Wild Horse Capture
 
 

       The Horse Forum > Horse Resources > Horse Protection

Wild Horse Capture

This is a discussion on Wild Horse Capture within the Horse Protection forums, part of the Horse Resources category
  • Capturing wild horses in oregon
  • Wild horse elemtary discussion board

 
LinkBack Thread Tools
    10-10-2010, 11:34 PM
  #1
Foal
Exclamation Wild Horse Capture

Hey there everyone!

So this November I will be saying a speech about wild horses at the 4-H nationals in Kentucky. I am in the process of rewriting and am having a whole load of trouble writing my conclusion. In the beginning of the speech I try to give both sides of the wild horse story--I call them pro-capture and pro-freedom--which is basically the information the BLM--Bureau Of Land Management-- gives about what they do with the wild horses and then the accusations pro-freedom activists have against the pro-capture--I used statements from The Cloud Foundation, Humanity Through Education, etc..--. Originally, in my conclusion I was pro-capture. Agreeing with the protocols in the new handbook of using fertility drugs. Though now, I have come to the conclusion that I don't really agree with either side anymore . In my research I have found that the BLM are lacking transparency and the pro-freedom activists do not present evidence in *some* of their accusations and personify the horse. These faults lead me to not trusting either side.

So... give me your opinion!

I want your opinion on the best way to maintain ecological balance while having the wild horses stay on the range. To keep overpopulation and underpopulation from happening and deal with the wild horses in holding pens. Also you may tell me about anything else in this topic you think needs addressing.

I'm hoping that by going to the people and getting their opinion that I will have a better understanding of things and able to figure out my conclusion.

However, this is a POLITE debate thread. I don't want people calling each other names or saying that their opinion is stupid, etc... the point of this is that no matter which side you are on we are figuring out a way *together* to keep the wild horses healthy and in their habitat.

And also to help me write my conclusion
     
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
    10-11-2010, 03:39 AM
  #2
Banned
Great topic, and I am interested in the thoughts posted.

My own opinion is back and forth, it is a nice idea to have wild horses but I don't like the idea of them breeding beyond manageable. But I don't like holding pens either, and with all the horses out there how many of us are going to take a truely wild horse?

It would be a dream world to think that there is enough people out there to fund a gelding system for enough of the horses. So who knows what the answer is? But I am interested to hear thoughts.
     
    10-12-2010, 04:03 AM
  #3
Started
Kudos for doing some research into both sides of the debate! I was dreading that this would be one of the threads in which the OP puts down a be all end all statement about the BLM management being all right or all wrong.

Honestly, I don't think there's a nice neat and pretty answer. It's all very complicated... no one can afford to go all one way or all the other. I do tend to lean towards support of BLM (pro-capture). I know that in Oregon at least, the BLM program is working very hard not only to maintain ideal populations of wild horses but also to promote genetic diversity and desirable traits in the horses. They intentionally choose which amazing studs to leave out on the range to result in flashier and typically more conformationally desirable mustangs... and boy do they come out with some lookers.

For example:


     
    10-12-2010, 11:33 AM
  #4
Yearling
Both sides have good points, my opnion.... less leasing out of federal grazing lands, so more mustangs can be left out in the wild. Capturing some is nessary, but they need to have a better plan on how to handel them after capture. I've seen some pretty skinny horses come out of elm creek
     
    10-12-2010, 12:00 PM
  #5
Showing
I really get tired of the same old 'save the pwetty horsies' arguments from people who have absolutely NO CLUE how things work.

Horses are a nonnative species to North America, which means the feral horses are over grazing and destroying vegetation while the native species starve.

As far as the 'stop the land leasing' argument, that's completely bogus. The cattle ranchers are only allowed to lease that land a few months out of the year, and they're strictly watched and regulated. The land leases are rotated, so no area is allowed to be over grazed by the cattle.

That money the ranchers pay to lease the land helps fund the BLM. So if the leases are canceled, who is going to pick up the slack? The taxpayers? Yeah, just what I want, to be taxed MORE.

Feral horses are a blight on the area. The BLM is ****ed if it does and ****ed if it doesn't. What I think should be done with most of those scrubby, mutt horses is euthanasia or sale to slaughter.

Adopt out the ones who aren't crazy, fugly, and ill conformed, keep a minimal amount of them out on the range to satisfy the people who seem to think feral horses are some sort of American 'symbol', and get rid of the rest.

They'd be great as slaughter horses, since they're untouched by the chemicals we give our domesticated horses. The money the BLM could make on selling them to KBs would help pay to keep the small, managed herds out on the range.

The Cloud Foundation is hardly an unbiased source of research. If you want to do real research, I suggest staying away from the fanatics on both sides of the issue.

And now I'm done with this thread; y'all go ahead and have your hysterical trainwreck.
     
    10-12-2010, 07:22 PM
  #6
Started
Quote:
Originally Posted by Speed Racer    
Feral horses are a blight on the area. The BLM is ****ed if it does and ****ed if it doesn't. What I think should be done with most of those scrubby, mutt horses is euthanasia or sale to slaughter.

...

They'd be great as slaughter horses, since they're untouched by the chemicals we give our domesticated horses.

...

And now I'm done with this thread; y'all go ahead and have your hysterical trainwreck.


I actually laughed. I can see you have a strong viewpoint on this matter. I'm sorry you believe this thread will become a trainwreck. If it does, I daresay it will be mostly in retaliation to what you've said. Congrats for setting us on that course.

Of course, you've got several valid points. I think some of the slaughter comments went a little over the top however. A little hypocritical considering your scorn for the Cloud Foundation and other extremists.
     
    10-13-2010, 10:18 PM
  #7
Foal
Quote:
Originally Posted by Speed Racer    
Horses are a nonnative species to North America, which means the feral horses are over grazing and destroying vegetation while the native species starve.
I actually mention this fact in the pro-capture part of my speech and agree that if we leave the wild horses unchecked they will overbalance the circle of things and harm the native species. In Missouri--where I live--we're having a horrible time with Zebra Mussels and this nonnative frog--whose name I have forgotten--. Both species have no predators and as a symptom are over breeding and killing off the native species of other mussels and frogs. The difference between these species and the wild horse is that people have no problem killing off the mussels or frogs but if you mention open season on horses chances are you're going to have a big hissy fit . Which is, how it should be. Although they are very different animals, I would compare hunting horses the same as going out on the streets and shooting all the stray dogs and cats you come across.

Quote:
What I think should be done with most of those scrubby, mutt horses is euthanasia or sale to slaughter.
Again, I agree with part of your statement. Some of the horses the BLM captures will have to be humanely put down just like what happens with the over population of stray dogs and cat at shelters. *I know I keep comparing horses to dogs and cats but it's the best I could come up with right now*. It is kind of ironic but last years speech was on horse slaughter. I was against horse slaughter. This was because I didn't agree on how to was preformed in the you.S and other foreign plants. If they reopened the plants now but regularized them I believe the whole process would benefit. So as of now, I wouldn't want any horse--wild or domestic--going to slaughter. Also, wild horses are descendants of Iberian horses which include the Portuguese he Lusitano, Sorraia and Garrano breeds and fourteen other Spanish breeds. If you look most horse breed books you will find "Mustang" listed as a breed.

Quote:
As far as the 'stop the land leasing' argument, that's completely bogus. The cattle ranchers are only allowed to lease that land a few months out of the year, and they're strictly watched and regulated. The land leases are rotated, so no area is allowed to be over grazed by the cattle.
This I completely agree with. In fact, I thank you for saying this because I had a hard time finding information on this.

Quote:
That money the ranchers pay to lease the land helps fund the BLM. So if the leases are canceled, who is going to pick up the slack? The taxpayers? Yeah, just what I want, to be taxed MORE.
I don't pay taxes yet but my parents do so again, I agree.

Quote:
Feral horses are a blight on the area. The BLM is ****ed if it does and ****ed if it doesn't.
EXACTLY! The BLM almost seems afraid to me to do anything out in the open in fear of the public's opinion.

Quote:
Adopt out the ones who aren't crazy, fugly, and ill conformed, keep a minimal amount of them out on the range to satisfy the people who seem to think feral horses are some sort of American 'symbol', and get rid of the rest.
As a previous poster pointed out, the feral horses are being selectively breed to keep bad conformation from happening. I think the picture that person posted is evidence enough that Mustangs are not "fugly". Yes, the feral horses taken off the range are wild but with correct training they can be tamed. Just a quick question, what do you think is the American symbol? Horses were a big part of the history of our nation, imagine if they had never been there? Even if you don't see them as an American symbol, what about a rare species? The eagle--which is America's symbol--is a protected species. Even though they are over populated mustangs are a breed of horse that are worth preserving. What is the quarter horse or Morgans where completely wiped out.


Quote:
The Cloud Foundation is hardly an unbiased source of research. If you want to do real research, I suggest staying away from the fanatics on both sides of the issue
. I chose the cloud foundation *because* they were biased. I needed a one sided organization for the pro-freedom part of my speech and as you so pointed out, they are.

Quote:
And now I'm done with this thread; y'all go ahead and have your hysterical trainwreck.
I am loading passengers into the Hysteric Train as I type. We should be ready for complete mental breakdown by tomorrow.


Seriously though, I appreciate everyones reply! I am in the midst of writing my conclusion and hopefully will have it done tonight. Should I post it once I am finished for everyone to read? I wanted to reply to everyone's posts but since I am running out of time I had to pick and choose. Sorry.

Keep on posting!
FireFlies
     
    10-15-2010, 02:34 AM
  #8
Weanling
Quote:
Originally Posted by Speed Racer    
I really get tired of the same old 'save the pwetty horsies' arguments from people who have absolutely NO CLUE how things work.

Horses are a nonnative species to North America, which means the feral horses are over grazing and destroying vegetation while the native species starve.

As far as the 'stop the land leasing' argument, that's completely bogus. The cattle ranchers are only allowed to lease that land a few months out of the year, and they're strictly watched and regulated. The land leases are rotated, so no area is allowed to be over grazed by the cattle.

That money the ranchers pay to lease the land helps fund the BLM. So if the leases are canceled, who is going to pick up the slack? The taxpayers? Yeah, just what I want, to be taxed MORE.

Feral horses are a blight on the area. The BLM is ****ed if it does and ****ed if it doesn't. What I think should be done with most of those scrubby, mutt horses is euthanasia or sale to slaughter.

Adopt out the ones who aren't crazy, fugly, and ill conformed, keep a minimal amount of them out on the range to satisfy the people who seem to think feral horses are some sort of American 'symbol', and get rid of the rest.

They'd be great as slaughter horses, since they're untouched by the chemicals we give our domesticated horses. The money the BLM could make on selling them to KBs would help pay to keep the small, managed herds out on the range.

The Cloud Foundation is hardly an unbiased source of research. If you want to do real research, I suggest staying away from the fanatics on both sides of the issue.

And now I'm done with this thread; y'all go ahead and have your hysterical trainwreck.
**** girl!! And just what is wrong with "mutt" horses? Some "mutt horses" make some of the best horses out there! If I were stranded in the mountains or in the desert or anywhere for that matter, I would way rather be on my mustang than any domesticated horse. Just like mutt dogs are some of the best dogs out there. Theres good & bad ones in every breed, so does that mean you would take the ugly ones of whatever it is you ride & ship them to slaughter? You would probably change your tune if you knew what awesome horses they are.
     
    10-15-2010, 02:46 AM
  #9
Trained
We mentioned it on one of the slaughter threads and SR made me think of it...just throwing it out there and I don't even know if its plausable because of land (tax?) requirements...

But we've talked about breeding for slaughter. Why not do that with the culls of mustangs and then breed for hardier ones like smrobs posted?

As far as my actual opinion of what should be done. Im not sure. Theres no clean and clear answer for me though I do like the idea of thinning the population but keeping around well bred sturdy examples of the breed.


Im tired and I'm rambling. Im sorry.
     
    10-16-2010, 11:34 PM
  #10
Showing
Quote:
Originally Posted by sinsin4635    
**** girl!! And just what is wrong with "mutt" horses? Some "mutt horses" make some of the best horses out there! If I were stranded in the mountains or in the desert or anywhere for that matter, I would way rather be on my mustang than any domesticated horse. Just like mutt dogs are some of the best dogs out there. Theres good & bad ones in every breed, so does that mean you would take the ugly ones of whatever it is you ride & ship them to slaughter? You would probably change your tune if you knew what awesome horses they are.
sinsin, I think you missed the point SR was trying to make. Noone says "mutt" can't be a great horse. I know number of grade horses with nice confo and great mind. I've seen some very nice mustangs trained very well. However BLM facilities are full with mustangs, some with very bad confo, some totally crazy. Reality is not too many people want them - partially because you have to put lots of training (making them rather expensive in the end), partially because they are not good for certain disciplines (not all, but many). Letting them just sit and breed is NOT an answer. And what can happen to those noone is interested in? I bet meat plant.
     

Quick Reply
Please help keep the Horse Forum enjoyable by reporting rude posts.
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the The Horse Forum forums, you must first register.

Already have a Horse Forum account?
Members are allowed only one account per person at the Horse Forum, so if you've made an account here in the past you'll need to continue using that account. Please do not create a new account or you may lose access to the Horse Forum. If you need help recovering your existing account, please Contact Us. We'll be glad to help!

New to the Horse Forum?
Please choose a username you will be satisfied with using for the duration of your membership at the Horse Forum. We do not change members' usernames upon request because that would make it difficult for everyone to keep track of who is who on the forum. For that reason, please do not incorporate your horse's name into your username so that you are not stuck with a username related to a horse you may no longer have some day, or use any other username you may no longer identify with or care for in the future.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.


Old Thread Warning
This thread is more than 90 days old. When a thread is this old, it is often better to start a new thread rather than post to it. However, If you feel you have something of value to add to this particular thread, you can do so by checking the box below before submitting your post.

Thread Tools

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Wild Horse SONG! Eolith Horse Videos 1 09-01-2010 11:42 AM
Horse gone wild! Help!!! Rowkay422 Horse Training 9 05-10-2010 01:38 PM
Wild Horses, Wild Dolphin video Pinto Pony Horse Videos 6 04-14-2010 04:38 AM
Man vs wild and "wild" horse blossom856 Horse Videos 20 10-15-2009 07:36 PM
RPG Wild Horse barnrat Games 21 03-24-2007 05:12 PM



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 09:36 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.6.0