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Worming disaster-what did I do wrong?What do I do now?

7K views 33 replies 23 participants last post by  Celeste 
#1 ·
I'm a new horse mom and I have a 8 1/2 month old baby Friesian. I've had her since she was almost 5 months old. I've wormed her every month with Ivermectin. I read that I should stick with the same wormer for a while, and this I was told that Ivermectin is a good broad wormer. If there were any sings that she had worms, I missed them. She is looking great, in fact she is a bit overweight. This month I decided to change the wormer to Pyrantel. For two days she eliminated an enormous amount of roundworms. They were huge and I can't even put it in words how many she had. I'm horrified. I could see something like this coming out of a neglected horse, not out of my baby. Do I need to do a fecal every month? I did look at her poop before and she had one little worm in her stool once, when she was 5 months old, it was dead and I didn't think it was something to worry about. I'm so lucky that she didn't colic. I feel like I failed her. My sister-in law is an experienced horse person, and she didn't see anything wrong with her. She was also seen by two vets, on three occasions(for general check up and shots) and besides telling me to take her off the pasture, the vet didn't see anything wrong with her either.
And what should I do now to get rid of worms that may be on the ground? I do pick up poop several times a day, but I can't remove 100% of fecal material.
Should I give her another dose of wormer in 10 days? What kind? I'm totally freaking out.
What else am I screwing up?
Thanks in advance for your help!:cry:
 
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#4 ·
I dont think there is a need to worm a horse every month, IMO i think that is waaay to much. I worm mine four times a year. Once for every season. I would probably call my vet out and maybe they can direct you further. If they need to do something or can suggest a wormer to use. Dont do back to back same brand wormer, if anything the worms might have just become ammune to the wormer. They have different brands for different reason, and that help kill the certin worm or egg for that time of the year. So switch them up. Hope that helps!
 
#5 ·
Agreed- a fecal will tell you exactly what she is carrying unless she has picked up a parasite so new she isn't passing it in her stool yet.

Also be aware that not all dewormers are alike or cover the same parasites. Different wormers will generally cover different types of parasites so be sure to check what the wormer you are using is good against.

I also wouldn't be worming monthly. If you were treating her for a parasitic infection according to a doctors standards you might give something for a few months until she is cleared since some dewormers are used once a month for a few months according to the doctor...
 
#9 ·
I was worried that once a month was too much, but my sister-in-law and the vet said that I should worm monthly until she's 1 year old. Her babysitter, who's a 30+ year old pony mule gets wormed four times a year. After I saw what came out of my baby I wormed Miss Maude ahead of time with Pyrantel and if she did have worms, I didn't see any. I'll have a fecal done on Monday and I'll ask the vet again about worming less often.
With my dogs I never worm without fecals and my dogs had worms only once in 12 years. Only one of them tested positive, but I wormed all of them just in case.
I am concerned about the toxins in wormers, but I was told that there is no way around it with horses. How do I kill the eggs on the ground?
 
#10 ·
I'll try the waffers. My baby is easy to give paste to, but her babysitter hates it.
Should I give her Fenbenzadole next?
Why didn't the Ivermectrin work? Was it because I gave her the same thing back to back? And how in the world did she get full of worms when it seams like I was worming too often?
 
#11 ·
Ivermectin is a good dewormer. But, It will only take care of Large Strongyles, Small Strongyles, Pinworms, Ascarids, Hairworms, Large-mouth Stomach Worms, Bots, Lungworms, Intestinal Threadworms.

Pyrantyl will take care of large strongyles, small strongyles, pinworms, and large roundworms.

Roundworms are probably the most common worms that horses will get. And ivermectin doesn't kill them. So its important to rotate dewormers when you do deworm.

Fecal exams done in spring and fall will tell you if you need to treat, and if so, by using what.

There is no way to kill eggs in your pasture. Many horses are probably never completely clear or worms because of their grazing nature. There will also be eggs. So it is important to deworm. But...only when you need it, and for exactly the type of worms you have. Otherwise worms will become resistant to deworms and eventually well need stronger and stronger pesticides...or...no deworm will work. We will have created a "super bug" so to speak.

Don't feel bad. We've all made mistakes in our horsemanship. You were just following instructions by you vet/friend.
 
#12 ·
Wow, they've obviously become immune to the ivermectin, so I'd consider that useless from now on. The jury appears to be out on whether it's a good or bad thing to 'rotate' different wormers, from what I've been reading, but one thing seems certain - that the pharmaceutical companies recommend using their chemicals far more often than necessary(of course, as they want you to buy more) & this is part of the reason parasites become 'immune' to certain chemicals quickly.... & you've been worming even more frequently even than manufacturers recommend I think(I don't use Ivermectin so can't check).
 
#14 ·
Thank you so much to everybody. I did try to get informed and to do everything right, but I screwed up royally in this situation. And what is extremely unsettling is that I had no idea.
I wonder what else am I messing up without knowing?
I couldn't love this baby any more if I would have given birth to her. I want to raise her right and give her everything she needs to grow up healthy and happy.
 
#17 · (Edited)
It is common practice to dewom babies once a month until they are a year old. The reason being is baby horses do not have resistance to worms liek adult horses get. They also have their mouths on everything and eat poop to regulate their guts.

I would continue to deworm once a month but would rotate products. It is possible that you simply caught a heavy hatch of worms with this product. The other thing is you might have been underdosing her accidently as well I typically overdose by a little margin and sometimes just double dose things like Ivermectin that have a large safety margin to be SURE I kille dwhat Im trying to kill and not underdose.

You really need to talk to your vet about this tho. Certain things are more area specific and babies have different needs and problems than adults do. Also a fecal is a great idea and dont forget about tapeworms. I love Quest plus but id hold off using it till she is about a 2 yo and make sure to accurately weight her. IT kills everything and is the only product with no know resistances yet but there is a low margin of safety, thus needing to know a very close approximate weight and waiting till the horse is a bit older. I never have worm problems and have used it on my babies once they reach about a year and a half to two years to be sure they are clean.
 
#18 ·
I used her body length and girth to calculate her size and I do overdose just a tiny bit. She weights 648lbs(according to this measurements) and I give her wormer for 700lbs. I read that if I change the wormer often she would get an upset stomach and my sister-in-law also uses the same wormer back to back.
I did learn my lesson now, but I'm horrified thinking that she could have coliced from what I can only call neglect. I didn't neglect her intentionally, in fact I've been overprotective of her and I've been trying my best to take great care of her, but trying doesn't really cut it.
I'm going to keep reading, checking with the vet often and hopefully I won't screw up again.
 
#20 ·
I used her body length and girth to calculate her size and I do overdose just a tiny bit. She weights 648lbs(according to this measurements) and I give her wormer for 700lbs. I read that if I change the wormer often she would get an upset stomach and my sister-in-law also uses the same wormer back to back.
I did learn my lesson now, but I'm horrified thinking that she could have coliced from what I can only call neglect. I didn't neglect her intentionally, in fact I've been overprotective of her and I've been trying my best to take great care of her, but trying doesn't really cut it.
I'm going to keep reading, checking with the vet often and hopefully I won't screw up again.

Foals tend to have round worms more than any other kind of worm and Ivermectin doesn't kill round worms. You didn't screw up, weren't given good info. I deworm my foals once a month, vet agrees that this is correct. I use Ivermectin, then Safeguard (Pyrantel), then Panacur (Fenbendazle). Those are the 3 wormers considered pretty much safe at any dose in case the syringe slips and you give the whole thing to the foal, it won't hurt them.

Once they are 6 months you can weigh them, the way you are doing it will get you close enough but a scale is always best, and give the appropriate dose of Quest Plus. I wouldn't use this one more than twice/year, even on full grown horses. You can also rotate Zimectrin Gold in there, even in foals as young as 6 weeks, I'm careful with the dosing on this one too, it has moxidectin as well as Ivermectin in it.

I also keep my foals on a daily dewormer until they are 2, then we go to fecal testing. I use Strongid C2X and have very good results.
 
#19 ·
Don't be so hard on yourself. ;-)

I'd be curious to know if you sister in laws horses have roundworms though. Might be something you want to bring up with her...?
 
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#22 ·
Relax, it's all good. She'll survive and you learned a valuable lesson. I know there are a lot of folks who still recommend deworming quarterly (4 times per year) with a set schedule of de-wormers. However, I am of the mind that you should just get fecals done a couple of times a year (spring and fall) and then administer the de-wormer you need to in order to take care of the worm load they are carrying...if they have one. There are a couple of my horses that haven't needed deworming in years because they don't have a worm count on a fecal. They are still slick and shiny and healthy. No idea if they have some weird immunity to worms or what. Then, there are others like my Taz that seem to have a pretty good load each time I have a fecal done on him :?.

Doing it that way, only deworming when needed, helps to eliminate the resistance buildup to the dewormers. It's just like infections in humans. People get antibiotics for every little thing, and then they don't use them right, and folks wonder how we ended up with MRSA.
 
#23 ·
Relax, it's all good. She'll survive and you learned a valuable lesson. I know there are a lot of folks who still recommend deworming quarterly (4 times per year) with a set schedule of de-wormers. However, I am of the mind that you should just get fecals done a couple of times a year (spring and fall) and then administer the de-wormer you need to in order to take care of the worm load they are carrying...if they have one. There are a couple of my horses that haven't needed deworming in years because they don't have a worm count on a fecal. They are still slick and shiny and healthy. No idea if they have some weird immunity to worms or what. Then, there are others like my Taz that seem to have a pretty good load each time I have a fecal done on him :?.

Doing it that way, only deworming when needed, helps to eliminate the resistance buildup to the dewormers. It's just like infections in humans. People get antibiotics for every little thing, and then they don't use them right, and folks wonder how we ended up with MRSA.

I never thought of that, great idea, its more ost effective and better for our horses tummies and well.... overall health. I might start doing this.
 
#24 ·
I seen the same huge roundworms come out of a yearling filly I bought, used the same stuff you used, pyrantel, as I read ivermectin too isn't effective on these. This filly probably had not been wormed at all before I bought her. I wormed her again in 2 weeks with the same stuff & seen a few more of the big white ugly things. After 2 months I had a fecal done, she was clear. The vet (this was over 20 years ago) gave me a schedule of rotation of wormers to use in a 3 year span.
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#25 ·
You REALLY need to cut yourself some slack girl! Babies eat their momma's poop, they just do. They are wormy wormy wormy little things!!!! My 2 year old was wormed monthly until she hit a year. You were not neglecting your horse. Rotating wormer is important. I may have missed the part where it was said that this could have caused colic...??? Wonder how rescue horses don't colic when they've been truly neglected and FULL of worms for years. I don't think you did a thing wrong. Horses are hardy animals. She is just fine and will be just fine. Get a fecal done. Have a glass of wine and forgive yourself. It's not your fault she had worms. You helped her by getting them out. Think of yourself as the good guy. There's no way you could've known.
 
#26 ·
Thanks a million Dreamcatcher! I'm confused about what the roundworms are. I thought they are Ascarids and if I'm correct Ivermectin is suppose to kill them... I'll do some more research. I didn't think about using daily wormer also, but I'll give that a try too. This worms freaked me out like you wouldn't believe.
My sister-in-law's horses don't have any worms in their stools and don't have any symptoms to indicate that the do(although Wicca didn't have worms in her stool or any other symptoms...). My baby was at my sister-in-law's place for 3 months, because I read that it's best for her mental development to be in a herd. I've never saw her eat poop, but I'm sure she has. She was on a 2 acre pasture with other 4 horses and I wasn't able to pick up the poop as well as I'm doing now, but I did pick quite a bit of poop there and there were no worms in anybodys stool. My sister-in-law has had horses for over 40 years and she was as surprised as I was that my baby was totally super infested with them. I am an overprotective mom and I would have never imagined that something like this would happen to my kid. Something like this would never cross my mind not even in my nightmares.
This has been my biggest screw up since I've been a "fuzzy kid" mom, and I hope my last.
 
#27 · (Edited)
Ivermectin does not do round worms, so she likely had a large burden (even before you got her )that wasn't addressed until now. Dont freak out, some babies get that way and you clearly haven't neglected her. This is a learning experience and alls well that ends well. The good news is you didn't colic her when she passed them which sometimes happens with babies who get a large roundworm burden. A good deworming rule of thumb is to do it 4 times a year, Ivermectin is always your late fall dewormer so that you are sure to get the bots. Pyrantel twice a year and a praziquantal product for tapeworms once a year. The ideal situation of course is doing fecal exams quarterly as well but always use a praziquantel once a year as tapes often don't show up on fecal exam but we know from necropsy that many of these horses still have large numbers in their ileal cecal oriface. good luck!
 
#28 ·
I had the same feeling, Smrobs, that's what I've always done with my dogs, but my vet, the breeder and my sister-in-law told me to go ahead and worm her, because babies don't have as much resistance to parasites as adults do. I obviously had the wrong info about not changing the wormers often. I should have read more about it, but I've never had problems with parasites with my dogs, even though they go to parks, dog shows, pretty much everywhere. I've been stressing over her diet, her hoof trimming, training, companionship, etc.
And Waresbear, your filly had been neglected, with a horse that had not have regular care I wouldn't have been surprised, but when you think you are doing everything you need to and find out that you're an idiot, I can't explain how that feels. I'm not good at many things, but I'm (usually) a good mom to my fuzzy kids. I love them, I understand them and I pride myself on being a great mom.
Thank a lot guys! You've been very helpful!
 
#29 ·
I don't know if it's approved for foals, but I use a daily dewormer (strongid c2x) and then just have a fecal done a couple of times a year to see if anything has slipped by the strongid, and then (if it has, which it hasn't yet) I (would) choose a paste dewormer depending on what kind of worms the fecal turned up.

Don't knock yourself too hard - worms are "natural" for horses. Undesirable, yes, but they've been living with them for millenia, and the horse system can take a fair amount of that before it becomes a huge problem.
 
#30 ·
You didn't screw up & I doubt your dewormer failed due to resistance.
I've linked an article on the life cycle of round worms & others. Dewormer only kills the worms once they have turned into worms. It probably took them a few months to get where the dewormer-any dewormer- would kill them. There are encysted parasites which are different though.
In other words, the worms weren't killed until they could be.
That's why we give the dewormers at intervals, to break the life cycle & get them when most vulnerable.
You may have wasted a bit of money giving a dewormer before the worms were mature enough to kill but you didn't screw up.
You coming here & asking shows you are a good horse owner.:)
Strongyles, Roundworms, Tapeworms, & More: Common Internal Equine Parasites
 
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