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Schooling from today

3K views 20 replies 9 participants last post by  gtmochi 
#1 ·
I got me dad to take a video of my riding from today. I kinda sucked today when it came to jumping but I felt like I was doing pretty good trotting. However, I really need some outside opinions, so if you guys could critique us please that would be awesome! Some background, he is a 6 year old ottb who hates contact and frequently bucks, hollows his back, or throws his head way down to get away from the bit. He is really hard to get into a frame he just fights it. I think we were jumping like 1'3" or 1'6" here, so he was just kinda stepping over it. We haven't been jumping very long. So anywho, please be nice but tell me what I need to work on. Oh and btw I am getting more holes punched in my stirrups cause they are on the shortest one here and I feel like they are too long. Thanks everybody!! :)
 
#4 ·
Thanks Oxer! Yeah I think I was throwing him off balance by leaning on his neck so much. And yeah my hands suck, I have been working on them :/ Question, when do I need to go into to point, when he jumps or before? Thanks again!
 
#6 ·
the way i have learned not to jump ahead is simply by looking up and ahead. when i pick my head up and look beyond the jump, then it makes it impossible for me to anticipate the jump. This in turn allows me to simply follow my horse with my body. a 2 point, especially at this height, should just flow. No ducking, no flopping, no hurling yourself at your horse. Just go with him. hahaha!
 
#8 ·
I will try looking ahead more :) Thanks so much :)


I don't jump, but I can see that you are not very stable, thus your hand problems. I wonder if you should leave jumping for a bit and just work on riding.

Your horse looks really unhappy about the whole affair, and the way he wants to buck upon landing, and runs in a hollow, choppy way of moving suggests that maybe, just maybe, there is some discomfort issue. Could be the saddle is not fitting well. Could be his SacroIlliac joint is "out" . could be nothing. But, whenever a horse buckes at the canter, the first thing to think about is pain.
I don't think he is in any pain, he runs around his pasture all the time. I honestly think his bucking is just disobedience. In that vid I was trying to keep him at a trot but he kept wanting to run off.

And, his aversion to contact should also make you consider having his mouth looked at by a dental vet.
Yeah he needs his teeth floated, I told my dad that a few times but he doesn't seem too enthused about the idea. :/
 
#7 ·
I don't jump, but I can see that you are not very stable, thus your hand problems. I wonder if you should leave jumping for a bit and just work on riding.

Your horse looks really unhappy about the whole affair, and the way he wants to buck upon landing, and runs in a hollow, choppy way of moving suggests that maybe, just maybe, there is some discomfort issue. Could be the saddle is not fitting well. Could be his SacroIlliac joint is "out" . could be nothing. But, whenever a horse buckes at the canter, the first thing to think about is pain.

And, his aversion to contact should also make you consider having his mouth looked at by a dental vet.

Please forgive me if I am telling you things you have already dealt with. But this is what comes to mind. The way the horse moves is very "defensive and protective". This way of moving is hard for a rider to ride; the back is hollow, the step choppy and the horse is rushing out from under the rider.

What do you think about these ideas?
 
#9 ·
Just some advice on his bucking and being a brat: if he indeed is not in pain and is just being disrespectful, I highly suggest the one-rein stop. It would benefit you to make sure your seat is very secure - I actually think your stirrups are too short; you are leaning forward a lot and seem to not be able to wrap your legs around him. Once this is remedied, when he starts to put his head down to buck, or tries to take off on you, slide one hand down your rein (either side, but inside rein is easier) and crank his nose into your boot, pushing him with your outside leg to go into a tight circle until he decides it is no fun. A few times doing this and he might find you mean business.

Just my two cents. Be careful doing this, especially at a trot or canter, as he could lose his balance too much and fall. Also be careful not to slam into his mouth when asking for the circle, just glide into it. Be calm and collected; he will understand that your intent is to show him it is not okay to be so naughty.

Again, be certain he is sound and not acting out in pain.

Cheers,
RSS
Posted via Mobile Device
 
#11 ·
Thanks so much I will definitely try that! He has OCD in his stifle but he doesn't appear lame or sore and vet said that he was okay he just could race so I don't think it is causing him any pain, he is just being a brat.
 
#10 · (Edited)
Okay... I'm not going to comment on the jumping bit since I don't jump :)

What I see is a lot of leaning.. your arms are kind of just.. flopping around or floating and not FOLLOWING his movement. I see him bracing all over and generally being very sour.

I think you need to work on your warm up. Do you have a trainer?

Warm up at the walk, getting him to loosen up. Gentle flexing, bending, circles, and figures (like serpentines, weaving, figure eights, spirals) when he's nice and loose, send him forward and do some leg yields on and off the track. Change direction often. Slowwwwwwwww downnnnnnnnnnn. You're kind of rushing through everything, when he's not really "with you" if you understand what I mean.

It's like you're chasing him when you trot, you were posting very sharply.

So relax.. soften your body, and don't trot until he's together and relaxed and loose at the walk.

As for contact, it's not consistent. It's loose-tight, loose-tight. Release.. JAB.. release.. JAB which isn't very nice on their mouths and also causes them to really dislike contact.

Change your arms. Your elbows can open and close. When you rise, they open up and your hands stay just where you left them.. when you sit, they close, leaving your hands just where you left them.

I can see a lot of things that, if they were smoother.. you'd be a very nice team.

If you don't have a trainer, I highly encourage you to find one. You'll improve in leaps and bounds once you target the things that need fixing.

But I really would work more on your walk before you trot.

And just so you know, I am not saying this is all you. Or your fault.. the horse needs a lot of work too but doing what I have advised would benefit you both as your riding directly affects him, and he directly affects your riding.
 
#13 · (Edited)
Okay... I'm not going to comment on the jumping bit since I don't jump :)

What I see is a lot of leaning.. your arms are kind of just.. flopping around or floating and not FOLLOWING his movement. I see him bracing all over and generally being very sour.
Yes, I notice this too. I will try to follow his movement more :)

I think you need to work on your warm up. Do you have a trainer?

Warm up at the walk, getting him to loosen up. Gentle flexing, bending, circles, and figures (like serpentines, weaving, figure eights, spirals) when he's nice and loose, send him forward and do some leg yields on and off the track. Change direction often. Slowwwwwwwww downnnnnnnnnnn. You're kind of rushing through everything, when he's not really "with you" if you understand what I mean.
No I don't have a trainer. I would like to take lessons but I can't. Thanks for the warm up ideas! My warm up is usually about 10 minutes of walking around. We start by going long and low once in each direction the do some change or reins, then extending on either the long or short sides or the arena, and collecting on the opposite sides, and then do some posting and sitting trot work. Do you have suggestions on teaching leg yields? I have tried this a couple times but I don't think he understands what I am asking.

It's like you're chasing him when you trot, you were posting very sharply.

So relax.. soften your body, and don't trot until he's together and relaxed and loose at the walk.

As for contact, it's not consistent. It's loose-tight, loose-tight. Release.. JAB.. release.. JAB which isn't very nice on their mouths and also causes them to really dislike contact.

Change your arms. Your elbows can open and close. When you rise, they open up and your hands stay just where you left them.. when you sit, they close, leaving your hands just where you left them.

I can see a lot of things that, if they were smoother.. you'd be a very nice team.

If you don't have a trainer, I highly encourage you to find one. You'll improve in leaps and bounds once you target the things that need fixing.

But I really would work more on your walk before you trot.

And just so you know, I am not saying this is all you. Or your fault.. the horse needs a lot of work too but doing what I have advised would benefit you both as your riding directly affects him, and he directly affects your riding.
Thank you for all of your help! I definitely get what you mean and see the mistakes you pointed out. I am really sort of at a plateau right now, I think we will both improve immensely when I can ride him everyday, right now it is only once a week.


After rewatching your video, I would bet he is not only pained in the mouth but pained in the back because you tend to bounce around a lot. My suggestion would be to lose the stirrups for a while and practice riding all three gaits without them. Bareback is even better. When you want to go into two-point, grip with your calves and your thighs. It sounds funny, but when you practice it (at a stand still or walk) it will make sense.

You have a lot of potential, and seem very happy to ride despite the incongruity in communication between yourself and Paradise. Keep up the good work and you two will be stars!

Cheers,
RSS
Posted via Mobile Device


ETA: I meant inside leg for one rein stop. Use your inside leg back behind the girth to move move move those hindquarters. Outside leg at girth will help hold him up a bit, but inside leg pushing that booty is key.
Thank you RSS you have been so very helpful! He is not a fan of riding bareback but I will for sure lose the stirrups and the jumps for a while. Thank you for the compliments, lately I have felt like I am going no where :)
 
#12 · (Edited)
After rewatching your video, I would bet he is not only pained in the mouth but pained in the back because you tend to bounce around a lot. My suggestion would be to lose the stirrups for a while and practice riding all three gaits without them. Bareback is even better. When you want to go into two-point, grip with your calves and your thighs. It sounds funny, but when you practice it (at a stand still or walk) it will make sense.

You have a lot of potential, and seem very happy to ride despite the incongruity in communication between yourself and Paradise. Keep up the good work and you two will be stars!

Cheers,
RSS
Posted via Mobile Device

ETA: I meant inside leg for one rein stop. Use your inside leg back behind the girth to move move move those hindquarters. Outside leg at girth will help hold him up a bit, but inside leg pushing that booty is key.
 
#18 ·
The bucking to me looked like it happened when he was caught on the back and mouth over the fence. He seems like a very sensitive guy who will teach you to ride well. id suggest trot poles ( like four or four and a half feet apart) or canter poles (9 feet) and just hold your 2 point over them to help build your muscles and secure your position.
also, shorten those reins and organize, girl! ride as if you have all the time in the world and dont approach the jump if you feel like he's not listening too you, your reins are too long or you dont have a consistent gait!
overall i think you guys have a lot of potential as a team and you seem like a smart very able rider, you just need to polish up a bit and get your limbs under control :)
 
#19 ·
Why thank you RSS! I appreciate your kind words :)

The bucking to me looked like it happened when he was caught on the back and mouth over the fence. He seems like a very sensitive guy who will teach you to ride well.
I think you are probably right about him being caught in the mouth. He is a pretty sensitive horse.
id suggest trot poles ( like four or four and a half feet apart) or canter poles (9 feet) and just hold your 2 point over them to help build your muscles and secure your position.
Thanks for the tip, I will try that :)
also, shorten those reins and organize, girl! ride as if you have all the time in the world and dont approach the jump if you feel like he's not listening too you, your reins are too long or you dont have a consistent gait!
haha will do ;)
[/QUOTE]overall i think you guys have a lot of potential as a team and you seem like a smart very able rider, you just need to polish up a bit and get your limbs under control :)[/QUOTE]
Thanks so much! I just hope I am not totally ruining the poor horse!
 
#20 ·
I'd suggest lots of transitions, up and down with lots of changes in direction. Trot walk halt back, mix it up.. Figure eights, Cloverleafs, he'll soon figure out that when he yields to your requests, The pressure goes away. I mean like 20 minutes or so of straight up work... Every time youre on. Its old school but it works with the ones that worry and get hot. Goal to get him to relax and listen to you ..And will help your leg/ seat and hands. Concentrate in where you are going and don't change your mind. He'll soon start going where you're looking. At first in vid, he's going pretty well. Seemed like he got agitated when he didn't know where to go, or when you got contact back after the jumps. Btw, Shorter reins when jumping. You have to move your hands a lot to get the contact and sometimes it's quick, so it might hit his mouth. One thing to try that seems counterintuitive... Rubber bit. Not saying it will work for him, but it did for my mare who had the same issues.... (for her, it gave her less to fight, so she stopped fighting.)
 
#21 ·
Hope I am not jumping in too late and that my suggestions have not already been covered by everyone above.

Though I've been riding many years, about half of them were spent without lessons after I stopped showing. As as result, my position went south. My point in telling you is that recently I started with a trainer again, and in many ways it's like starting fresh...so I feel your pain! Some of the reminders I've gotten in lessons have made a huge difference in how Playday (the 4yr old OTT Standardbred I lease) responds, and have helped to put me on the path of being a more effective rider.

When at the trot in your video, it appears that you're 'archy'. Meaning....sticking your toosh and chest out while arching your lower back. By tucking your toosh (think riding on your back pockets) it helps your horse tuck too - plus it's easier on his back. One really helpful visualization (for me, anyway) is to think about the horses's back mirroring yours. If you're archy, so is he! You want him/her reaching under, using their hind end, relaxed. Keeping your own lower back/abdomen relaxed and not pushing backward will help! The other thing I noticed was your posting position. Instead of using your quads to post, (resulting in a more thrusty motion) think about letting Paradise's movement gently propel you out of the saddle. It should be a lower up and down movement instead of hips pushing forward diagonally out of the saddle. Focus on using the muscles on the back and inner leg instead of your quads. Someone mentioned riding without stirrups - this is a great exercise to discover and learn to use those muscles! Another is to post side to side, which helps you loosen up though the hips and find your center better. To do this, start posting in the same rhythm you would if riding normally, then begin getting your right seat bone going across the saddle into the left and vice versa - but don't do way up out of the saddle and over...just over. Another loosening up/finding balance/not using the quads exercise is to post the trot going down down up instead up down up down. This will help you loosen up and relax, practice tucking your tail and find those posting muscles!

I hope the above ideas help you as they've helped me! One other suggestion - don't try to fix everything (ands, feet, leg, back, etc) all at once. Think about improving your position like lifting weights...it's about focusing on one muscle at a time and slowly building strength, until one day you find you can do a ton of reps at a high weight!

That said, I too appreciate your openness to suggestion. When being critiqued in a lesson or otherwise, it can feel as though you are a hot mess! But the truth is, no-one is perfect. We ALL have a lot to learn and improve on, and you and your horse (I can tell Paradise wants to do well for you! To my eye, he is willing, just confused about what you are telling him) do make a nice team which will only get better with practice! Which - once you've moved and get lessons, will be by leaps and bounds :)
 
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