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Suing for a horse not being as advertised?

This is a discussion on Suing for a horse not being as advertised? within the Horse Law forums, part of the Horse Resources category
  • Suing someone who i bought a horse off
  • Horse not as advertised

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    09-17-2012, 12:20 PM
  #21
Yearling
It's as most of these other posters have been saying. You're probably SOL. You prepaid for the horse without ever seeing it, got there and realized it was shorter, and still took it home, only to call and complain later. As Faye said, a ton of things can affect measuring a horse - you have no way of telling that when they measured the horse how tall it is. And I don't honestly think three inches is going to cut his value in half.

And why on earth would you say that soundness doesn't matter if you're breeding?! Of course it matters! If the horse isn't sound, you're not going to breed sound foals. That's just irresponsibility in my eyes. It sounds like you went blindly into this purchase, didn't check it out first, didn't get a PPE, brought it home anyways and now you have an issue. I don't think you have much grounds here. Yes, it sucks, and I'm sorry it happened - just take it as a learning experience.
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    09-17-2012, 12:25 PM
  #22
mls
Trained
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallulah    
No, not a troll. But as a horse owner, I can honestly say I have NEVER misrepresented a horse I was selling and would gladly take the horse back and issue a refund if somehow there was ever this type of misunderstanding, omission or miscommunication. But hey, maybe that's just me and I becoming pretty certain that I am in the minority in the horse industry.
Again - you took the horse with you. Had you waited until the 'barn manager' or whomever you had been communicating with was able to discuss the issue with you in person, you might have had things straightened out.

Horse height is a matter of where the person places the tape/stick and how the horse is standing.

I hardly think 15 hands is a midget.
Britt, Cat, Plains Drifter and 2 others like this.
     
    09-17-2012, 12:35 PM
  #23
Started
It amazes me when people can be so far off on a horse. You know how tall you are..put it in hands I stand 15.3 and know where a horses wither is compared to my eye level. I am pretty dang accurate. Why horse people tend to guess high is beyond me but a 16hh horse is a big horse. .

My daughter in law was looking at a horse she wanted at least 16hh we got there and I told her that horse was not even 15.2 she said I sticked it.. Told her she better learn how to use the stick and asked if she could see my head over the top of the wither. She said yes about 3" if it :) Well at 15.3 that horse was about 15.1 :) She redid her ad lol

I would not have loaded the horse but I would not have paid for it in full till I had seen it either. Than I could have walked away just putting my deposit at risk.
     
    09-17-2012, 12:48 PM
  #24
Green Broke
Wickednag you do realise that your height can vary by up to an inch dependant on what time of the day it is
Posted via Mobile Device
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    09-17-2012, 12:54 PM
  #25
Trained
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallulah    
No, not a troll. But as a horse owner, I can honestly say I have NEVER misrepresented a horse I was selling and would gladly take the horse back and issue a refund if somehow there was ever this type of misunderstanding, omission or miscommunication. But hey, maybe that's just me and I becoming pretty certain that I am in the minority in the horse industry.
I have had buyers tell me that I'm too honest when I sell a horse. I will tell you every single thing it ever did wrong, right or so so, every physical imperfection I even think it has and if there are any known genetic issues with its lines. Especially with Arabians, my chosen breed, there are notorious measurement issues, we even say, "Was he measured with a regular stick or an Arabian Stick?" because they are notoriously 4 inches shorter than stated height.

I have a mare who sticks 15.2 and EVERYONE who sees her swears she's 16.3 because she's so solid and substantial and nobody believes me when I say nope, she's 15.2.

So even when you're honest, people get fooled depending on the horse.

You have a few, "I would nevers" in your little adventure.

These are my buyer's I would nevers:

#1 I would never prepay for a horse I'd never seen.
#2 I would never do a sale without a contract
#3 I would never take a horse home that I had doubts about on pick up
#4 I never buy an animal without a PPE

These are my seller's I would nevers:

#1 I would never sell a horse without a contract
#2 I would never let a horse leave the property if the buyer expressed doubts
#3 I would not take the horse back once it had left the property, unless I had expressly agreed to in writing.
#4 I never put a firm height in an ad, I let the buyer measure for themselves when they arrive. So, horse is about 15.2, I put "over 15 hands" in the ad.

In my contracts, I even have a PPE clause. It says something like,

"Buyer has beed advised to have a pre-purchase exam done by his/her choice of vet. Buyer has _____ scheduled the exam with XXXX vet on XXXXXX date or _______ Buyer has declined to have a pre-purchase exam done and understand the horse is sold as is, where is, with no guarantee of soundness, ridability or breedability once the animal leaves these premises. Buyer acknowleges that there will be no returns or refunds for any reason.

____________________________________
Buyer's Sig & Date

____________________________________
Seller's Sig & Date"

I have the buyer initial in their own writing by the appropriate sentence and then sign and date that clause in addition to signing the contract as a whole.
     
    09-17-2012, 01:54 PM
  #26
Started
Quote:
Originally Posted by faye    
wickednag you do realise that your height can vary by up to an inch dependant on what time of the day it is
Posted via Mobile Device
Being an inch off a horse is much closer than three inches off :) and No, in my 56 years of living I have ever been told that before. I do realize that I can spell realize and dependent correctly though ;)
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    09-17-2012, 03:05 PM
  #27
Green Broke
Realise is spelt with an S in the UK just like colour is spelt with a "U" over here and without in the US, so commenting about my spelling just shows how uneducated you are.

You measure shorter at the end of the day due to compression of the joints in the ankle, knee and spine.
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    09-17-2012, 03:16 PM
  #28
Started
Quote:
Originally Posted by faye    
realise is spelt with an S in the UK just like colour is spelt with a "U" over here and without in the US, so commenting about my spelling just shows how uneducated you are.

You measure shorter at the end of the day due to compression of the joints in the ankle, knee and spine.
And do you spell DEPENDENT and SPELT differently too :) or are you just a tad under educated? Maybe just lacking manners? I have never measured shorter at the end of the day. I guess I haven't suffered from joint compression yet :) I was having fun with you over the spelling my dear hence the little wink symbol. No need to get ugly :)


Have a good day Faye!
     
    09-17-2012, 03:23 PM
  #29
Yearling
Pointing out spelling mistakes is really only "fun" for the person pointing them out. Being the butt end of someone's "joke" isn't fun.... even if there's a smiley involved. ;)

As to the OP, I agree that they're pretty much SOL. Live and learn... get a PPE on ALL purchases, always meet a horse before all the money changes hands, and don't haul away what you don't want.
     
    09-17-2012, 03:25 PM
  #30
Started
Quote:
Originally Posted by faye    
Talluhlah, How do you know that on thier uncalibrated stick that the horse doesnt measure 15.3hh, how do you garentee that your stick is the correct one?
Have you had it officialy calibrated each year, do you maintain your calibration certificates, has your measuring area been calibrated and is completely level?

Was the horse relaxed when you measured it but not relaxed when they measured it? A horse gets bigger if it is excited.
Is the horse in the same condition now as it was when they measured it (again fat can ad height), are you measuring at the correct spot and did they meassure at the correct spot? Was the horse dehydrated after a long journey when you stuck a stick on it (dehydration is a well known way to reduce a horses height).

I show horses in height classes where being 0.1cm over height can destroy a horses showing career entirely. My knowlege of measuring, what effects it is very large, however it is obvious that either you or the seller does not have the same knowlege.
Faye
Off a 0.1 cm is a lot different than 3" or 7.6 cm. I agree with you there can be a variance but to that extend is to big of a discrepancy.

I would have never loaded the horse if the height were that big of a factor. JMHO!
     

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