Pref Hay & Grain - Page 3

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Pref Hay & Grain

This is a discussion on Pref Hay & Grain within the Horse Nutrition forums, part of the Horse Health category

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    11-19-2010, 07:29 PM
Green Broke
I know exactly what you mean, alfabeet is pelleted alfalfa and sugarbeet mixed. It is perfectly healthy as a hay replacement. Regularly used by vet hospitals because it is fibre but it is highly palletable. Reccomended by vets as a hay replacement for old ponies with no teeth and reccomended by the veteran horse society. Reccomended by the lami trust as a bulk feed for ponies who can't go out on grass due to lammi.

I do know one 51 yearold pony who for the last 10 years has been unable to eat anything if it wasnt a mush. He was fed pretty much only alfabeet or grass pellets soaked into a mush, no hay as he couldnt chew it, no haylege for the same reason. He continued to be a brilliant family friend and taugh 6 generations of the same family to ride. Last time I saw him last year he was still doing leadrein PC.

This is alfabeet:
Alfa Beet - Dengie Horse Feeds
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    11-19-2010, 07:32 PM
But see the research shows that it can't replace the long stem fiber that is needed to keep the gut healthy... I am not saying it isn't done just that there are healthier options
    11-19-2010, 07:34 PM
Green Broke
And how exactly would you reccomend that a pony with no teeth get said long stem fibre?
That 50 yearold has done without it for the last 10 years and my 12.2hh pony has done without it for the last 5 or so years with no negative effects.

Fibre is fibre!
    11-19-2010, 07:52 PM
Faye honestly I am not argueing to argue a horse needs the long stem fiber for thier digestive health

FIBRE FOR HORSES - Equiworld -Horse and Pony Informationon the internet- Text Only

Here is the complete google search LOL
equine long stem fiber - Google Search

Long Stem vs Processed Forages - long-stem hay (bale hay) should be at least 50% of the total forage consumed per day; processed hay (pellets or cubes) should not exceed more than 50% of the total forage consumed/day; long stem fiber promotes the gut to contract with more vigor thus promoting gut integrity and long-stem hay requires more water intake by the horse than processed hay; an increase in water intake promotes gut integrity.

    11-19-2010, 08:12 PM
Green Broke
Ho hum, so you havent yet answered my question, if long stem fibre is soo important for horses then how do you propose I get it into a pony with no teeth?

And why is my 30 yearold no teeth pony who has lived on a diet of alfabeet, grass cubesand premixed feeds, perfectly healthy, perfectly happy and not had a single case of colic since we started him on this diet when he used to have regular bouts of colic despite bing on a 90% grass and haylege diet.

I also think that before you link to articles you need to read them correctly.
This article:
FIBRE FOR HORSES - Equiworld -Horse and Pony Informationon the internet- Text Only
Actualy says alfalfa is better nutritionaly and only mentions long stem fibe is in relation to the horses insinctual need to forage and chew. This is more a mental requirement and not a physical one.

I'm not going to bother signing up to a rediculas amount of sites in order to read the articles you want me to. However one thing I will say is that I think you are taking things to extremes and very obviously can't accept any other view then yours.

I read chemical engineering at university, so don't try to baffle me with science it won't work!
    11-19-2010, 08:17 PM
FAye I am not saying they CAN'T live of of pellets or other stuff just that it is healthier for them to have the long stem fiber... you are the one having trouble NOT ME LOL
    11-19-2010, 08:20 PM
And NO WHERE did I say alfalfa wasn't good for horses I said some horses have a reaction to it....
    11-19-2010, 08:21 PM
Green Broke
Having read that article again i'm not entirely sure why you have chosen it to illustrate your point? It does nothing to support your argument, infact several of the points it makes go directly against your argument?

Care to explain your reasoning for that perticular article?
    11-19-2010, 08:24 PM
Originally Posted by faye    
Having read that article again i'm not entirely sure why you have chosen it to illustrate your point? It does nothing to support your argument, infact several of the points it makes go directly against your argument?

Care to explain your reasoning for that perticular article?
Here you go : when it is discussing FORAGES IE: hay and pasture
Simply because fibre is not easily digested by the horse does not mean that is shouldn’t be included in the diet. On the contrary, fibre is a very important component of the horse’s diet. This is due to the nature of the digestive tract of the horse. Over history horses’ digestive systems have adapted to support grazing for many hours of the day. Horses have an enlarged cecum and large intestine (large and small colon) which act as large fermentation vats for the microbial organisms living there. If fibre is not provided for these organisms they can die off and release toxins into the horse
    11-19-2010, 08:29 PM
Green Broke
Precisely my point, it says FIBRE, no where does it make the destinction or even hint at the difference between longstem and shortstem fibre.

I personaly do not see the difference fibre is fibre and we all know that fibre should make up the majority of any horses diet. That fact I am not argueing. What I am arguing is that there is no difference between hay cubes and hay other then the fact that you can make one into a mush and you can't the other one.

What I'm not seeing in that article is it saying anywhere that grass cubes or processd hay cubes are not as good as hay.

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