Using "Remission"...any tips? Multiple questions...
 
 

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Using "Remission"...any tips? Multiple questions...

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  • Using remission for a nervous horse

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    08-06-2013, 11:40 PM
  #1
Super Moderator
Using "Remission"...any tips? Multiple questions...

I just ordered a tub of Remission for Miss Lacey based on the fact that she's IR [never tested but shows all the signs - fat pads, cresty neck, the whole deal, so my vet feels that we should just treat her as an IR horse and skip the $$+worry in getting her tested...especially at her age] and I figure that it might be useful to try. Basically to see how she does, and if it really helps then I'll buy more, but if it doesn't - no harm, no foul.

Anyway, my main question is based on the feeding instructions: "One ounce (2 tbsp) per day per 1,000 lbs of body weight until symptoms subside. Then 1/2 ounce (1 tbsp) per 1,000 lbs of body weight per day."

I assume "symptoms" mean founder/laminitis, right? So since she's not currently foundering [she's actually at a GREAT weight for her right now - still has the back fat pads+cresty neck, but that's basically normal for her during the summer. She's probably a 5.5 otherwise, going off the Henneke scale - usually it's a struggle to get her down into 6-land!] I would feed her 1 tbsp per day, right?

Or, since she has the fat pads and all that, do I feed her 2 tbsp until...when?

Another thing - she gets ACV in her evening feeding, I assume it would be better to feed this in the morning when she doesn't get ACV?
In the morning, she does get her grazing muzzle on for the day so her stomach stays relatively empty all day [she eats fine through the muzzle, it's just been so hot that she stays in the shed and she hasn't quite mastered eating hay through the muzzle ] - still ok?


Also, the other really important question: nothing about this stuff is going to be inflammatory, right? I assume not, since founder is inflammatory...but I have to ask! I don't want to mess up the good thing I have going with her eyes. We jusssst got out of the "1 year since an ERU episode" danger-window and I'm finally getting to breathe a little! Haha

Here's a link to the stuff, in case that would be helpful: http://www.horse.com/item/animed-remission/BWA63/


Thanks a bunch!! This horse is going to live FOREVER.
     
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    08-06-2013, 11:46 PM
  #2
Green Broke
I can't help you a ton, but I can say we use remission for an IR risk older mare who has fat patches and signs similar to Lacey but has never been tested. We started off on one tablespoon a day. When we feed Remission to actively foundering ponies, we do two tablespoons. I too assumed that the double dose was for horses who were actively foundering. The one tablespoon for our IR horse seems to be sufficient.

Also, as far as the ACV -- no experience from me there, but our IR mare has a muzzle put on right after she gets her Remission in the morning with no ill effect.

Also, Remission is not inflammatory.

I wouldn't worry. Lacey will outlive us all.
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    08-06-2013, 11:56 PM
  #3
Trained
I've used it on m blimp and it did reduce the crest and other upholstery.
Had him on maintenance, but a slight flare up required the "acute" dosage.
IR horses should have 10 g magnesium added, Remission full dose gives 6.
So I guess full dose won't hurt either way.
Start out slow, blimp didn't like it at first, which is pretty remarkable. ....for a horse with middle name vacuum cleaner...
ACV I'd put in the other portion, just to be safe....
Oh yeah, flaxseed....
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    08-07-2013, 12:29 AM
  #4
Super Moderator
Perfect! You guys are great. :)

That is very helpful to know about the magnesium. I have heard that magnesium can make #2 get "loose"...is that a 'risk' with Remission as well? Just so I don't worry if it happens! Haha

Sounds like Lacey is going to hate it. She's getting pickier as she ages, sneaky girl! I'll make some raspberry leaf water to soak the morning "half" of her ration balancer in, then add the Remission. I have never seen her turn down food when raspberry leaves are involved.

Flaxseed allll the way! She's actually been on 1/8C flax/day for about a year now and, after reading that article you posted today DHW, I'm wondering if that might be part of why her weight isn't worse right now! Ahead of the curve, aw yeah. [and here I was, feeding it for its anti-inflammatory benefits. Hah. Silly me. ]

Thanks a bunch!!
     
    08-07-2013, 02:06 AM
  #5
Trained
The loose #2 indicates the mg storage is full and you can go back to maintenance dose. Never had it with the Remission. But I upped the amount only recently10g), so it might show up sometime....
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    08-07-2013, 08:04 AM
  #6
Green Broke
I have two horses that have been formally diagnosed with metabolic issues and third horse whose blood tests keep coming back normal but this is the second year he has shown early warning signs of insulin issues.

Remission doesn't even phase one of the already IR horses - that horse is on a prescription herbal compound that is, indeed, keeping his insulin down.

Remission IS working on the other formally diagnosed horse and is also working on the "suspected" horse.

Not only that but the "suspected" horse has terrible environmental allergies. After about 4 weeks on Remission, it occurred to me he was not having his usual spring allergy problems; to-date I have not had to feed him his allergy herbs - just amazing.

Plus, his A.D.D. Personality has quieted down so much, the vet thought he was sick when he got his physical in June

To answer your questions:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wallaby    
I just ordered a tub of Remission for Miss Lacey based on the fact that she's IR [never tested but shows all the signs - fat pads, cresty neck, the whole deal, so my vet feels that we should just treat her as an IR horse and skip the $$+worry in getting her tested...especially at her age] and I figure that it might be useful to try. Basically to see how she does, and if it really helps then I'll buy more, but if it doesn't - no harm, no foul.True, you're not out anything but a little bit of money.

Anyway, my main question is based on the feeding instructions: "One ounce (2 tbsp) per day per 1,000 lbs of body weight until symptoms subside. Then 1/2 ounce (1 tbsp) per 1,000 lbs of body weight per day."I have been feeding the loading dose all along. The formally diagnosed horse's neck is softer and smaller than it's been in several years (he was diagnosed in 2007).

The "suspected" horse never did have a cresty neck but it was very hard, he had "shoulder pads" and his sheath was huge. While none of those things have disappeared, they have reduced by about 40%, his environmental allergies are under control, and his personality has improved to where the #2 horse now allows him to do the Itchy Thing, once in awhile.

I assume "symptoms" mean founder/laminitis, right? Not always. Cresty neck, puffy sheath, puffiness over the eyes, mattery eyes, "allergy runny nose". Sometimes even a change in disposition because the insulin is not surging up and down in them.

So since she's not currently foundering [she's actually at a GREAT weight for her right now - still has the back fat pads+cresty neck, but that's basically normal for her during the summer. She's probably a 5.5 otherwise, going off the Henneke scale - usually it's a struggle to get her down into 6-land!] I would feed her 1 tbsp per day, right?There should be a scoop in the container with markings for one tablespoon and one teaspoon.

I feed both horses two tablespoons daily; one in the AM, one in the PM.

Both of them have perfect manure.


Or, since she has the fat pads and all that, do I feed her 2 tbsp until...when?Based on what you and your vet have discussed, "until the snow flies"

I live in southern Middle Tennessee. Unless we're in a drought, we have green grass almost all year. I plan on keeping my two on 2 TBS daily until late Fall, then back it off to one TBS and probably give them December, January, and February off.

Another thing - she gets ACV in her evening feeding, I assume it would be better to feed this in the morning when she doesn't get ACV? What is the ACV for? Bug control? Does it really work? Two of my four horses used to get the runny bums from ACV so I stopped giving it to everyone.

If your mare develops the runny bums after starting her on the Remission, I would pull the ACV and see what happens. The combination of the two might cause loose stools.

Remission is a lot more important

In the morning, she does get her grazing muzzle on for the day so her stomach stays relatively empty all day [she eats fine through the muzzle, it's just been so hot that she stays in the shed and she hasn't quite mastered eating hay through the muzzle ] - still ok?Yes


Also, the other really important question: nothing about this stuff is going to be inflammatory, right? Not at all. If you read the label you will see there are actually some probiotics in it, which every horse in this day and age can benefit from

I assume not, since founder is inflammatory...but I have to ask! I don't want to mess up the good thing I have going with her eyes. We jusssst got out of the "1 year since an ERU episode" danger-window and I'm finally getting to breathe a little! Haha What is "ERU"?? Sorry

Here's a link to the stuff, in case that would be helpful: AniMed Remission - Horse.com


Thanks a bunch!! This horse is going to live FOREVER.
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    08-07-2013, 10:11 AM
  #7
Super Moderator
That's fascinating, DHW. I had no idea, thanks! :)

Thanks Walkin! Super informative answer there! :) To answer your questions:
Quote:
What is the ACV for? Bug control? Does it really work? Two of my four horses used to get the runny bums from ACV so I stopped giving it to everyone.

If your mare develops the runny bums after starting her on the Remission, I would pull the ACV and see what happens. The combination of the two might cause loose stools.

Remission is a lot more important
What is "ERU"?? Sorry

ERU = Equine Recurrent Uveitis/Moonblindness. Calling it ERU makes me feel a lot more "in control" of it than Moonblindness does! Haha Basically, thanks to the ERU her immune system is 'shot' [it's intrinsically an auto-immune disease and Lacey's is pretty advanced - she's about 95% blind], so I try to feed her a really immune-supporting diet.
She's been having a bit of a hard time this summer with the whole immune system dealio [under her mane, her neck is raw where she scratched her skin off while scratching a bug bite ] but I'm not sure how much of that is needing a medicated bath and just having a hard time. It has been 2 weeks since her last bath and she seems to do best with weekly baths in the summer - even though I hose her down everyday. Anyway! Haha

The ACV is for her eyes/immune system, mostly [for it's anti-inflammatory properties+immune boosting-"ness"]. Bug control is a mild side effect - I haven't seen it work great at fly control for her...but who knows how much I'm not seeing! Haha


     
    08-07-2013, 10:20 AM
  #8
Green Broke
I didn't read any of the other posts but I bought it and fed it to my foundered gelding.

My guy only foundered 2 degrees. No cresty neck or fat pockets besides behind his shoulders.

I noticed (maybe I'm haulicinating(sp?) but his feet started to crack worse then they already do when he was on it. I don't know what it was but when I stopped feeding it his feet looked alittle better.

I just got a 16 yr old haflinger with a mild cresty neck. No fat pads. Wish I didn't throw out the rest of the remission cause I would have put the haffie on it!
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    08-07-2013, 10:37 AM
  #9
Green Broke
Wallaby, not always but sometimes Neck Theadworms can be the cause of Moon Blindness.

You also mention her itchy neck and the raw spots.

It would not surprise me if she has neck threadworms ( and yes a poor immune system makes reaction to neck threadworms much worse.

They cannot be found in a fecal and more often than not, don't seem to appear in a skin culture but they're in the skin.

Parasite Information - Neck Threadworms <--please note where it talks about the microfiliae migrating into the eye(s) and causing ERU.

The Disturbing Truth About Neck Threadworms and Your Itchy Horse - The Horse's Back | The Horse's Back

Double dosing with pure Ivermectin at two week intervals gets rid of them. I have done the double-dosing twice but never had to do it at two week intervals.

Someone on this forum has but I can't remember who it was. Hopefully they will come in and comment.

Meaning, you might consider the double-dosing to bring the NTW's under control. My understanding is they can remain active in a horse for 15 years. I think someone posted a link to that study on a different forum - I need to check.

Anyway, while it won't reverse the ERU, I would ask the vet if he bothered to check the eyes in detail for Neck Threadworms. It's possible you might be able to stop the progression of blindness.

You've got a lot to deal with Hang in there

Thunder and lightening getting closer that means hughes.net is about to take a nap - errrrrr.
     
    08-07-2013, 11:07 AM
  #10
Trained
While the threadworms are definitely a possibility, I, personally, would rule out summer itch, the kind caused by gnats, first before bombarding her with so much chemicals.
You say she stays inside during the day, on her own. That might be because bugs bother her too much.
I would try to spray her, especially mane and tail, and belly, , early in the morning and watch if she goes out after that. For me, wiping Avon Skin so soft bath oil on crest and dock of tail did the trick, keeping my allergic horses comfy.
     

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