How to Handle Agressive/Abusive Handlers? - Page 4
 
 

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How to Handle Agressive/Abusive Handlers?

This is a discussion on How to Handle Agressive/Abusive Handlers? within the Horse Protection forums, part of the Horse Resources category

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        12-05-2011, 03:33 PM
      #31
    Green Broke
    It's really hard to tell what to do in this type of situation. I remember being young at our barn and seeing things that I wasn't sure of, but we had great trainers at my barn then. I usually tried to find the barn's trainer WHILE it was happening and she would always step in. People really took her seriously because she was the trainer, gave lessons etc and if she knew something was going down that wasn't right, she would usually drop what she was doing to get in the middle of it. Some stable owners are good at that too. Otherwise, finding another adult that people know/respect to help back you up and witness it is also good.
         
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        12-05-2011, 05:51 PM
      #32
    Yearling
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Alwaysbehind    
    Is it OK with you that a handler punish their horse for not standing still when they have been told to.

    What if the horse has been told to stand still while something is going on and the horse moving (after being told to stand still) ends up with the vet or farrier getting injured?

    Horse was told to stand still. Stepping on the cord and pulling it out of the wall is just the thing that happened when the horse did not stand still. I am guessing not what the horse was in trouble for as much as the not standing still.



    Yes! Totally agree.



    Not standing when told to stand is not really one minor thing.
    And since you do not know the horse or its history it is pretty impossible for you to judge if this was a nothing or a something.



    Read above.... the issue was most likely not standing still.....


    I understand if the horse is moving quite a bit but the horse took one little step back. Like maybe half a foot, if that.

    I'm somewhat lenient (sp?) with my horse moving. A little bit is acceptable, I know that it can get tiring standing still for a long time. What if he was just regaining balance? I see no harm in that.

    If a horse is dancing around then I understand a firm growl or maybe a quick jerk on the halter.
         
        12-05-2011, 07:34 PM
      #33
    Foal
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Arksly    
    I understand if the horse is moving quite a bit but the horse took one little step back. Like maybe half a foot, if that.

    I'm somewhat lenient (sp?) with my horse moving. A little bit is acceptable, I know that it can get tiring standing still for a long time. What if he was just regaining balance? I see no harm in that.

    If a horse is dancing around then I understand a firm growl or maybe a quick jerk on the halter.
    Yes, but have you ever dealt with a problem horse? For them to understand the boundaries you've laid out, you need to make it black and white for them. They don't understand "okay prance around a little bit" or "okay just this time". If I'm dealing with a horse who dances around in the cross ties, I nip it in the bud right away, meaning I expect him to stand still - even moreso than I expect from a horse who isn't an issue. If you allow the behaviour until they are really making a fuss, and THEN correct them, it is going to take a heck of a lot longer to get the behaviour under control, if at all. If it's made crystal clear from the start that they are not expected to move, period, and they are corrected for doing so and praised for standing still, they're going to get the point.

    This is the point I believe WG was trying to make. You don't know this horse's history - I'm not condoning what the handler did or how she dealt with it, I wasn't there. However if it is a horse who tends to misbehave in the crossties, then yes, if he moves at *all* I will correct it.
    franknbeans and Alwaysbehind like this.
         
        12-05-2011, 08:31 PM
      #34
    Trained
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Gremmy    
    Yes, but have you ever dealt with a problem horse? For them to understand the boundaries you've laid out, you need to make it black and white for them. They don't understand "okay prance around a little bit" or "okay just this time". If I'm dealing with a horse who dances around in the cross ties, I nip it in the bud right away, meaning I expect him to stand still - even moreso than I expect from a horse who isn't an issue. If you allow the behaviour until they are really making a fuss, and THEN correct them, it is going to take a heck of a lot longer to get the behaviour under control, if at all. If it's made crystal clear from the start that they are not expected to move, period, and they are corrected for doing so and praised for standing still, they're going to get the point.

    This is the point I believe WG was trying to make. You don't know this horse's history - I'm not condoning what the handler did or how she dealt with it, I wasn't there. However if it is a horse who tends to misbehave in the crossties, then yes, if he moves at *all* I will correct it.
    Exactly. If I tell mine to stand and "wait"-he had better not move. Period. It goes back to "give them and inch....." From my experience, if you let them take a little step...the next one is bigger.....then the next one.....
    You HAVE to correct the first movement. But then-I rarely use crossties altho I can if I want. I am sort of emphatic about standing. Mounted or not.

    MLS-with you all the way. My guys know that there are certain behaviors that will get my boot to their belly. They usually only do it once, if at all, and that is kicking. My foot is always there and available, and the behavior needs to be stopped NOW! Not in 5 seconds when you get the lead ready to smack them. Whips take too much thought, IMO. Never use them, unless just for the noise while lunging.
         
        12-05-2011, 09:51 PM
      #35
    Started
    This is exactly the thing I was trying to say in the beginning about a teenager seeing things differently than an adult.

    Her comment about " it only stepped back a half a foot or so",

    The OP says "she has no issue with her horse moving because it gets tired or needs to regain its balance, if its moving around a firm growl or a quick jerk on the halter."

    She looks at the handler telling the horse in no uncertain tems " don't move" Obviously the horse moved and pulled out the cord and then the handler made her corrections. In her opinion as stated above, she has no issue with her horse moving a bit. Well, maybe this handler did not want this horse to move at all.......

    Moving a half foot when supposed to stand still could cause a vet to get hurt, a farrier to be stepped on or any number of issues.
    I stand by my comments that the teenager saw what she saw, decided it did not agree by her standards of how she makes her horse mind and felt she needed to report the lady for abuse to the barn owner.
    When the OP's horse takes advantage of her letting it move a bit to regain balance or because its tired, and breaks her foot, or breaks the farriers foot , then she might understand that although the handler corrected her horse how she wanted to, the OP has no right to report a training correction that she knows nothing about, except it was mean to the poor horsie.
         
        12-06-2011, 12:52 AM
      #36
    Yearling
    I think some of the stuff I'm trying to say isn't being read the way that I originally meant it to.

    Let's move on. What would you suggest to an adult who is experiencing a moment with obvious abuse towards a horse?
         
        12-06-2011, 09:10 AM
      #37
    Banned
    The point is, the example you have given as obvious abuse is not obvious abuse.
         
        12-06-2011, 09:20 AM
      #38
    mls
    Trained
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by franknbeans    

    MLS-with you all the way. My guys know that there are certain behaviors that will get my boot to their belly. They usually only do it once, if at all, and that is kicking. My foot is always there and available, and the behavior needs to be stopped NOW! Not in 5 seconds when you get the lead ready to smack them. Whips take too much thought, IMO. Never use them, unless just for the noise while lunging.
    EXACTLY!

    By the time you have to run and grab a whip, the 3 second rule is long gone. The horse isn't going to know why s/he is being smacked. Not to mention, the whip HURTS and has the potential to cause an injury. My boot to the belly, might garner a grunt if I am lucky. It most certainly gets the attention and typically a contrite expression from said equine.

    Thank you FranknBeans!
         
        12-06-2011, 12:43 PM
      #39
    Showing
    Inform the BO or manager that this person's abusive behaviour sends a message that it is condoned in his/her operation.
         
        12-06-2011, 02:03 PM
      #40
    Started
    Except it wasn't abusive, it was a typical correction that most of us have made when our horse won't stand still.
    It seems the 'abuse" is only in the eyes of the young girl, whom herself admits that she lets her own horse move around "when it needs to get its balance or gets tired".
    mls likes this.
         

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