Crit horse - NOT RIDER PLEASE - and where to from here?? - Page 4

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Crit horse - NOT RIDER PLEASE - and where to from here??

This is a discussion on Crit horse - NOT RIDER PLEASE - and where to from here?? within the Horse Riding Critique forums, part of the Riding Horses category

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    08-28-2013, 10:26 PM
As I am not allowed to speak about the rider I will just comment on the horse. The very very Core Basics are missing on the horse. ( they may be there but I can't see them in the pics shown) There first tenant of any type of riding is the horse must be free of tension, relaxed in other words. This horse is not, she is annoyed and fighting the riders locked upper body which includes the shoulders, elbows and wrists. The horse's back is down in most pictures, this means the horse is not engaged over the back and thus not "through". A horse who is not through can not carry, maintain self carriage.
The 2nd tenant of riding is rhythm or tempo. The horse needs to be ble to maintain an even tempo around a 20m circle. This horse can not seem to do so at the trot or the canter, the rhythm is very broken, no 2 strides are the same. It is not fair to ask a horse to do any further work until the first 2 Basic tenants of training are nailed down.
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    08-29-2013, 11:07 AM
Thanks :)

As mentioned she is VERY green! It was an off day for both of us but my view is that off days show us where the holes are and so clearly I need to work on rhythm and relaxation... a lot... in BOTH of us. I believe in allowing the horse to find its own rhythm but that being said I haven't had a horse yet that had good rhythm under me [not even the FEI dressage horse I've been lucky enough to be allowed to ride] so I feel like I am to blame. Well... I can't dance to save myself... wouldn't surprise me! No natural rhythm whatsoever.

I do find she is quite relaxed under saddle on most days BUT she will fight me for about five minutes before she settles down and starts working. Even since I've been working on my hands/upper body, working on relaxing and carrying my hands properly, she's been doing that. I'm not sure whether that means I'm not actually doing what I think I'm doing, or whether she's just an opinionated mare.

Either way I need to get lessons and it would do her a lot of good to have a few training rides under my coach. Unfortunately money gets in the way and I'm not allowed to have her at pony club until the year after next so can't even cash in on the free lessons I'm supposed to get through them! Not on her, and not on my other horse, because my other horse just isn't sound enough for a full day of work.
    08-29-2013, 12:26 PM
Pony- you can not "work on your hands" it is the same as "working on a headset". Everything comes from the core. I could improve your hands 200% by giving 1 longe line lesson because it stabalizes your core. Whoops. I can't address this in this thread, sorry.
    08-29-2013, 06:40 PM
My hand issue definitely does not come from my core :) I understand that normally that is the case but I am extremely strong through my core, to the point where I get told to DISengage it because it's on too strong and my horse can't move properly! My coach, when I can afford lessons, is a horse trainer and competes in Equestrian Australia official dressage on horses she has trained, so I think she knows what she's talking about :)

The coach who first pointed out the hand issue also brought up the core thing, as well as my former severe lack of lower leg stability, as reasons why my hands are a problem, but when I was still riding under him I worked my butt off, worked my core until I couldn't move for two days after a workout, strengthened my lower leg so that now I can jump 3'7" with a strong and steady lower leg, and thus neither is an issue anymore.

However if you want to come to Australia and give me that lesson you're more than welcome to :)

What my issue is, is that I tend to collapse through my ribcage. My sternum comes down and back, and my shoulders roll forward, and my arms and hands end up braced. This is, in me, not a core strength or stability issue, but rather an upper body issue caused by my horrible posture on foot. My shoulders are both stuffed because of my posture, I get bad headaches on a regular basis, and my neck is always tight and sore. It's a physical problem on my account, one which I believe I can fix, but meanwhile, while I'm in the saddle, I need to concentrate on sternum UP and OUT, which then brings my shoulders back, and allows me to carry my hands properly. It IS something I can work on.
    09-01-2013, 02:22 AM
Blue eyed pony-- Your CORE is your upper & lower abdominal, diaphram, oblique abs, intercoastal muscles between the ribs, pertoral muscles, and the deep muscles that stabalize your spine as well as the muscles that allow you to shift your pelvis. If you collapse in your upper body then NO you are not in control of your Core. A Stiff core is not the same as a Strong core. Is Glass Stiff? Is glass Strong? Ok how about woven Silk? Is it stiff? Is it strong? How about woven Nylon like they make Nyla bones out of? Is it stiff? Is it strong? You can NOT be stiff, you must be flexable enough to follow the horse but strong enough to stay stable in the tack. If the motion of the horse is thorwing you around and you stiffen that is Lack of strength. Strength allows you to sit quiet and seemlessly follow the horse.

Darlin, I won't name drop but I am pretty happy to train or show under anyone. My day to day coaches Allways have Horses ( yup, plural) at WEG and the Olympics. They do pretty well. My main cliniction is a member of the German National team but I did most of my formal training in the French State stud. But to each their own. Good luck.
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    09-01-2013, 06:05 AM
I find I only get thrown around in the sitting trot and only ever on certain horses. And "thrown around" is an exaggeration even then. I find my lower leg fails me on my gelding in the sitting trot, but it's easy for me to sit my filly's trot [not that I do it much, she's too green for that, I only ever sit trot on her when I'm on bareback as if I try to post bareback she refuses to trot]. The filly has a MUCH bigger trot than my gelding. Easiest of all was a very fancy dressage horse I was given the incredible opportunity to ride twice just over a year ago... the bigger the trot, the easier I find it to sit to.

I've had bad posture all my life which has caused a spine alignment problem meaning it is incredibly difficult for me to sit up straight. That being said I refuse to let myself use physical problems as an excuse. They can be overcome, to some degree. I will fix this. It will take time, but it will happen.
    09-01-2013, 10:01 AM
Originally Posted by blue eyed pony    
We have a couple of small social hunts here but nothing crazy like you Irish mob!
*cough cough* Another Irish person present!
    09-01-2013, 11:31 AM
Originally Posted by CandyCanes    
*cough cough* Another Irish person present!
Bahahaha, all the world's insane but thee and me, and even thee is questionable XD

I have Scot in me, and you could say my whole family has a rather... unique sense of humour. Including living by and quoting the above gem at any opportunity.
    09-05-2013, 08:56 AM
We were trying a new saddle today and it doesn't quite fit so she wasn't a happy camper. I've noticed that my hands are a bit better [I think?] but please ignore her, she wasn't impressed and when we started filming I had just spent a good twenty minutes fighting with her to go at an acceptable speed.

PLEASE excuse my horrible lower leg swinging about all over the place :/ it's normally better than that, but I normally ride with a slightly shorter stirrup. Being more of a jumping person I'm used to a short stirrup so a saddle like that one that sits me really really long isn't helpful.

I also usually ride in joddy boots and half chaps and find my lower leg is better with them on than those gumboots!

Aaaanyway, the point is the hands, not the lower leg. I know they're not perfect yet but I feel like they're better.

And this one, excuse the quality [was taken with my old phone] - old video of my now-retired showjumper. I know I collapse after the jump [core issue] but I'm sharing it just to show that I do have a decent lower leg with a short stirrup. That fence is about 3'3 or 3'4 high and 4'8 wide, and yes, he did knock it - my fault - we cleared it the first go but didn't get that on film.
    09-08-2013, 04:11 AM
I know that you don't want anyone to really critique your riding too much, but I just wanted to say-- I really think that you should! I bet you could benefit from the input of people on this forum.

And the other thing is: don't worry about disclaimers and defenses. You have nothing to be ashamed of or worried about! Who the heck are all of us on this forum, anyway? ;)

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