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OTTB Won't Gain Weight

13K views 44 replies 14 participants last post by  Appyt 
#1 ·
So my guy has been at my barn for a month now, and we can't get weight on him. He's getting about 8-9 quarts of Mana Pro Sweet 10 High Fat w/ beet pulp, weight builder, a flake of alfalfa am and pm, and I keep coastal in his stall at all times for him to eat while he's in there. He's in a paddock most of the day and night, though, and it's all dirt...no grass or hay. He's the only skinny horse in the barn. His butt is continuing to loose fat too. He's 2 months off the track.
I can't add corn oil or wet beet pulp as he won't eat anything wet (he's picky that way). I'm not working him right now as I'm still giving him time to settle in from coming off the track. (he ran his last race march 4). I've considered moving him to a barn w/ grass pasture for him to stay out in, but we may be moving across the state very soon and I don't want to put him through undue stress. If we don't move, then I'll find another barn. If we do, I have one in mind that I'll look at on Friday that seems like a good prospect.
Does anyone have any additional suggestions? I've researched an ulcer but his only "symptom" is lack of weight gain. Can anyone help? My BO's only advice is to start working him. She has a lot of experience w/ OTTBs and has known quite a few that just won't keep weight on unless they're being worked. I'm at my witts end. a month of breaking the bank of feed and no weight gain to show for it. *sigh*
 
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#2 ·
A month is really not that long in the scheme of things with weight gain. The first thing that pops out at me is that he is in the paddock most of the day and night and has no forage (from your description). That would be the first change I would make. Find a way to provide free choice hay of good quality to him 24/7 and you'll be amazed at the turn around that he will likely make.
 
#6 ·
A month is really not that long in the scheme of things with weight gain. The first thing that pops out at me is that he is in the paddock most of the day and night and has no forage (from your description). That would be the first change I would make. Find a way to provide free choice hay of good quality to him 24/7 and you'll be amazed at the turn around that he will likely make.
Yes, I agree.

Annie had that same problem when she came off the track. And still its dificult. Racehorses. Hmph, its like consistenly putting weight on a skeleton. I currently have Annie on Two butter-tubs of Omolene 200 twice a day with Biotin, Weight Builder, Beet Pulp, Super 14, and Sweet Feed. She gets five flakes of Alfalfa a day(We get super dense stuff) and still open range on grass for nearly twelve hours a day. Trust me. Racehorses are difficult.
 
#3 ·
I'm having problems too with my OTTB and weight, so let me just share what I've learned.

First thing, up his hay. Coastal is good for munching, but has ZERO nutritional value...its like eating white bread all of the time. Straight alfalfa might make him hot, so try getting some T&A or O&A. My guy is on 5 flakes a day and doing zilch, I wish he could be on like 6 but I don't have the money for that. I'd say to start with, try for at least 4 flakes a day.

Take him off the sweet feed. 8-9 quarts is like 10 pounds or something. Thats probably contributing to any gastric problems he may have. Go for something high in fat and fiber to aid in digestion. Senior feeds are really good for this. I've heard Purina Horse Chow 100 is an excellent feed as well. It also has some "hay extender" qualities, so if you can't get good quality hay or pasture, you can give him some of that and it will balance out. You can also consider adding something like stabilized rice bran in addition to the beet pulp.

Some horses don't show any outward signs of ulcers. I'd have him scoped anyway, or at least pick up a couple of syringes of Ulcer Gaurd, one syringe lasts you two days, so pick up like 3 and give them to him for a week, and see if there are any changes.

Also look at his stall and turn out habits. Does he come in really sweaty? When he's in, does he pace, circle, seem really fidgety? What about his poop? Is it loose, firm, wet, dry? How are his gut sounds? These can be signs of different forms of gastric distress.

If he seems up to it, I would go ahead and start working him. Even hand walking for 20 minutes up and down the road and around the yard would help if you don't have a place to lunge him, or he doesn't know how to lunge.
 
#4 ·
Just give him time.

That said, sweet feed isn't the best for thoroughbreds IME. The high starch and sugar in most sweet feeds and even most feed pellets tends to make thoroughbreds hyperactive, which makes them burn more calories, which makes them need more feed. It's a bad cycle.

Instead of the sweet feed, I'd have him on a low starch or "lite" feed, or a ration balancer. A probiotic to help him process his food might not be a bad idea too. Something like Fastrack or Missing Link.

For added fat, use rice bran. I find that it works better than "weight builders", plus it gives the horse a shinier coat and helps foot growth. Horsetech.com can do a custom blend. You want 4-8 oz of flax a day. You have have them add probiotics to aid in digestion, some extra b-vitamims for calming, and anything else you might want thrown in. Their prices include shipping.

Make sure he has lots of turn out, at least 8-10 hours a day. He needs pasture time to mentally decompress and run off any excess energy.

I have dealt with a few thin TBs and they all did wonderfully once I removed grain/sweet feed or feed pellets from their diet.
 
#5 ·
Coastal Bermuda hay DOES have good nutritional value, if you buy it from a good producer. All we feed is different varieties of Bermuda grass hay and we have great luck. I don't have to feed hardly any "feed" or extras to keep weight on even my hardest keepers. They all have great feet, coats, and overall health as well.
 
#10 ·
Coastal Bermuda hay DOES have good nutritional value, if you buy it from a good producer. All we feed is different varieties of Bermuda grass hay and we have great luck. I don't have to feed hardly any "feed" or extras to keep weight on even my hardest keepers. They all have great feet, coats, and overall health as well.
Totally agree. My mare has bermuda 24/7 and gets 2c A&M+1c Stabilized rice bran+1/2 scoop Accell and she is in great condition/weight being trail ridden barefoot 6+ days a week.

I highly recomend Stabilized rice bran (just did on another thread today, lol) More info about it here: Natural Glo - Stabilized Rice Bran

And as others have said you're going to need more time to see improvement. Since you're noticing a drop in weight though I would suggest adding the SRB.
 
#7 ·
What has worked wonders on our TB is free choice grass hay (actually this last batch has a bit of alfalfa mixed in with it), rice bran and strategy.
I do agree that you are feeding an excessive amount of sweet feed. You are wasting your money, imo, as you are not going to see the weight gain you want and are feeding far more than you would need to were you to switch to a higher quality feed (which would make the price difference a wash, if not save you some $$$).
I've had success using quality hay, beet pulp and alfalfa pellets as well.
 
#9 ·
We have a OTTB who has always had problems with her weight. Even when she was getting fed 3 times a day and a good bit at that, she would maintain and sometimes even lose weight. They only thing that has made her gain weight and keep it is 24/7 turn out in good grass. All the weight builders in the world wont do what good grass can.
 
#11 ·
Maybe I should be more specific---Florida bermuda/coastal hay is junk. Just like our grass (where we have it) there's little nutrition to it. Our soil is actually sand, so pretty much everything has a tough time growing and if it does, its not very nice, unless you fertilize and chemically treat the heck out of it.

Totally forgot to ask, where in FL are you located devildog?
 
#12 ·
Maybe I should be more specific---Florida bermuda/coastal hay is junk. Just like our grass (where we have it) there's little nutrition to it. Our soil is actually sand, so pretty much everything has a tough time growing and if it does, its not very nice, unless you fertilize and chemically treat the heck out of it.

Totally forgot to ask, where are you located devildog?
Ahh... well that makes sence! Nothing from nothing leaves nothing!
 
#13 ·
Honestly, I think this:
a flake of alfalfa am and pm, and I keep coastal in his stall at all times for him to eat while he's in there. He's in a paddock most of the day and night, though, and it's all dirt...no grass or hay.
is the key issue. Dumping a ridiculous amount of grain/sweet feed into him does not make up for the fact that he is,essentially, starving. If he is out in the paddock "most of the day and night", what good does having hay in his stall do him? It's little wonder he would continue to lose weight.
 
#14 ·
Honestly, I think this:


is the key issue. Dumping a ridiculous amount of grain/sweet feed into him does not make up for the fact that he is,essentially, starving. If he is out in the paddock "most of the day and night", what good does having hay in his stall do him? It's little wonder he would continue to lose weight.
Yup, all the feed in the world won't do any good if he can't eat it. That also brings up another point (forgive me if someone has already said this, I havn't read all the replys) Have his teeth been checked recently?
 
#18 ·
I had a skinny hard keeper OTTB until I finally found a barn that was generous with hay and gave them 4 hours a day access to good grass. Now I have a fat TB who only requires a minimum amount of low starch grain. I think it's more the grass than the hay, but no doubt in my mind, forage is the key.
 
#21 ·
This was my horse's diet last year.

Morning - 2 flakes hay
4 quarts grain (Blue Seal Performance LS (low starch) )
Fat supplement (tried about 8 different ones with no results)

Midday Snack
5 lbs alfalfa hay cubes
2 pounds rice bran
3 lbs beet pulp
(I wet it all up and let is soak into a nice mushy mash. He gobbled it up like a piggy.)

Dinner - Same as morning.

With this food, my horse remained a typical ribby TB.

Over the winter I found a place that feeds free choice hay. I decided to give it a try, ditched everything except the grain and the SmartGain fat supplement that ended up being the one that actually seemed to work. Despite a VERY cold winter, he gained about 200 lbs.

We left that place in April and now he's at a barn with not free choice, but amply hay, and very lush grass that they have access to about 4 hours a day. They didn't feed Blue Seal, so we switched a Poulin equivalent, Equi-Pro Performax. So now his diet is:

2 lbs Poulin morning and night, SmartGain supplement, hay & grass. The grass was the real key for him. Within 2 weeks of being there, we started seeing more weight gain. He's almost to where I'm going to ask to cut back on his grain a little. I didn't think that would ever happen.

Without the availability of grass, maybe you can substitute soaked alfalfa hay cubes? I'm thinking that would be the closest equivalent to grass. I do agree with others that sweet feed can overstoke a TB's furnace and they end up burning off calories standing still. Hope that helps.
 
#22 · (Edited)
Where are you boarding? I'm right outside Plant City in Dover. Ice is also on a dry lot :/

ETA: Looking at your pictures, I've seen that stall before haha...are you at Hidden Meadows?

When I'm all finished working out his new diet plan, here's what it will look like:

AM:
-3 flakes T&A
-3/4 scoop (about 2 1/2 pounds) Manna Senior
-1/4 scoop Max E Glo (stabilized rice bran)

PM:
-2 flakes T&A
-3/4 scoop Manna Senior
-1/4 scoop Max E Glo

I might add in some alfalfa cubes, but he's doing really well on the extra flake, so if I can add in the extra work and he keeps well enough, I won't push it!

Switch over to whatever feed you choose gradually over about a week, mixing in 3/4 sweet feed, 1/4 new feed, then 1/2 and 1/2, and so on. Anything thats high in fat, and maybe if you're working him a lot, some protien for stamina and to help him build muscle.
 
#26 ·
I would look for a new boarding stable that feeds hay while the horses are truned out, or provides a private paddock or run for turn out. Horses should not go more than 2-3 hours without hay in front of them. Going longer can cause ulcers and behavioral issues.

I like to feed hay at least three times a day. Some grass hay for "lunch" to give them something to munch on if you're feeding alfalfa or alfalfa mix for morning and night feeding.
 
#28 ·
In our area, thats not practical. I don't know anywhere around our area that has facilities AND provides grass/round bales, and I've been looking since I bought Ice! Round bales way too expensive to come by in the summer, and hay is also pretty costly. My board shot up a whopping 75 dollars just because I added an extra 1 flake onto his meal!
 
#27 ·
I'd say go with whatever your barn goes with. If they feed three times a day, break everything up into 3 daily feedings. Where I'm at we do twice a day feeding, so that's what I've broken it up into. I think its better to just go with whats already in place, rather than request something out of the normal routine, and not have it done 100% of the time.

What are your plans for your guy? Unless he's going to be a professional show horse or a work horse, he won't be classified as "heavy" work, but if you're going to put him through professional training, it might be "medium". Most trail horses, weekend show horses, etc do well on a "light work" feed regimen. That should help as far as feeding breaks down.

I can't help you on nutrition, I know just about nothing, just what I've picked up from here!
 
#29 ·
As far as plans for him, I honestly don't know. I'd like to be able to pleasure ride, but beyond that I'm not sure. I'd also like to get into dressage. I had a taste of it while in the Pony Club as a teen, and loved it. Beyond that, see what he's good at and go as far as we can go together. If that's showing...great! If it's pleasure, I'm happy with that too.
 
#32 ·
Bear in mind that racehorses have a daily calorie intake of around 35,000 which usually drops sharply when they come off the track, causing rapid weight loss.

When I take a TB off the track I usually like to ease them gradually off the high grain high energy diet so that their digestive system can adjust. Forage is very very important as this can provide some of the bulk without the calories and the weight loss will not be as sharp. Usually I like to ease them back to a very basic diet of mostly hay and grass (plenty of it and high quality) and allow them at least a few months to work out any nasty additives that may have been in their food, similar to a detox for humans! (I often turn them out for this period to give them a break after track life before I do anything with them, but that's just me).

Then I begin introducing more food according to how I like to feed and what I have planned for their work schedule. I aim for around 25,000 calories although this will vary from horse to horse and how much work you plan to use them for. Avoid sweet feeds but you need to use a quality (around 15%) protein feed and things like rice bran and beet pulp can help with weight gain without making them too fizzy. Always have plenty of hay/grass available for a horse that is struggling to gain weight as it keeps their digestive system active by constantly processing all that fibre! Feeding three times a day helps encourage a healthy metabolism also.

Finally, I agree with your BO in that work will help put conditioning on him. Racehorses are used to a very heavy work schedule and one of the other reasons they lose weight when they come off the track can be attributed to muscle loss. TB's do well in hard work, they thrive! Even if you only do a little trail riding and some dressage, your boy will enjoy regular, hard workouts.

Good luck!
 
#34 ·
  • Thanks for all the help, y'all!
    So, the general consensus is: I need to change his grain and cut it back, and up his forrage and add flax. I forgot to mention that he's also on rice bran pellets...I'd like to cintinue these. How will that impact the flax? What feed? A Sr? Something with more protein? Should I keep him on the alfalfa? I don't want to take him totally off the sweet b/c he'll actually eat it. He came to me on Seminole Plantation 10 All Grain and he hated it. Plus, it only had 4% fat. I moved him to to Manna Pro Sweet 10 High Fat w/ Beet Pulp (I don't see it on the Manna Pro site...possibly a custom blend for my dealer?). It has 10% fat, with 10% protein, and beet pulp pellets in it. He doesn't like wet food, so I can't get him to eat bran mashes or soaked beet pulp (which is what I used for my Hanno 7 years ago that I rescued...got weight on him quickly).
    Should I switch him to this? Manna Pro Products, LLC This has high protein, high fiber, but has less fat..6% vs. the 10% he's on now.
    I also am going to keep him in his stall during the day, w/ coastal hay available to him and a flake of alfalfa at lunch (at least, that's what I did today). Does this sound good? 3 flakes of Alfalfa a day?
 
#35 ·
  • Thanks for all the help, y'all!
    So, the general consensus is: I need to change his grain and cut it back, and up his forrage and add flax. I forgot to mention that he's also on rice bran pellets...I'd like to cintinue these. How will that impact the flax? What feed? A Sr? Something with more protein? Should I keep him on the alfalfa? I don't want to take him totally off the sweet b/c he'll actually eat it. He came to me on Seminole Plantation 10 All Grain and he hated it. Plus, it only had 4% fat. I moved him to to Manna Pro Sweet 10 High Fat w/ Beet Pulp (I don't see it on the Manna Pro site...possibly a custom blend for my dealer?). It has 10% fat, with 10% protein, and beet pulp pellets in it. He doesn't like wet food, so I can't get him to eat bran mashes or soaked beet pulp (which is what I used for my Hanno 7 years ago that I rescued...got weight on him quickly).
    Should I switch him to this? Manna Pro Products, LLC This has high protein, high fiber, but has less fat..6% vs. the 10% he's on now.
    I also am going to keep him in his stall during the day, w/ coastal hay available to him and a flake of alfalfa at lunch (at least, that's what I did today). Does this sound good? 3 flakes of Alfalfa a day?
I've found that although "safe" (aka low starch) foods are okay for some horses to eat, they're made for the ones who get fat on air. Not OTTBs! You DEFINITELY want to get something high in fat, high in fiber, and high in protein, in that order....so if it meets the first two but not the third, that's ok. I've heard some good things about Purina Ultium, which they carry at Antioch Feed and Supply (if thats where you guys get your feed from). You can probably add some sweet feed for taste, but I would not make it his main source of hard feed. But again, you could just try using whatever senior feed you guys currently use and save yourself the trouble of having to buy something yourself.

I would see how he does on the extra alfalfa, but be prepared to up it more if he doesn't gain the weight totally. Also keep in mind all that alfalfa will make him pee a lot, and might make him a little loopy.How much of the rice bran is he on now? 1 to 1 1/2 lb daily should be more than enough to be putting weight on him.
 
#36 ·
Well, I'm partial boarding so I'm buying his feed myself. Thus, trying something new isn't an issue. I have full control over his feed. I've been buying at The Hay Exchange on 92.

Yea, that's kind of why I have him on what he's on...it's high in all 3. But, it has the blasted molasses in it. *sigh*

He's getting MaxEGlo 1/4 scoop AM and 1/4 scoop PM I just started it a week ago.
 
#37 ·
I would wait to see if he puts on wait with the Max E Glo before adding in anything extra like flax seed. I would just call The Hay Exchange and ask, most places around here carry Purina and Manna Pro products so you should be alright. As a general rule, I would say get a performance feed, as long as it doesn't have oats and molasses in it, you won't be picking up "hot" calories. Look for the main ingredient to be alfalfa meal or something like that.

Is the 1/4 scoop like 1/4 of a 3 quart scoop? That might actually be too much, depending on what your quarter looks like....I'm feeding Ice 1/2 pound at each feeding, so my mark is under the 1 quart line.
 
#39 ·
No matter how much feed you give him and how much forrage you give him, nothing is going to come of it if he has digestive issues and ulcers.

Majority of TB's lead highly stressed lives while on the track, and end up with digestive issues. I would highly suggest that you get him scoped by your Vet, in both his stomache and his GI tract to ensure that you aren't dealing with Ulcers.

And I would look into a digestive aid, that has Probiotics and Prebiotics to help your horses digestive system to absorb all the nutrients needed to keep him healthy weight wise.

You can stuff all the feed down his throat all you want, but you're flushing your money down the toilet if your horse has digestive issues, because all that feed will go in and out without your horse absorbing any of the importancies.

Horses are designed to be continuos grazers, that is who they are. That is how their systems are set up - to have forrage in their stomaches 24/7. If they are left for the majority of the day with no food in their tummies, they will end up with digestive issues - because their stomach's lining isn't being protected from the acids.

So for a horse that only gets a little amount of hay in the A.M and a little amount in the P.M - is not sufficient enough for your horses health, his stomach, nor his digestive system.

I would look at SmartPak's suppliments to help your horses digestive system, such as Smart Digest Ultra, and Smart Gut.

If the barn that you are currently at cannot provide your horse with the forrage needed to ensure digestive health and productivity - I would move.
 
#40 ·
I've found that although "safe" (aka low starch) foods are okay for some horses to eat, they're made for the ones who get fat on air. Not OTTBs! You DEFINITELY want to get something high in fat, high in fiber, and high in protein, in that order....so if it meets the first two but not the third, that's ok. I've heard some good things about Purina Ultium, which they carry at Antioch Feed and Supply (if thats where you guys get your feed from). You can probably add some sweet feed for taste, but I would not make it his main source of hard feed. But again, you could just try using whatever senior feed you guys currently use and save yourself the trouble of having to buy something yourself.
Low starch does not equal low fat. Feeds such as Copra are extremely high in fat and yet are low in starch, sugar and NSC's.

The fact is, horses are not designed to process large amounts of starch and sugar - Bad things happen when they are made to. Horses are designed to be constantly taking in forage - bad thigns happen when they can't.

It has always boggled my mind that the majority of horses in the US aren't on grass, ever. I have never met a single person who keeps a horse off grass here in AUS, and it is rare to find anyone who has their horse stalled any more than just nights. My own horses are on grass 24/7.
 
#41 ·
In the rural areas, we definitely like grass. Ice came from a 24/7 grass situation, and up in Ocala there are acres and acres of grass fields. Or there used to be...I haven't been up through there since the drought got really bad though. A lot of people here on HF in the Midwest have 24/7 grass situations.The US though is mostly suburban area, where grass spots bigger than your car are hard to come by.

However, I will agree that we like our barns. I have no idea why.
 
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