My essay on Horse Slaughter - Page 9 - The Horse Forum
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post #81 of 100 Old 03-21-2012, 09:10 AM
Green Broke
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I see that you are new here and may be feeling out the ropes as such. So far this thread has been very civil considering it is a rather contentious issue. I hope it can continue.

Seems to me that you have little knowledge of horses but solid knowledge of legislature. I wonder if you are not a horse person at all and are perhaps involved with one of the animal rights groups? Based on the following statements:

Originally Posted by Airspace1 View Post
So dont always believe pro slaughter ignorance.. they have one goal to breed, and slaughter for profits.
No horse person that has even a shred of knowledge would make the above statement. Breeding and raising a horse costs several thousand dollars at least and usually more. Selling a horse at auction will get you $500-$1000 so that would be a losing game.

Originally Posted by Airspace1 View Post

Fact is AQHA really cared they would support our horse bills HR2966 , and S1176 and our transporation bill HR7 which will ban double deckers totally HR7 is also support by the AAEP and the AVMA.
Interesting, what exactly ARE these bills? Genuine question, I simply don't know.

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post #82 of 100 Old 03-21-2012, 10:24 AM
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Here are some current (2012) actual statistics about the HSUS. After receiving so much bad PR about their real lack of spending on shelters and actual animals, they upped the support to less than 1% of their donations and less than 1/2 of 1% of their worth. (Before 2011, it was even less)

I think anyone who even considers giving to the HSUS, should reconsider and should donate horse feed, hay and pet food (not cash that can be siphoned off in salaries) to their local shelters.

Just remember that if you give $1000.00 to the HSUS that $990.00 of it will go to lobbyists and to the huge salaries of the officials. Less than $10.00 of it will actually go to animal shelters and to animal care.

Here are the REAL facts and REAL numbers of the HSUS.

The Humane Society of the United States (HSUS) | Animal Wrongs

What Does the Pet Sheltering Community Really Think About HSUS? | HumaneWatch

Always 'Google' any organization you want to donate your hard earned dollars to. They all have to file paperwork with the IRS and some of these organizations LIKE THE HSUS just scam people out of millions of dollars with misleading ads and a hidden agenda of stopping all animal 'ownership' or any kind. PETA is even worse.

Look for organizations that call themselves 'Animal Welfare' groups and NOT 'Animal Rights' groups.

Oh! And by the way: double deck trailers have already been outlawed for several years for hauling ANY horses.

You need to seriously get your facts straight before you try to pull a fast one on people that are a lot smarter and better informed than you are.

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Last edited by Cherie; 03-21-2012 at 10:28 AM.
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post #83 of 100 Old 03-21-2012, 12:53 PM
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If one is infavor of banning horse slaughter then the answer isn't in complaining about it but offering viable alternatives. If you can come up with a viable alternative polititicians will listen. It gets them votes.
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post #84 of 100 Old 03-21-2012, 10:38 PM
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I just had an idea. However, I've been a little bit tired lately, so please excuse my ability to transfer my thoughts into words.

Firstly, I think that horse breeding needs to be regulated. I know it might be hard to do, but I think that if it is someone plans it out well enough and has it completely controlled until a system is set, it might just work, because we wouldn't have to slaughter if people weren't irresponsible breeders. Now, I'm not saying we stop breeding all together, but I'm saying that the idiot from the "dumbest horse for sale" ads cannot breed their horse, which is so badly built that it can barely stand, to some random stallion then get tired of the foal and dump it somewhere. Also, I think that they shouldn't allow the person who lives on one acre and can barely afford their dinner, should be allowed to breed their random trail horse. The whole point of breeding is trying to make the horses better.

By the way, I am not pro-slaughter or against it. However, I do believe this, "When we have to kill in order to keep things balanced, then there is something wrong with the foundation."

So, here is my idea. What if while we are trying to regulate breeding, they open up an option for slaughter (to be designed like Temple Grandin's past slaughter architecture) that is run by the government for unwanted horses where people are allowed to surrender their horses to go peacefully. However, the horse meat goes straight to feeding the stray animals in pounds, homeless shelters, developing countries, etc... That way, the meat is going somewhere useful while providing an answer for unwanted horses.

It is just an idea, and it needs a lot of work, but I think it could be a good foundation.
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post #85 of 100 Old 03-22-2012, 01:08 AM
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Originally Posted by Horse4Ever View Post
Also, I think that they shouldn't allow the person who lives on one acre and can barely afford their dinner, should be allowed to breed their random trail horse. The whole point of breeding is trying to make the horses better.
I meant to say:

Also, I think that the person who lives on one acre and can barely afford their own family's dinner, should not be allowed to breed their random trail horse who has nothing to offer to the breed. The whole point of breeding is to make horses better and healthier.

I wasn't lying when I said I was tired ;)

Last edited by Horse4Ever; 03-22-2012 at 01:10 AM.
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post #86 of 100 Old 03-22-2012, 08:10 AM
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How would you regulate breeding though? There are laws on the books already that can't be enforced for a variety of reasons regarding the welfare of dogs/cats. What would be the difference in dealing with horses besides basically taking away people's rights with more laws? (which I am so not for!) Where would the funding come from to enforce these laws? Etc, etc.
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post #87 of 100 Old 03-22-2012, 09:17 AM
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Originally Posted by Horse4Ever View Post
I do believe this, "When we have to kill in order to keep things balanced, then there is something wrong with the foundation."
Nature itself kills in order to keep ecosystems balanced and species in check, so your logic is flawed. Nature isn't some happy place where lions lie down with lambs, and they all eat vegetables.

Everything eats something else, and that something else was alive at some point even if it wasn't sentient.

The problem with expecting irresponsible people to suddenly become responsible is that they just won't do it. So you want more rules and regs in place to bog down and hinder the already responsible people, and which the irresponsible will again ignore.

Instead of predicating a solution on 'what ifs', 'people should', and 'the government needs to' scenarios, anyone against equine slaughter needs to come up with an actual, workable solution based on current laws and regulations, not some pie in the sky ideals about what people SHOULD do.

You want the truth? You can't HANDLE the truth!

Last edited by Speed Racer; 03-22-2012 at 09:20 AM.
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post #88 of 100 Old 03-24-2012, 10:48 AM
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If the plants closed tomorrow, where are 100+ horses going to go that the kill buyers are buying out of every sale? This is just one small sale in this entire country. Multiply that by hundreds of other sales.

The obvious answer here is they will be starved to death, shot by owners and dumped in a ravine (a favorite method in the "hills"), dumped out in the desert to fend for themselves (oh then they die a long painful death), and many other forms of terrible abandonment and disposal that desperate people can think of. I don't see how these options are any better than a slaughterhouse. Those of you arguing against this please do some research on Temple Grandin and her impact on the slaughter industry. It's not always the nightmare you seem to think it is.
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post #89 of 100 Old 03-24-2012, 11:08 AM
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Originally Posted by Horse4Ever View Post
...because we wouldn't have to slaughter if people weren't irresponsible breeders...
Not true. No one breeds FOR slaughter. They always believe there is a market for the horse, or that they will keep the horse.

The problem is that horses live for 25-30 years, sometimes more. The horse someone gets for their 10 year old daughter may live another 20 years, even if their daughter gives up on horses after 2-3 years.

Industry wide, the folks breeding horses in 2002 (horses that are now just 10 years old) did so based on a booming market and expanding economy. There was no way for them to plan based on what happens when the economy goes into the toilet in 2008. But the horses they bred were only 6 years old in 2008, and just starting to hit their useful age. And horses bred in 2002 may well be alive still in 2030 - do you have any idea what the market will be like in 2022? I don't!
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post #90 of 100 Old 03-24-2012, 11:22 AM
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From my local Craigslist ads today: (one backyard breeder's solution to his/her unwanted horse herd) -- this is the reality that is repeated thousands of times across the US. At least this owner "selected" his horses' adoptive family. As earlier posts have said, sometimes it's much worse for the horses that are abandoned in the desert, in the hills, or in the dead of winter where there is nothing for them to eat.

To person who dumped 12 horses in my hay meadow! (Louisburg KS)

Date: 2012-03-23, 10:47PM CDT
Reply to: [Errors when replying to ads?]
Dear whoever this may concern,

I appreciate you dumping your horses on my brome pasture... Atleast they are eating! I also am a horse person but have never dumped off my unwanted horses into an opened gate pasture and apparently peel out going 90 (from what neighbor said) late last night. I appreciate the fact that most look due to have foals and 2 have foals on them. Please next time be kind enough to knock on the door and say "hey I dumped my horses off if you need anything dont call". I really didnt need these horses but apparently somewhere in your mind my pasture looked the best! Glad it looked good to you. Thanks for leaving rutts entering the gate, apparently you dont remember it raining yesterday and the days before that, the gate 1/2 mile up has gravel please us that next time. As for the horses I will take care of them but please next time leave halters on them some were very hard to catch and others just so sweet and act like big dogs. Wasn't expecting the 17 hand leopard appaloosa stallion to be a dog either with the fact he almost killed me when i tried to catch him, but know he calmed down when he realized I was putting him in a stall with hay and grain. Hes actually very sweet! If he or any others have papered please stop by and just hand me the papers on these horses and I will take care of them for you. Also the 15.2 dunskin quarter type mare had a nice grulla filly and the bay framed overo mares foal ( black framed overo) cut his leg pretty bad when you dumped them looks to be deep, just thought you might wanna know, he is being medicated and should heal fine.

Please if you would like to see your horses don't mind coming by as I will have probably found them all nice homes by then. You have taught me the lesson of locking my gates, never thought someone would be so nice to give me more horses...

Thanks and Happy trails, well I seem to have your horses so I don't know how you would have such happy trails so just THANKS!
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