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post #11 of 19 Old 03-13-2011, 01:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Starlite View Post
Could his stifle/mincey gate in the rear be because he is behind the bit?
I don't believe so, there is a real stiffness to the movement that seems to originate from the stifle. Horses can be ridden behind the bit will look similar in that the stride will be short but this guy does not have the freedom of movement from the stifle area that I would like to see.

As for the free jumping, it seems to me like they have pushed him to jump obstacles before he has developed any kind of technique. This has not been helped by the way he is instantly checked/overbalanced upon landing.

Have a look at the way he jumps - there is no clear take off, airborne and landing phase, he jumps almost simultaneously with his front and rear end. What you want to see, is a clear take off - thrust from the foreleg through the centre of the horse so that the front is higher than the rear with the hind legs flexing somewhat, supporting the weight of the horse for the departure.

In the airborne stage the head may drop some, there is some rounding of the topline (i.e. Bascule) which allows the forelegs to be tucked neatly under the chin of the horse.

In the landing stage the front legs should land clearly first and the hind legs should still be well tucked. As the forelegs begin to support weight, the body begins to rotate back to its horizontal form and takes begins to stride as the hind legs land.

Here is a video of nice technique over free jumps, not perfect but you can clearly see each stage, compare the jumping stages of this horse with the one you posted:


Really he should have been free jumped in a chute type set up as in the horse above for such obstacles, doing it on the lunge line is very bad practice, not safe for the horse and not good for his long term health (i.e. In the upper neck/poll area) or his training.

Sorry to be so harsh, don't take it personally! He looks like he *could* be a nice prospect, but there are a few issues that I would want sorted out first.

ETA: I just re watched his video and it isn't as bad as I first thought, plus the jump is pretty small so take the above with a grain of salt

All horses deserve, at least once in their lives, to be loved by a little girl.

Last edited by sarahver; 03-13-2011 at 01:28 PM.
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post #12 of 19 Old 03-13-2011, 02:01 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sarahver View Post
I don't believe so, there is a real stiffness to the movement that seems to originate from the stifle. Horses can be ridden behind the bit will look similar in that the stride will be short but this guy does not have the freedom of movement from the stifle area that I would like to see.

As for the free jumping, it seems to me like they have pushed him to jump obstacles before he has developed any kind of technique. This has not been helped by the way he is instantly checked/overbalanced upon landing.

Have a look at the way he jumps - there is no clear take off, airborne and landing phase, he jumps almost simultaneously with his front and rear end. What you want to see, is a clear take off - thrust from the foreleg through the centre of the horse so that the front is higher than the rear with the hind legs flexing somewhat, supporting the weight of the horse for the departure.

In the airborne stage the head may drop some, there is some rounding of the topline (i.e. Bascule) which allows the forelegs to be tucked neatly under the chin of the horse.

In the landing stage the front legs should land clearly first and the hind legs should still be well tucked. As the forelegs begin to support weight, the body begins to rotate back to its horizontal form and takes begins to stride as the hind legs land.

Here is a video of nice technique over free jumps, not perfect but you can clearly see each stage, compare the jumping stages of this horse with the one you posted:

YouTube - billy

Really he should have been free jumped in a chute type set up as in the horse above for such obstacles, doing it on the lunge line is very bad practice, not safe for the horse and not good for his long term health (i.e. In the upper neck/poll area) or his training.

Sorry to be so harsh, don't take it personally! He looks like he *could* be a nice prospect, but there are a few issues that I would want sorted out first.

ETA: I just re watched his video and it isn't as bad as I first thought, plus the jump is pretty small so take the above with a grain of salt
If you were sitting in front of me, I would hug you. I don't take it personally at ALL. I am SO grateful for your help..everyone Else's too. I am afraid of going this process alone (making this MAJOR purchase). It is remarkable to me how much I don't know (I thought I was pretty knowledgable..)..but I keep learning more and more and I am SO grateful.

And, IDK much about jumping, but the video you posted made me think "HOLY HOPS BATMAN". A very clear difference between my vid and the horse in yours.

“Anything forced and misunderstood can never be beautiful” Xenophon, 380 B.C.

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post #13 of 19 Old 03-13-2011, 08:14 PM
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My absolute pleasure

Hard to say if his jumping style is a result of the way he is being jumped (i.e. On the lunge) which has lead to him using his body incorrectly as he knows his head is going to be pulled inwards or if they have done little else with him over obstacles other than let him throw himself over whichever way he sees fit, or a combination of both. There is also a big difference in the videos because the one I posted is a much higher jump in which case it is easier to distinguish each phase of the jump, I just used it as an example.

He is a lovely looking horse and seems to have a calm disposition to boot, maybe keep your eye on him if you feel like shelling out for a full pre-purchase exam to see what is going on in his hind end. The rest is all a matter of training, or un-training rather

Good luck with your search!

All horses deserve, at least once in their lives, to be loved by a little girl.

Last edited by sarahver; 03-13-2011 at 08:22 PM.
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post #14 of 19 Old 03-13-2011, 09:43 PM
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Starlite, don't feel bad. I took a $2k horse on a trial that had a stifle issue, which cost me $800 to find out in farrier, vets and ultra sound bills to discover the issue. All for a horse I didn't own, nor did I buy.
That $800 lesson, meant that I am pretty quick to see a stifle issue now.

I am glad that you didn't go through the same thing I did.
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post #15 of 19 Old 03-13-2011, 09:48 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlexS View Post
Starlite, don't feel bad. I took a $2k horse on a trial that had a stifle issue, which cost me $800 to find out in farrier, vets and ultra sound bills to discover the issue. All for a horse I didn't own, nor did I buy.
That $800 lesson, meant that I am pretty quick to see a stifle issue now.

I am glad that you didn't go through the same thing I did.
Eesh..I am sorry. :(

“Anything forced and misunderstood can never be beautiful” Xenophon, 380 B.C.

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post #16 of 19 Old 03-13-2011, 10:11 PM
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Don't be, it was my own fault twice over, for trusting a friend.

It's great that you are posting videos here so you can get opinions and hopefully not do what I did.
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post #17 of 19 Old 03-13-2011, 10:29 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlexS View Post
Don't be, it was my own fault twice over, for trusting a friend.

It's great that you are posting videos here so you can get opinions and hopefully not do what I did.
I have this REALLY bad habit: I grew up in Yamhill County Oregon (quarter horse country, Bob Avila's barn when he was still in Oregon was a few miles from my house..) anyways, I see a nice butt on a horse, regardless of breed..and I stop looking at everything else. And their head. A pretty head, and a nice butt..I am sold. And it is scary to say, I have been around horses my entire life. I have just never been taught right from wrong (movement, upright pasterns, downhill, sickle hocked etc). Now as an adult, with several thousand dollars of my hard earned money on the line..I still find myself looking at heads & butts . It is a really really bad habit. But, the good thing is, I have learned SO much by error..for example, the warmblood buckskin mare that I posted was a horse that I was really excited about, until her flaws started getting pointed out I didnt notice any of them. I know I am just rambling, but atleast I am aware of it and I have really learned so much from everyone. I am SO grateful I found this place.

“Anything forced and misunderstood can never be beautiful” Xenophon, 380 B.C.

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post #18 of 19 Old 03-13-2011, 10:53 PM
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I understand, I am so pleased to have found this place too. There is so much knowledge here that would cost you thousands to take along to see a horse.

You can still go for a pretty butt and face though - just post a vid here first :)
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post #19 of 19 Old 03-13-2011, 11:10 PM Thread Starter
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Hehehaha..will do.
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