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would love some help/advice on what to do with my complex OTTB please!

4K views 34 replies 15 participants last post by  Beauseant 
#1 ·
okay im going to try and give out FULL details on the issue and the horse..
basic info.
the horse will be 6 in april She has been at the barn for a full year, she came from the kentucky equine humane society. she has been raced more than once and has won a few races.
She is a known biter and kicker- she also gets WORSE yes worse when you correct her.
yet she is a changed horse with a lead rope attached to her, and shes better with a saddle on her.
She is a one person horse and that is it. I am her one person. (she is a-lot better though from a year ago).
but here is what is going on recently.
we discovered she has ulcers and started to give her aleovera juice to soothe her stomach. She gets nervous that she grinds her teeth a lot. we dont have to get her floated she does it for us. They changed their feed from just reg sweet feed to a mixture of
beet pulp, rice bran, safechoice, alfalfa pellets, and diatamichious earth- my mare gets 2 scoops of that twice a day plus a scoop of sr feed. ( they are going to change it to something called wellsolve soon.
last week she coliced real bad. yesterday she was not colicing but her ulcers bothered her a lot. The owner gave her a shot of bantamine to just make her feel better..... I stayed at the barn last night and checked on her this morning... text the owner and let her know she had gut sounds ate her hay and drank her water but she still looked the same. I had the stablehand check on her as well... and I came by between jobs and she was fine.
she went and got her 3 things of gastrogard. I wonder if thats enough to knock it out? Should I get her a supplement like Smart Gut? and use that for a month or so after the GastroGard? I cant really change what they feed her.
The guy who is feeding her is only giving her a little bit now just while her stomach is healing... it would be nice I think to give her snaller meals during the day.
I do not OWN her, I lease her from some one... So I can only do so much. but please all opinions are welcome... and just a fact- If it was not for ME this horse would be dead.
she is also about 100 pounds underweight b/c of all of the above.
Sorry for the long post just wanted to make sure I have all the details down.
 
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#2 ·
1. A horse grinding its teeth is in no way a substitute for proper, veterinary dental care.
2. Aloe vera is not a proven or veterinarian-recommended substitute for medical ulcer treatment.
3. Sounds like a lot of concentrated feed. Is she not on pasture or free choice hay? She needs to be. And if she's got getting turnout, she sure needs it. That could be the cause of some of the ulcers.....
4. Since ulcers have been definitively diagnosed, I'm assuming a veterinarian has seen this mare. What are the vet's recommendations about the proper dosage of Gastrogard?
 
#3 ·
I'm kinda confused on what you're asking :/ I think if you guys continue with this she'll be fine. I'm not very educated on stomach ulcers, but do they heal and go away ?

If so continue with the same routine until they heal, and once healed start changing her diet to help her gain wait.


Take all that with a grain of salt, since I'm not very educuated on her problems.

Best of luck to you!!
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#4 ·
she gets hay all day... she is stalled up b/c the only grass now is in the back pastures and she gets too nervous when she is not near the barn... but she does get exercised...

and I know all that stuff Bubba... I do not know what the vet said.. All i know is when I went to go check on her she had 3 things by her stall of it. the owner was not there. the aleovera was just to soothe her for a bit.

oh they are also giving her some veg oil and some herbal stuff in her feed.
 
#6 ·
yah I just like to be prepared.... I guess have a strategy when I talk to her.

I did have the horse on empower it helped her gain weight but since they have changed her feed and added stuff to it... she was taken off of it for now. going to wait til shes a bit more healed up and then restart her back on it.
 
#7 ·
The vet needs to get you a prescription for a real medication for ulcers, although what you are using may help, it will not solve the problem and will probably only work for a small amount of time if it even does work.
 
#9 ·
I would put her on a supplement to keep the ulcers from coming back because horses that get them can keep getting them and are more susceptible to them. I am worried about her food choice. Alfalfa pellets are very high in protein and it seem like she does not need it because she gets nervous and seems like a hot horse. Personally it sounds like your horse is stressed out and nervous, these things can cause ulcers. Additionally i would try mare magic with her to calm her down so she could possibly go out in pasture. Also you can try magnesium, that helps them calm down and focus more.

I would talk more to your vet and also the owner of the horse. Be there for vet appointments and if you cant make it call your vet and talk to them about what you need to do.

Now, diatamichious earth. How many cups are in a scoop of this? Horses should only get 1 cup a day of this. Why are you feeding this? Does your horse also have a problem with worms? What DE does it act like a chemical and it actually dehydrates the insects. This has more information on it:
Diatomaceous Earth - Food Grade Diatomaceous Earth Health Benefits

When you say they are going to switch her to wellsolve is it the weight control one or the l/s (low starch low sugar). Why does she need to switch to this? if she is under weight dont go on weight control, and it doesnt seem like she is special needs and needs the l/s one. here is some info about it:
Purina Horse Feeds - WELLSOLVE


I am little confused on what she is eating. Can you please give more info like height, weight, work load, how many flakes of hay, type of hay, amount of beet pulp, rice bran, grain, and DE. This way i could help you even more:)

The best advice i can give you is call your vet and see if you could get his/her input on what you should do for the ulcers and what you should do for feeding because i think it should be revised.

Also if your horse grinds your teeth, she probably needs floating even more! what happens is the teeth keep growing and the more the horse wears them down by grinding, chewing, etc. they start to develop hooks on the sides of their teeth. Please read the first article on floating, that explains it better than me:) Dental Care: Floating, Hooks, Loose Teeth, and Wolf Teeth

I hope this helps! :)
 
#10 ·
For my TB with ulcers I gave her ratidine(generic zantac) as I couldn't afford a month of gastrogard, I also put her on a supplement called ulc-r-aid which has been amazing(and it's fairly inexpensive to, horse.com has it I think $43 for 10lbs which lasts 3-5 months). I also found aloe juice to help soothe her stomach. If possible get her on alfalfa hay, cubes or pellets, it also helps heal ulcers.
 
#11 ·
Okay here is what all the horses get. There's about 25. It's a full big bucket of beet pulp. 3 scoops of rice bran and 3 scoops of alfalfa... That gets sooked. Good... Then half a bag of safe choice. Usually a scoop or 2 of the dirt stuff. Then its mixed.

She would be getting the low starch.

She is underweight but not that bad.
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#13 · (Edited)
You are probably not going to get much done with her problems as long as she is stalled. Some horses just do not stall well and she sounds like the poster child for them.

I doubt you find much relief for her until she is turned out. That can bring a whole new set of problems, but I would sure try to find a turn-out place for her.

You might also try 'mood altering' drugs or hormones. She might respond to Regumate or DepoProvera or to Thiamin (Vitamin B-1) or some other drugs like Resurpine. She sounds like a basket case and medicating one is like using medication on a person that is bi-polar -- it can be life saving. I have seen basket cases become much more manageable with therapeutic medication under a Vet's direction.

I have seen these kinds of horses that just kept getting ulcers -- over and over -- until they were managed on drugs and turned out.
 
#14 ·
Kathryne,

I am not a horse health expert by any stretch of the imagination, and I am sure there are others on here who can give you good advice on ulcers, but I did want to mention two things that jumped out at me when reading your post:

Firstly, PLEASE do not assume that grinding teeth is a substitute for floating, it isn't. Floating EVENLY files all the teeth down...top and bottom, not just a few worn down erratically, like grinding does. Floating is very important to ALL aspects of a horse's health....grinding may wear a tooth or so down, but it is often one here two there and the grinding may be too little to wear off the sharp points, or too MUCH...causing inappropriately chewed food....which disrupts amount of nutrients gained from the food (hence low weight) and irritate the ulcers (hence possible colic issues)....PLEASE suggest the owner have this horse's teeth floated.

Secondly, because she is on the low weight side, she could certainly benefit from a probiotic. They are a cheap additive to feed that can sometimes work miracles on a horse's digestion.

We've also heard that alfalfa or alfalfa cubes (shredded or soaked) have a chemical in them that soothes the stomach and reduces stomach acids, which can benefit a horse with digestive disturbances.

we give our OTTB one lb. of shredded alfalfa cubes each day even though we do not suspect he has ulcers ... just because he is an ex racer, and the tendenacy towards ulcers in OTTBs is high.....

Good luck with this horse, badger the owner to have her teeth done ASAP, and try a probiotic.....

Keep us updated on how she is doing.....
 
#17 ·
I can't speak about the ulcers as I have no experience with them, however I have read articles that suggest alfalfa can help with ulcers due to the higher calcium content.

I guess I just wanted to say that alfalfa also helps put weight on them. We feed lots of alfalfa out west and the horses are all slick and shiny. So the alfalfa should help with both the ulcers and weight gain. :)

I think the person who suggested turn-out is right on track too.
 
#18 ·
We will eventually float her teeth. There is not any grass to turn her out and right now she's on a special diet. When some more grass grows we will let her out. Just for now she's stalled.

She does get out a lot during the week.

But thank Yall for the advice.
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#19 ·
I'm just curious. What does grass have to do with keeping a horse outside in a large area with other horses. That is what is natural for horses. Many nervous horses (particularly OTTBs) do not do well when confined to stalls and those same horses often are the ones the develop ulcers and stall vices like cribbing,weaving, stall kicking, stall aggression, etc. We have just found that they are so much happier living out.
 
#23 ·
How much turnout does she get each day, kathryne?

I didn't read the part where you mentioned that.
 
#24 ·
Not per day the guy who takes care of them takes care of around 30 horses by himself.... So she gets turned out when he has the time. But its mainly when I'm there. I live 30 mins from there... Work 4 days a week and go to school 2x a week all day. I let her out whenever possible.
Whenever she gets off her supplement it only last a month. I will say its the owner who said she needs to stay in for now. She walks off her weight she still needs to gain more.
In a perfect world she would stay out.

Hell one guy only comes to see his horses once a month... They are all stallions but one so they stay locked up... I hate it. So please don't think I want her to be there in a stall I don't... It's not like she never gets out. And her stall is pretty big to be honest.

I come about 4 days a week. I care about her. But I can't ask the guy to do that if he doesnt have the time. He checks on her... makes sure she is fine. If I couldn't come for a week I'm sure he would take her out.

Btw she was turned out for 3 months straight from July-Sept on grass but away from the barn.....she developed her weight issues then along with her ulcers. Before then she was out and in. Heck there where days when I would put her in her stall bc of the weather but not be able to take her out soon.. few days later they had put her outside.
Bc i couldnt make it.
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#25 · (Edited)
Thank you for explaining the situation.

It's not your fault,and i don't think anyone should blame you....but leaving a horse out when "someone has the time" should not be acceptable.

Wow....i am just speechless.....I cannot imagine what our OTTB would do if he got out only once in a while.....our horses are out from 7 am till 9 pm DAILY AT LEAST....sometimes they are out 24/7 if the weather is nice.

I agree with the others that all horses need regular outside time.

I also agree that this outside time should be as much time as possible.

I DISAGREE that all horses should be left out ALL THE TIME...DESPITE THE WEATHER. But that's just me!

I sincerely doubt that your horse DEVELOPED these ulcers while out on pasture 24/7. Likely, her drop in weight was due to the increased physical activitiy that comes with being able to graze...and run. NO MATTER how big her stall is, she cannot run in it....

Think of it, a horse that rarely is able to graze and run...as God intended them to do....does this seem right to anyone???!!! It shouldn't seem right, it should seem like abuse.


again, I am not blaming YOU, but keeping her locked up in a cage like this is unacceptable and neglectful....and abusive.

They key to curing or alleviating her ulcers is a vet's dietary intervention.....AND AS MUCH TURNOUT TIME AS POSSIBLE. IF she gets stressed outside, she can walk or run it off. If she is caged all day, almost every day....her stress has no outward place to go , so it turns inward, creating ulcers and colic.

It is the belief of the medical community that the unusually high percentage of OTTBs with ulcers is due to the excessive stall time they are forced to endure....yet, this horse is continually forced to endure what is CAUSING these ulcers in the silly belief that it will somehow CURE her ulcers.

Unbelieavable.

I feel sorry for this horse....and you. Because it seems that you really do care about her and are trying to help her. It's a sad situation for both of you
 
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