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EPSM supplement product

This is a discussion on EPSM supplement product within the Horse Nutrition forums, part of the Horse Health category

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        11-11-2013, 11:23 PM
      #31
    Banned
    No I hadn't followed pervious thread but will look it up tomorrow and read it sounds like a heck of a journey. My horse is IR and was lamininatic still not 100 percent sound....if you can avoid the IR that would be a plus.

    This has been quite the year for me with my boy and his issues....iv learned a lot about diet and NSC levels. My horse has to be under or at 10 percent NSC or laminitis issues rear their ugly head. TC senoir caused him laminitis issues so had to ditch that and fast I thought it would be safe.

    I will for sure be keeping up on this and will be reading about it on your pervious thread. ...to cold to be outside so what the heck lots of computer time.
         
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        11-12-2013, 12:31 AM
      #32
    Trained
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Oldhorselady    
    Desert...Thanks for the link. THAT is precisely why I wanted to try Dr. Kellon's approach! If Snickers wasn't already an easy keeper, I wouldn't have probably done it. But you already know, what I've tried to get weight off of her. The IR scares me too. And if I don't try the other avenue, I will never know if she could possibly improve and be even better down this avenue.

    It kills me to see the regression.....but I am keeping positive and I'm going to give her the time she needs to get her body back in order. If I don't see results change, I can go back to the other diet.

    I am in the middle of transition right now, getting the fat intake down. I think my next feed run will be the Wellsolve L/S instead of the W/C now, since it doesn't list the sugar/starch on the label for some reason. I want the NSC as low as possible. I can add timothy pellets too. The Nutrena feeds I listed before are higher in NSC's. I am increasing her Vit E to 4000iU, adding 5000mg Mag Ox and 1mg Selenium and double her ALCAR dose. I think this would keep her within safe limits. This started today. We will see, keep your fingers crossed.
    You can further decrease NSC by replacing some of her hay with beet pulp. Rinse the dry shreds until water runs clear, then soak, drain, if water is still brown, rinse, then feed. That will bring NSC of beet pulp down as low as 5%. If you replace 4 lbs of hay with this, or some of the feeds, your a step ahead in lowering the intake of sugar/ starch, still give calories, but safely. Maybe better than any commercial feed. Dr.K says no Purina feed is below 10%ESC+ starch. If you can't make it to the barn every day, you can make a batch of beets and freeze it portioned. Maybe keep it in a cooler until feeding at the barn. Or have the portions for time emergencies.
         
        11-12-2013, 11:25 PM
      #33
    Started
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by deserthorsewoman    
    You can further decrease NSC by replacing some of her hay with beet pulp. Rinse the dry shreds until water runs clear, then soak, drain, if water is still brown, rinse, then feed. That will bring NSC of beet pulp down as low as 5%. If you replace 4 lbs of hay with this, or some of the feeds, your a step ahead in lowering the intake of sugar/ starch, still give calories, but safely. Maybe better than any commercial feed. Dr.K says no Purina feed is below 10%ESC+ starch. If you can't make it to the barn every day, you can make a batch of beets and freeze it portioned. Maybe keep it in a cooler until feeding at the barn. Or have the portions for time emergencies.
    Thanks Desert. I picked up the Wellsolve L/S today at 11% NSC, some timothy pellets and some beet pulp. I later learned that Triple Crown Lite is 9.6% NSC. So, once I use up what I have, I may switch over to that.

    Snickers wasn't a huge fan of the beet pulp today, Belle loved it! So, we will play around a little with stuff. Good news is the turn around with the ALCAR diet only is supposed to take two weeks for improvement....so, we will see.
         
        11-12-2013, 11:28 PM
      #34
    Started
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by spirit88    
    No I hadn't followed pervious thread but will look it up tomorrow and read it sounds like a heck of a journey. My horse is IR and was lamininatic still not 100 percent sound....if you can avoid the IR that would be a plus.

    This has been quite the year for me with my boy and his issues....iv learned a lot about diet and NSC levels. My horse has to be under or at 10 percent NSC or laminitis issues rear their ugly head. TC senoir caused him laminitis issues so had to ditch that and fast I thought it would be safe.

    I will for sure be keeping up on this and will be reading about it on your pervious thread. ...to cold to be outside so what the heck lots of computer time.
    It HAS and STILL IS a journey...lol. Believe me, I am only doing this change to see how it does with her to prevent something like IR since she is impossible to get weight off of.

    So glad you are having progress with your guy. So weird how they are all different and what can set each one off.

    Here is the journal I had on Snickers....
    Snickers, the noodle-legged pinto
         
        11-13-2013, 09:09 PM
      #35
    Started
    Just a brief note.....

    Snickers is officially 'crabby'. Yesterday, while I was doing a video for the Dr. Kellon group, I was leading her and asked her to trot along side of me.....she nipped at my arm! She has NEVER shown any type of behavior like this.....EVER!! Today, she seemed just in a constant bad mood. It is all about me scratching her sides and tummy. I lunged her and it is obvious that that is, once again, impossible. :(
         
        11-13-2013, 09:47 PM
      #36
    Trained
    How far down are you with the fat content now, all the way?
    And what is the" recipe" for now, from the group? I keep thinking about the" it gets worse before it gets better" and really hope that this is the case here....
    Did they mention the Stabul 1?
         
        11-13-2013, 10:07 PM
      #37
    Started
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by deserthorsewoman    
    How far down are you with the fat content now, all the way?
    And what is the" recipe" for now, from the group? I keep thinking about the" it gets worse before it gets better" and really hope that this is the case here....
    Did they mention the Stabul 1?
    Saw the Stabul....closest dealer to me is San Jose. As of yesterday, she is off all fat. So freaking depressing. I'm wondering if her body has to adjust more than the average since she was on the high fat diet and her body was using energy from the fat form??? I'm going to give it some time and see. I just submitted the video they asked for. Are you on the group? You will be able to see the part where she bites me. You can also see when I am backing her up, she kicks at her belly, like she does all the time now. Her tail is swishing around....she just seems unhappy. NOT at all like herself.
         
        11-13-2013, 10:15 PM
      #38
    Trained
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Oldhorselady    
    Saw the Stabul....closest dealer to me is San Jose. As of yesterday, she is off all fat. So freaking depressing. I'm wondering if her body has to adjust more than the average since she was on the high fat diet and her body was using energy from the fat form??? I'm going to give it some time and see. I just submitted the video they asked for. Are you on the group? You will be able to see the part where she bites me. You can also see when I am backing her up, she kicks at her belly, like she does all the time now. Her tail is swishing around....she just seems unhappy. NOT at all like herself.
    Supposedly Tractor Supply can order it, the maker had a contact with them. I went to my desire and asked how many customers they have who buy low NSC feed. When they said there were quite a few, I showed them the website and now they're looking into it, via the dealer in San Jose. It says on the website that you should talk to your favorite feed store.

    It sounds like she is really uncomfortable now.
    I'm not on the group, I'm doing everything with my cell, so these groups are a pain to navigate in for me.
         
        11-13-2013, 10:42 PM
      #39
    Started
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by deserthorsewoman    
    Supposedly Tractor Supply can order it, the maker had a contact with them. I went to my desire and asked how many customers they have who buy low NSC feed. When they said there were quite a few, I showed them the website and now they're looking into it, via the dealer in San Jose. It says on the website that you should talk to your favorite feed store.

    It sounds like she is really uncomfortable now.
    I'm not on the group, I'm doing everything with my cell, so these groups are a pain to navigate in for me.
    I'll look into the Stabul again....

    Here is the video.....
         
        11-13-2013, 11:26 PM
      #40
    Trained
    Yup, tail dangling, sorry, wobbly steps, especially trotting. Da.....ed...
         

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