask was bothering it. i will take a vid of me putting the mask on. im thinking he maybe hurt a tooth somehow but im not seeing anything. if i rub along his face where his teeth are it dose not bother him. his poll seams sensitive but then some times its not.
 
#11 ·
the thing is his symptoms say level ^ but his behaviour has not changed. he is not stressed or panicked. he is not rubbing his more (more than trying to untie himself when tied) and he only seamed irritated when he is flinging his food around while trying to eat. no sores and he is not rubbing his head. the only time i have seen him do it is after i take the bridle off and thats a normal thing.

Level 5
Entire neck may become involved with up and down vertical and repetitive movements, the horse becomes more agitated, headshaking increases to 5-15 times in 15 minutes. May strike with legs at nose, becomes panicky and either won't move forward or wants to run.
Level 6
More continuous headshaking at 15-30 times a minute. May become extremely panicked and frantic to the point of hurting himself or others around him, headshaking 30 - too numerous to count.
 
#12 ·
WAIT! i DID change something. i started giving him Red Cell. im giving it to the 31 year old and the 25 year old too and they are fine so i did not make a connection. could that be the cause?

Here is whats in the pellets

Crude Protein (Min) 11 %
Crude Fat (Min) 2 %
Crude Fiber (Max) 30 %
Ash (Max) 12 %
Calcium (Min) 0.7 %
Calcium (Max) 1.7 %
Phosphorus (Min) 0.18 %
Phosphorus (Max) 0.5 %
Copper (Min) 15 ppm
Selenium (Min) 0.2 ppm
Zinc (Min) 45 ppm
Vitamin A (Min) 300 IU/LB
Ingredients:
Alfalfa hay, bermuda hay, cane molasses, phosphoric acid (feed grade), zinc sulfate, manganese sulfate, copper sulfate, cobalt carbonate, sodium selenite, potassium iodide, vitamin E supplement, vitamin A acetate, vitamin D3 supplement, d-calcium pantothenate, choline chloride, vitamin B12 supplement, riboflavin supplement, thiamin mononitrate, niacin supplement, pyridoxine hydrochloride, folic acid and d-biotin.

Here is the red cell. he is getting 1 oz a day

Guaranteed Analysis (per 1 oz serving):

Magnesium, min. 20 mg
Potassium, min. 100 mg
Sulfur, min. . 250 mg
Copper, min. 36 mg
Selenium, min. 0.65 mg
Zinc, min. 11 mg
Iron, min. 300 mg
Cobalt, min. 2 mg
Manganese, min. 39 mg
Iodine, min. 0.25 mg
Vitamin A, min. 25,000 I.U.
Vitamin D-3, min. 3,500 I.U.
Vitamin E, min. 35 I.U.
Vitamin B-12, min. 120 mcg
Thiamine, min. 30 mg
Riboflavin, min. 25 mg
Vitamin B-6, min. 8 mg
Menadione, min. 2.5 mg
Folic Acid, min. 7 mg
Biotin, min. 0.02 mg
Choline, min. 200 mg
d-Pantothenic Acid, min. 48 mg
Red Cell Pellets

Ingredients
Flaxseed Meal, Dehydrated Alfalfa Meal, Wheat Middlings, Vitamin A Supplement, Vitamin D3 Supplement, Vitamin E Supplement, Menadione Sodium Bisulfite Complex, Vitamin B12 Supplement, Riboflavin, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride, Folic Acid, Biotin, Thiamine Mononitrate, Choline Chloride, Calcium Pantothenate, Calcium Carbonate, Calcium Sulfate, Ferric Ammonium Citrate, Copper Sulfate, Magnesium Sulfate, Zinc Sulfate, Sulfur, Manganese Sulfate, Ethylenediamine Dihydriodide, Cobalt Sulfate, Potassium Chloride, Potassium Sulfate, Sodium Selenite, Yucca Schidigera Extract, Mineral Oil, and Lignin Sulfonate.

Guaranteed Analysis: Per Lb. Per Serving
(1/2 ounce)
Calcium (min) 1.30% 184 mg
Potassium (min) 0.705% 100 mg
Magnesium (min) 0.141% 20 mg
Sulfur (min) 1.763% 250 mg
Iron (min) 21,164 ppm 300 mg
Zinc (min) 7,760 ppm 110 mg
Manganese (min) 2,751 ppm 39 mg
Copper (min) 2,540 ppm 36 mg
Cobalt (min) 141 ppm 2 mg
Iodine (min) 17.6 ppm 0.25 mg
Selenium (min) 45.9 ppm 0.65 mg
Vitamin A (min) 224,197 IU 7,000 IU
Vitamin D3 (min) 112,098 IU 3,500 IU
Vitamin E (min) 1,121 IU 35 IU
Vitamin B12 (min) 3,843 mcg 120 mcg
Menadione (min) 80.1 mg 5 mg
Riboflavin (min) 800.7 mg 25 mg
d-Pantothenic Acid (min) 1,537 mg 48 mg
Thiamine (min) 961 mg 30 mg
Vitamin B6 (min) 256.2 mg 8 mg
Folic Acid (min) 129.7 mg 4 mg
Choline (min) 6,406 mg 200 mg
Biotin (min) 0.64 mg 0.020 mg
 
#13 ·
Did the head shaking start relatively soon after you started a giving him Red Cell Pellets?

Some studies of head-shaking horses have indicated that geldings are affected about twice as often as mares, while others have shown no bias by sex, breed, or age.

Is the head shaking horse thirty-one years of age?

I agree with the others.

Check his eyes, ears, mouth, nose, and neck.

A vet, a chiropractor, and/or a dentist may shed some light on this problem.

Also, has he ever been sensitive to light?

Are you sure that Red Cell Pellets are the only thing that has changed - even the weather?
 
#14 ·
PSSM can cause/contribute to headshaking-type behaviors due to inflammation in the facial nerves - maybe I missed it, does Odie have PSSM?

Does he need RedCell? Why are you feeding it? :)
 
#15 ·
he has a HARD time gaining muscle mass. he is also a hard keeper. also odie is only 9 years old. i was thinking PSSM because he is a ranch bred half APHA with NO genetic testing so who knows whats going on there. he also goes from 'Lets GO' to Eh id rather walk VERY quickly. not positive if he is just lazy or if there is an issue. Also there may be something to the ears thing. we messed with them and looked in them and saw nothing but he STOPPED his violent head shaking (he was bad today. even doing it whole time trying to pee). i rode him English with a cavison AND he was quiet, no head tossing and dropped his head nicely. then i switched to western and same. no head tossing and a nice quiet back up WITH a strange horse freaking out in the arena. soooo vets coming out on the second so we shall see.
 
#21 ·
so i got to watch the head shaking process start at the show yesterday. he was fine at 6am when we picked him up. half way though the ranch confo (so about 9:30ish) he started desperately trying to rub his nose on me or the lead. gave him food and moved him around a bit and it seamed to calm him down. he did it a couple of times during the riding class but only slightly (still placed first). he was fine after 12 ish and did not offer to toss his head again for the rest of the day. he was saddled and worked most the day though it was all walk jog mostly walk after the class.
 
#22 · (Edited)
Honestly that's REALLY normal when bugs are annoying...which you say they are.

Or something else is bothering their head.

I know horses (all TBs) that do it as a stable vice too.

It's pretty normal...

I do know a horse that does it due to allergies and it's nothing like that...from the website linked: "This is very important because headshaking in itself it is not the same as headshaking syndrome." "The motion is a sudden, intense downward flick of the nose" "Movement is usually acute, violent, intermittent and involuntary. "Acting like a bee flew up nose"".
 
#23 ·
yeah its not bugs. the bugs are not bad and he is doing that in a field of grass and stopping every 15 seconds to take a bite then go back to shaking his head. the 31 year old is just munching away. and when he dose snap his head its not voluntary. when you hold his face you can feel its almost as sudden and violent as a hickup. it seams to get better as it cools off in the evening but i dont get it. we are only in the 90s but when we where 114 he was fine.

he has also bloodied the side of his face good. im almost wondering if he got something stuck up his tear duct but his eyes are not watering that bad at the moment.
 
#24 ·
Just out of curiosity I might have the vet check his guttural pouches as well, as that can cause head shaking.

I actually saw the videos on YT (I'm subbed to you.) and was like uh-oh, poor Odie.

Hopefully it's nothing too bad and will clear up soon.
 
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